| Author |
Message |
Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Thursday, May 04, 2023 - 1:55 pm 
I choose to accept this question.
My answer is that, unfortunately, I have absolutely no idea about Destiel or the writers or Castiel's love for Dean....although I never took Castiel's feelings for Dean to be romantic.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, May 04, 2023 - 2:48 pm
I didn't either. The only time it crossed my mind was that time when Castiel gave up when Dean wouldn't forgive him, and walked out. That struck me as a ~I've done everything I can to fix it and you're not giving me anything so I'm just done~ kind of break up, and more emotional on Castiel's part than I expected given what I thought of as their relationship... but on the other hand it didn't have to be a romantic relationship for that to be his feelings and it was pretty trying times (to say the least), where emotions were heightened.
But I didn't think that was his meaning at all, in Castiel's final scene. Just that he completely loved him.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Thursday, May 04, 2023 - 6:49 pm
"But I didn't think that was his meaning at all, in Castiel's final scene. Just that he completely loved him."
Yes, I think in his final scene Cas finally understood the boys always putting one another ahead of themselves and always being willing to die to save the other. But this time, for Cas, it wasn't just an intellectual understanding of the concept, it was what he truly felt in his heart.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, May 04, 2023 - 9:11 pm
Yes! That's it exactly, he actually understood the depth of their love, and felt it too. Which made him totally happy, which meant the Empty pulled him back as part of their bargain.
I've forgotten what Bobby said about Cas, when Dean met him in heaven, but I like to think Cas is out of the Empty and doing what angels are meant to do ;) and is helping Jack.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Saturday, May 06, 2023 - 2:17 pm
Sanfran, you could pop down to the SFO Hyatt for the Supernatural Convention in July if you wanted to!
https://www.creationent.com/cal/supernatural_sf.htm
You might have to win the lottery first though, $199 for a photo with Jared (Jensen is sold out), but Alexander Calvert is a steal at $70. $119 for Misha's signature on Saturday, but on Sunday he'll do photos as Castiel, for charity, for $169.
Gold and Silver Weekend Passes are all sold out, as are the weekend General Admission, but you could still get the Copper Pass for $489!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Saturday, May 06, 2023 - 3:46 pm
There's only one thing in my way of going to that....I don't the dollar to buy that lottery ticket. 
Besides. I already have a photo with a movie Star - Marilyn Chambers!  And I have a video of me getting Dame Edna Everage (R.I.P.) to wish all my friends a merry Xmas in 1993.
I wonder how much dough the Boys rake in at one of those conferences...
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Saturday, May 06, 2023 - 3:52 pm
I should have added...probably best not to go anyhow. You know if you meet up with a Winchester, a demon won't be far away...
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Saturday, May 06, 2023 - 5:26 pm
Did you see that Dame Edna wrote an obituary for Barry Humphries? Funny
https://boingboing.net/2023/04/27/dame-ednas-self-penned-obituary-pokes-at-would-be-comedian-barry-humphries.html
I wonder if they get a flat rate or a percentage of the photo/autograph profit. Or both, probably. I hope the lesser known stars (like the one who played Henry Winchester once, maybe twice!) don't feel too bad about how little they get for theirs. Still, better than nothing, and if you like being adored, you must get quite a bit of that .
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Monday, May 08, 2023 - 12:23 am
I’ve been watching some Walkers. I quite like them, so far the story of the week is easy to follow and the family bits are sweet.
Anyway, they showed a close up of the contacts list on his phone and he had an entry for Winchester Auto on it .
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Monday, May 08, 2023 - 10:09 pm
"I quite like them, so far the story of the week is easy to follow and the family bits are sweet. "
That's probably why I couldn't get into it....too much sweet and not enough chopping off heads!
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, May 09, 2023 - 12:01 pm
Yeah, it needs a few more bright eyed demons too .
I just rewatched the Castiel bit of s15e18 and all of e19. Couldn't face watching e20 again. But I was so amped up and emotional the first time round I'm really glad I did. I'd missed a few things and was a little confused over when/whether Michael helped Chuck, and a rewatch straightened it out.
Gave me a chance to take in more of what Cas was saying (sobbing really can restrict your ability to hear) and he did say that he didn't know what true happiness was for him, as the one thing he truly wanted was something he knew he couldn't have. That happiness isn't in the having, it's in the being. Which I think I do now take to be as lovers. Or at least living a blissful life with Dean. Whatever form that takes. I don't know that it makes much difference when you accept someone completely. But anyway I now see why there was such discussion about the scene.
And e19 was quite a remarkable series ending, story wrap up, especially as it wasn't actually the finale, as that was e20. Still glad they did e20 because it just needed to happen. Heartbreaking as it was. Definitely don't think I'll be watching that again for a long long while. 
