| Author |
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, July 26, 2023 - 9:15 am 
When the girl version of Baby Jane sang the "Letter to Daddy" song in the actual movie I couldn't tell if it was meant to be good or awful! She sounded so petulant I suppose, and I wasn't sure if that was the joke?! The strange accent of the time didn't help. So anyway with that clip of Better Davis doing it on Andy Williams, again I couldn't tell if we were meant to think she was good or it was one big joke with her making fun of the character. Whether or not, Bette was brave.
Yes, I saw that clip with Bette wanting to kiss ya! I'm not sure if how bizarre(?) she seems to me is a function of the times, or me, or what, but she seems such a, well, ~character~.
Catherine Zeta Jones is just beautiful as Olivia de H. I mean she's beautiful in general, but she sticks out here as the others are more... realistic. Olivia at the time of Lady in a Cage was 48, and believe it or not Catherine Z-J in 2017 would have also been 48! That's 1962 age 48 compared to 2017 age 48 I guess. Like Brad Pitt is nearly 60 now, but Wilford Brimley was only 50 when he played an old man in Cocoon.
I just snuck in the Oscar episode, such a good one! Joan forcing the Sarah Poulson character to let her accept the Oscar if she got it!! Then with the next actress. And they all actually seemed to truly want to sacrifice that for her. And OMG it actually happened, Joan accepted for Anne Bancroft and walked off stage carrying the Oscar  ! And had photos taken with the "other winners"!!! The man tried to talk her out of it saying she was better than that, and she said she wasn't... so tragic.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, July 26, 2023 - 12:31 pm
I decided to continue through and I've watched up to e7, using up my entire morning, but hey I've never been a fan of leaving the house  . I hope to get to e8 this afternoon.
They had a word for it, Hagsploitation??! The last few episodes really do make it clear how used and abused the actresses were, and how canny they had to be to use the situation they were in.
It's looking a bit bad for Joan at the end of e7... not knowing any history on these I'm not sure if she's going to rebound. I feel a lot more empathy for her, even though she actually seems like the most messed up of the two.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Wednesday, July 26, 2023 - 2:02 pm
" I hope to get to e8 this afternoon. "
I knew you could do it! Disciplined TV watching went out of style when streaming was invented. I think binge TV pretty much makes up for our lack of promised flying cars!
Ep 8 is good one....It brings up a couple more over the top movies Joan made after Baby Jane. "Trog" is the name of the one about finding the missing link and the other is "Berserk" with Crawford in high heels on a muddy farm with an axe.
Jon Crawford + thawed out cavemen = "Trog"
Joan Crawford + Axe = "Berserk".
(Who approved that stunt of throwing axes at the audience?)
Btw, the actor who played William Castle (horror B movie producer/director who made Berserk) was a surprise to me...I remembered being surprised in 2017 when I first saw him but of course, I forgot, so it was a rerun surprise for me. 
"I just snuck in the Oscar episode, such a good one! "
That stunt Crawford pulled is a true story. Personally I loved the way the stage for the Oscars was for the presenters and winners to enter stage left and exit stage right (or was it the other way around?)....Anyhow, Joan presents the Oscar and then walks off leaving via the proper direction, which gave her seconds to go back through all the rooms and hallways quickly enough so she could re-enter the stage from the proper side to accept the Oscar for Anne Bancroft. Of course, I've always wondered why a men's room (in use) was part of the back stage path they took from on side of the stage to the other. LOL
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, July 26, 2023 - 4:39 pm
I watched the finale... quite sad at the end! And Joan's life reduced to a two second portrait on the Oscars In Memoriam. Bette's "Joan Crawford is dead. Good." Always the wit regardless of propriety.
Gee, Trog! What an indignity it must have felt for someone like Joan!
I saw John Waters, but I did have to go back and check - I saw his name in the closing credits and wondered who he portrayed. There were quite a few little parts near the end for well known people, Maggie Gyllenhall was Joan's daughter for example. Ryan Murphy must have a lot of respect, or at least pull.
Well I really enjoyed that, which was quite unexpected for me. Thanks for the hard sell!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Thursday, July 27, 2023 - 1:01 am
Yay!
Sometime soon we need to watch that other Ryan Murphy one - "Hollywood" (7eps I believe)...the one with the cute wannabe actors and a casting couch that goes both ways.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, July 27, 2023 - 7:37 am
That one sounds especially good, but for me that would have to be after my England trip, end of August .
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Thursday, July 27, 2023 - 3:33 pm
"but for me that would have to be after my England trip, end of August"
Works for me...
Btw, I don't think Bette doing the Letter to Daddy song on the Andy Williams show was anything more than doing it because her fans want to see it....she wasn't trying to copy that scene of the little girl singing it in her Vaudeville show. I thought Bette just sang it the same way she did when she sang it as an insane adult in Baby Jane's house.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, July 27, 2023 - 5:06 pm
You point out "insane adult," which I think answers my question! Bette was copying Baby Jane (adult) who, because she was insane, was just singing as she did as the girl Baby Jane (which also had a touch of insanity in it!)  .