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, May 09, 2023 - 1:31 pm
"That happiness isn't in the having, it's in the being. Which I think I do now take to be as lovers. Or at least living a blissful life with Dean. Whatever form that takes."
I still don't see Cas having a romantic thing for him, but if Cas feels happiness with/about Dean, I'd just call it "unconditional love" for Dean. Cas discovered he was loved by the boys as much as he loved them and that he was now part of their family....unconditionally.
Are fans shipping them now?
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, May 09, 2023 - 1:54 pm
Yes, I think "unconditional love" covers it for me too. It could include romance but I think it's just complete, encompassing.
Oh there is so much shipping!! "Destiel" was a thing from the beginning it seems, and hasn't slowed down. Some of the youtubes I've watched have had convention parts in them and it's clear from the audience awwws and other noises that they are just dying for them to express their affection towards each other, now as Micha and Jensen, not just as Castiel and Dean. Must be such a surreal experience for them, must be difficult to act authentically as two guys who do have a lot of affection for each other but would almost have to over-analyse everything they say or do relating to it, because of the instant feedback.
There's also a lot of chat and fear from them about "gay baiting." I didn't know what that was, but it seems to be showing straight characters having a connection that toys with the idea that it could ever become anything more, and is never resolved. Done intentionally to keep people hanging. Seems like Micha (who btw just seems an amazingly lovely person all round) is particularly sensitive about that and didn't want to do anything with Castiel and Dean that could be construed that way, while at the same time coming to believe that Castiel's feelings towards Dean were more than just brotherly or best friends.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, May 09, 2023 - 3:31 pm
"Yes, I think "unconditional love" covers it for me too. It could include romance but I think it's just complete, encompassing."
If it includes romance, then it's:
Unconditional Love...with Benefits!
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, May 09, 2023 - 4:33 pm
Ha, yes, you have a satisfying way of getting to the point when I can't quite explain myself in the delicate way I am trying to . I don't know if Castiel needed or wanted any benefits but I'm sure he wanted everything else.
Btw, Jared's Walker was renewed for Season 4. I'm happy for him, as it seems to allow him to have the more balanced work/home life he missed during Supe.
No word on The Winchesters yet, but I think that will come soon.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, May 11, 2023 - 1:45 pm
They cancelled The Winchesters.
Seems like there was a somewhat rabid following of people who really wanted it to continue, as I saw #RenewTheWinchesters trending quite a few times these last few days.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Friday, May 12, 2023 - 12:15 pm
I'm fine with that. I'd have likely watched it, hoping against hope that it would do a 180 and find some heart and laughter. Now I don't have to bother trying to like a show just because I liked it's parents.
They say the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, but TW's apple fell off the tree and rolled down a big hill where a gust of wind blew it off a cliff and into a river that carried it all the way to ocean and then the tide took it out past the breakers where it caught a current that took it to the middle of the Pacific where it finally stopped and bored itself to death.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Friday, May 12, 2023 - 2:23 pm
So you weren't a fan?
I'd have watched it too. They are shopping it around, but it was something like 7th position in the CW ratings for dramas, and the CW is a network practically made for it. Plus there's the writers' strike complication.
As HBO Max has S1, maybe they (or "Max" as they're soon to be called) will pick up another short season. Might be kinder to let the actors move on and try their hands at something else.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Friday, May 12, 2023 - 6:25 pm
"So you weren't a fan? :-)"
I really wanted to be a fan! But it turned out to be like if they did a prequel of Ted Lasso only he was a mean drunk that beat up on his girlfriend and it was very serious and had no heart or goofy jokes. TW forgot that "heart" was the glue that held the whole Supernatural universe together. TW was glueless. (and clueless, too I suppose)
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Friday, May 12, 2023 - 11:06 pm
It makes you realise what it takes to get a show that works, what combination of special things need to happen. They had Jensen who knew Supe back to front, really seemed to understand the heart and the emotion of it, plus a lot of the MOTW shows actually did seem pretty much standard Supe episodes, but either the writing or the acting or both or something couldn't pull it off, and Jensen, and the others were too close to see it.
Bit of a shame Jensen is out of a job on that, and on Big Sky (also cancelled today) at the same time. I can't remember if Soldier Boy was killed, I watched the Boys but it's all a bit much for me. Haven't heard that a new season is filming.
Well, about two weeks out from the Supe finale and I can now think about Sam at the end, or Dean in the box under the ocean and Sam on land knowing he's there without any tears. Mostly. It really messed me up for a bit!! Didn't help that it was such a (very welcome) distraction from everything else I should be doing, and when it ended reality came flooding back, but I guess I'm okay now.