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, August 03, 2023 - 10:43 am
Awww, Misha has covid. He needs Castiel to come and cure him.
From https://twitter.com/MCFanclub2022/status/1686247433133502464
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Sunday, August 06, 2023 - 7:43 pm
I’m still working my way through the audio commentaries on the dvds, and one of the season 8 ones is when they first entered the Men of Letters bunker.
The whole building, viewed from the outside, was cgi! They did construct the arched doorway with the railings where they parked their car before they found the garage, but the entire cement structure is fake, it was cgi’d onto an embankment under a bridge.
And they said the main floor of the bunker (where we see them most) is meant to be 30 foot underground, and those glass window type things on the back rooms were internal, and there was no outside light. I think we weren’t sure of their intention there, partly because there is a telescope against one wall. They intended there to be lab equipment in those glassed off rooms, but I guess they changed their mind on that, as I don't think we ever saw them.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Monday, August 07, 2023 - 12:43 am
I had figured those "windows" were just "lamp sconce thingys" made to look like windows. It was always obvious that there were no actual windows in that main room in the bunker, because they had to walk down several steps from the street just to enter through the front door and then, just inside the door, were even more steps to walk down into the main room.
It's hard to even imagine that for quite awhile they had no base of operations at all.
So I guess what we saw of the inside was never meant to be connected to the building we saw atop the little grass hill over that entrance. How could it be connected if the entryway was a "set" and the building above was just a bunch of pixels some nerd rearranged to make it appear that building was there?
Was this evidence of science or something more....supernatural? <bwahaha>
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Monday, August 07, 2023 - 8:15 am
Must have been the Trickster messing with us .
Yeah, any scene outside the main entry way was shot on location, but any scene inside, including the entry balcony, was a permanent set on stage. They haven’t mentioned the bedrooms or the room they locked demons in, but I presume they were permanent sets too.
I was surprised how many of the “sets” were actually filmed on location. They said it was basically an “on location” show, with most days spent outside the studio, even for scenes in rooms/buildings. An old hospital was used for anything remotely resembling a hospital/lab/office, and they rented out several houses they just re-decorated each time.
Another thing I was surprised about is all the night driving shots were faked on stage. By that season 8 episode they were doing the commentary on, they said they’d refined and refined the technique to get realistic looking lights, rain, movement etc., outside and it was really hard to believe it wasn’t real. Quite remarkable really.
They also joked about having to reuse extras (actors) because the pool of Vancouver based middle aged male actors, or suitable alluring young female demons was limited, and after 170 (at the time) episodes they’d used them all!
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 11:16 am
Apparently Supernatural is still so popular in the UK it is on the free service from one of the main tv channels. Unfortunately they have adverts (and they are LONG adverts!) but it is there.
Sanfran, I am back, mostly de-jetlagged and de-covided, and wondered if you fancied watching (or re-watching) Hollywood?
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 2:44 pm
"Sanfran, I am back, mostly de-jetlagged and de-covided, and wondered if you fancied watching (or re-watching) Hollywood?"
Welcome back!
Yes. I'd love to....perfect timing, too. Just finished watching a mini-series and was wondering what to start now, considering we're kind of in between "seasons" and the writers strike isn't helping.....so rewatching something that's been on my "wanna see again soon" list is a no-brainer. (And with TV, who needs brains anyhow?)
I suggest an additional movie after we finish this short, 7 episode miniseries. It's called "Scotty and The Secret History of Hollywood (2017)".
The "Hollywood" miniseries was presented as a look at an alternate version of Hollywood, so there are characters created for the miniseries, but there are also characters who existed IRL.
Scotty Bowers was a real guy and he was the subject of a documentary in 2017....and in the miniseries, his character was played by Dylan McDermott. He was quite a character. He died in 2019, 2 years after the documentary was made. He was 96 years old.
This documentary should still be available at HULU, and possibly Netflix or cable's OnDemand as well. I recommend seeing it after seeing the mini-series....I always like seeing the DOC after seeing the miniseries.
"Scotty and The Secret History of Hollywood (2017)"
https://www.hulu.com/movie/scotty-and-the-secret-history-of-hollywood-54dd4035-84ed-4ec0-9254-2396eedb9c83#
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So, should I start watching today?
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 4:01 pm
Yey, yes, start today! Looks like the Scotty movie is available on Pluto TV, so I will be able to see that too .
I will start... now! 
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 4:46 pm
I'm hooked . That Martha from the Americans again!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 4:49 pm
"I will start... now! "
I'll be watching in a bit! Gotta make a sandwich first...haven't eaten all day (which only started when I woke up at 12:30 PM today).
Glad you found the documentary. That old guy was way ahead of his time....he's sorta like a wacky but horny Popeye!
Uh....to stay on topic, it would be fun to watch this with The Boys (no demons allowed).
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 5:10 pm
To be fair, I suspect it would be fun to do anything with the boys  . I am still googling photos or gifs of them when I just need to settle my brain for a bit. At the moment I'm a little obsessed with Misha, it looks like he has chronically dry lips... does the man not have any chapstick?!