I have watched quite a few youtubes of convention bits and other related stuff. I've found Jared and Misha both very fascinating. At a convention, someone asked whether Misha preferred acting off of Jensen of Jared, and he replied that it's like asking whether you'd rather ride a horse or a tasmanian devil. Jared is so... twitchy! I love watching him. I see a lot of comments online about his "bad acting" but I don't think he's acting at all, the weird facial expressions and twitches are just him. And at the same time he's so wholesome! I'm working my way through Walker and the episode I saw tonight had him dancing with his daughter in the show, who must be 16 or so, and he held her close and danced(ish) just like she was his own. Like he loved her and they were completely comfortable with each other. Can't imagine that's easy for most teenage daughter-father acting pairs after only 10 episodes. But he was totally believable and I have to think that again that's Jared, not acting, and that's what also allowed the daughter to trust him enough to feel comfortable too. Oh so wholesome. And no demons  .
Misha's another interesting one. Last year or 2021 he did a food show called Roadfood for PBS. I've seen clips but no full episode yet, but a couple air on Monday that I'm going to tape. When he was young they were homeless off and on, and they just used to go and live in the woods for a bit, and the things he remembers most of all are the things his mother cooked for him. Hence the food show. Episode 3 he's near where his mum lives, and she brings him a cake for his birthday and instead of a pineapple upsidedown cake (his favourite) she brings a tomato upsidedown cake.  He says it's the worst cake he's ever eaten, but I'd like to see that episode, just to see their dynamic.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, May 17, 2023 - 10:55 am
When the Walker show wanted a flashback of Walker as a marine in his 20s (I think Jared P is now 42) they used...
this little guy (young Sam)!
He is now 25ish and looks like this
(both photos from the Walker Wiki https://twitter.com/TheWalkerWiki/status/1580710850306138112)
Not quite Jared around the jaw, but not bad!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Wednesday, May 17, 2023 - 11:44 am
I can see a little of Jarod in his face. Hmmmmm....I wonder if he has black eyes...from his mom?
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Wednesday, May 17, 2023 - 1:59 pm
In Walker it's his wife who has the black eyes (she's played by Genevieve Padalacki, who's Ruby). I'm waiting for Walker's children to turn demonic but so far they're exceeding adorable.
The actor in Walker (picture 2) is the same boy (picture 1) who played Young Sam Winchester in Supe, not Jared's (and Demon Ruby's) actual son, in case that wasn't clear. Looks like he's been in a few things (including the Captain Marvel movie) but only small roles.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Saturday, May 20, 2023 - 1:18 pm
"The actor in Walker (picture 2) is the same boy (picture 1) who played Young Sam Winchester in Supe, not Jared's (and Demon Ruby's) actual son, in case that wasn't clear."
I just looked at the kid's face and ignored his age!
Ya know, I miss this show, but when you have a great and entertaining show like Supe and then do a spinoff and try replicate the magic that made it so great, it rarely works. It does work once in awhile, but not this time.
I guess I'm just happy to think of it as a favorite....and maybe I'll rewatch it again when I'm 90!
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Saturday, May 20, 2023 - 4:16 pm
I think it's probably not replicable(? repeatable?) for me. The only other show I remember having such a strong reaction to was QAF, 20 years ago. To me, Supe was the relationship between Sam and Dean, with a few others thrown in, and the problems they face in that universe. It can't be replaced by a show that's focused in the opposite direction, one in that universe without Sam and Dean, it would always be poor in comparison (and with the Winchesters, particularly poor). Even that one Supe episode/pilot for the show with the female characters, as a series it might have been good to watch because of the familiarity, but it wouldn't have had the intensity of Supe.
I miss it too. The show, talking about it, and also the characters themselves. I miss Sam and Dean and Castiel a lot like missing friends. I'm getting over it, am mostly over it now, and can just ~think of it fondly~, lol, but it was quite a wrench for me. I think I will watch again quite soon, not immediately, but in a couple of years, and will get as into it again.
I did watch s1e1 again to see baby Sam and Dean. Sam is so much more together in many ways then, without the facial twitches and not as lollopy. Dean is a bit weird in e1, very Dean and also kind of like a charicature of Dean. Dean especially seemed so much younger.
It's a shame we finished while there don't seem to be too many good shows on tv. I've been watching The Night Agent and Junior Bake Off (the latter's probably not your thing ;)) which have been very good, but not like you have to see the next episode. I'm enjoying Walker a lot (not just because of Jared ;)). A few others I've tried have been okay at best. I haven't even been able to find a good substitute for Gilmore Girls, which I finished around the same time. I'm trying Gossip Girl, but the characters are a bit too b_y for my taste, so I'm still looking for something a bit gentler.
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