His "Roadfood" on PBS started up again today. Last time round I only started watching at episode five or so, so now I can catch up. He's so open. I like him. As you might have guessed.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 5:27 pm
Hey I just started it.
Did you recognize her this time?
Red dress, opened the gate to address all the wannabe actors, played the assistant to Al Molinaro on Feud, and was a regular on The Americans...AKA Martha?
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 6:31 pm
Oops....just realized that you had already recognized "Martha" and I just overlooked your post!
Or...did you just find a time machine to go back in time a few minutes and fix it so you could prank me?
Misa was in a couple of eps of Nip|Tuck that were pretty funny. Bradley Cooper (pre world famous) shared the adult story arc with Mish. Funny boys.
Here's a description of that episode:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1335607/
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 8:52 pm
No, once someone's in my head, like she was from Feud, I remember them for at least... a month ;).
Lol, "adult story arc!" I might have to seek out that episode .
On Hollywood, did I miss the character Darren Criss played, or is he yet to come?
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, August 22, 2023 - 9:52 pm
"No, once someone's in my head, like she was from Feud, I remember them for at least... a month ;)."
Funny that "Martha" plays a similar part (assistant in the movie business) and looks and dresses the same but it's at least a couple of decades between stories of Hollywood and Baby Jane.
How much have you seen of Hollywood? I'm halfway through ep 4. Yep I got on a roll.
I don't think Criss was in ep 1 but I could be wrong. When I binge several eps in a row my focus is a lot more story oriented than episode number oriented. Storylines overlap one another in every ep, unlike episode numbers.
Criss plays a director who's half Philipino...he's not one of the gas station boys or a wannabe actor. He might've been introduced in ep 1, but his story gets into gear after that, IIRC.
With Patti Lapone, Holland Taylor, and Dylan McDermott, and Ryan Murphy's involvement, it feels like a reunion. Waitaminute....was Holland Taylor in any of Murphy's other shows? Or am I just confusing myself because Holland Taylor is the life partner (wife?) of Sarah Paulson?
And Jim Parson's is SO not-Sheldon in this. He is just SO surprisingly bitter and rude and cruel....and that makes him so much more fun to watch when he's not being a whiny nerd! His Dance of the 7 Veils was hysterical!
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, August 23, 2023 - 9:21 am
I saw e1 yesterday, and should get through e2 and 3 (and possibly 4) today.
In that case I don't think Criss was e1, but I will expect him soon. It's surprising how hard to place some of the actors are, when they're out of normal situations/time periods we'd see them in. Even Dylan McDermott, who I instantly recognised as someone, I hadn't named by the end of the episode.
I'm keen to see Jim Parsons! In most of the things I've seen him in he's mostly played himself.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, August 23, 2023 - 12:31 pm
Surprising how topical this is, given recent talk about role representation, with many hiding who they are and others not able to hide, and missing out despite their talent.
Meanwhile the good looking men, who all look the same, get chosen without talent. Took me a while to realise Jack and Roy (now Rock Hudson!) were two different characters.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Wednesday, August 23, 2023 - 1:07 pm
Well, as I said I got on a roll...I wound up watching the whole thing. Well, almost. I saw all 7 eps but I held back on watching the Scotty Bowers Documentary. When you're done with the 7 ep miniseries, I'll watch the DOC when you do.
Bingeing this was great....I saw a whole lot more than I remembered. I didn't realize how much of the show was driven by Henry's (Jim Parsons) actions/attitude. (In my mind he was more of a cameo, but he was a pretty major character!) I also didn't remember it being so involved in the racial/racist issues of the time.
I know the first time I saw this I thought the actor playing Rock Hudson was a bad choice, but this time he seemed perfect. When he was first introduced he gave his name as Roy Fitzgerald. I looked it up and discovered that was the real Rock's real name. When I first saw this I know I didn't realize he was playing Rock Hudson until later. This time, I picked up on it a lot sooner, and I appreciated the character even more.
I can see how this show was deemed an "alternate reality Hollywood"....Rock Hudson was a lot different than I believe he really was. On this show he was kind of a dumb himbo.
However, one part of this fictionalized era that was based on reality was the story of the gas station and the man who ran it. McDermott is the actor portraying Scotty, but in the miniseries, his name was "Ernie".
A lot of stories based on real life leave me wondering what was real and what was pure fiction. A lot of the fiction is obvious on this, but without that documentary I would've thought the whole gas station thing was total fiction, too.
Side Bar:
Btw,there's a new movie out on Netflix or Prime called "Red, White, and Royal Blue" and I LOVED it! It's a love story that appears more like a typical romcom with Julie Roberts than a "gay film". It is great fun. I recommended it to two friends and a sister and they all loved it.
You will, too. I promise.
Well, can't wait for you to get further into into Hollywood. Oh yeah, something I learn and then always forget....but it was mentioned in the show - They refer to the big Hollywood sign as the "Hollywoodland" sign. I had forgotten (again) that I knew that before.
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