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Sugar
Member
08-15-2000
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 5:11 pm 
I think the pregnancy test was the storyline with her mean boyfriend and she had an abortion while Rebecca was out of town.
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Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 5:35 pm
I saw that, Sugar. Randall thinks he should be taking care of his mom. But Rebecca knows that Kate will follow her wishes, while Randall would probably do whatever he thinks is "best" (like when he wanted to send her away to the clinic).
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 5:57 pm
Yes (re the pregnancy test) it was kind of unsaid, but as things are usually spelled out for us it felt unfinished.
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Sugar
Member
08-15-2000
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 6:11 pm
I was pleased to see, albeit far too briefly, Kate's neighbor Gregory (Timothy Omundson). I would much rather see a storyline with him than Deja and all her nonsense.
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Pamy
Member
01-01-2002
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 7:40 pm
Sugar, me too and I thought Kate would end up with him. I think that would be more interesting than her with the teacher.
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 8:18 pm
I agree about the neighbor.
Kate and Toby both have a problem. Neither one respects the other's desires and interests. It's just sad to watch.
One of my biggest issues with the current storyline though is they have made the teacher (Kate's future husband) appear arrogant and unlikable. Why do so many dramas seem to like the trope of making a character appear nasty and then have the other character fall in love with them? At this point, I don't like him so it's hard to cheer for Kate as well.
I also didn't like the way that they had Kate imagining the old Toby. It's not like they showed Toby imagining the old Kate. Why didn't they show that as well?
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Thursday, March 24, 2022 - 11:07 pm
Yes! I've said for awhile that Kate should have ended up with the neighbor!! Not with her boss.
Kate and Toby have each changed and went in different directions. She is now fulfilled doing a meaningful job that incorporates her musical talents and desires with helping challenged kids blossom, as well as helping Jack to blossom. And amazing to her, this is valued by others.
Toby has the same explanation, but I sensed a lot of posturing and ego stroking more than actual value and that sort of job is one that leads you to allow yourself to be sucked dry and be available all the time. Not family friendly unless you have a stay at home spouse who is happy as long as you bring home the big bucks.
And San Francisco is hardly family friendly price wise these days. That house on that steep hill didn't look like a great choice for having kids there, especially one with such limited vision.
And the whole thing about Toby just not telling Kate that he could have had the job in L.A. (and there was no rule that he couldn't have moved up in that job or used that position to move on to something even better.. it isn't like there are no tech jobs in Los Angeles, where they already own a home. And the boss casually assuming that Kate knew about that job offer tells me that the boss isn't really in tune with Toby's situation.
His excitement over Kate coming up for a weekend was really about how he would trap her into going with his plan, not actually wanting to be with her so much.
And yes, Kate seemed to have made up her mind that it was over when she made her phone call asking to be considered for the higher position, and not telling Toby that we know of, that is kind of lashing back, but also is planning to have more income in the future, I would think.
I had forgotten about the flash forward about the grill... that probably is the final straw or given as the final reason.
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Legalboxer
Member
11-17-2003
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 3:35 am
My first thought when kate called about the job position was planning for a better income to support herself and Jack in the future - did not think about it being a lashing back at all - just that she had made the decision that this is over with Toby.
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Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 10:45 am
I think it was both, Legal. Toby didn't consult her about his job offer, so she didn't consult him about taking a better job in LA either.
When they were looking at that house in SF, I was thinking a house like that would probably sell for several million dollars. SF is a VERY expensive place to live. That's why a lot of people live across the GG Bridge in Marin (which is also beautiful). And when Toby was telling Kate, "Over to the right is Koit Tower and behind those hills is the GG Bridge," I was all, "No, it's not." I lived in Marin for 15 years and spent a lot of time in SF. I would only live there if I were rich and could afford to have a driver (parking is impossible).
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 12:21 pm
Let’s just say that Toby must be extremely well paid to be able to afford that kind of purchase. Although Kate’s job is clearly fulfilling and important, she can’t be making much money.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 2:28 pm
I think it was either one on Broderick Street or nearby in Cow Hollow. This very similar one sold for $4.6 million back in 2020.
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2833-Broderick-St-San-Francisco-CA-94123/111923634_zpid/
I think he might be somewhat overextended...
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 2:34 pm
I'm one of the last people to think that money should be a big priority. However, if we take the show at face value, as Kitt indicated, it means that Toby is making a fortune in his current job. That has to be a factor in their life decisions. Just being real about it.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 3:33 pm
Remember he was also factoring in the sale of the LA house into the purchase of the SF house, which would also be an expensive property. My guess is that they would only probably increase their house payment with the new house based on the net difference in the selling prices. If he was making substantial salary, as was indicated, they could’ve afforded it.
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 3:37 pm
Agreed but it still means that Toby is making a fortune.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 3:39 pm
Oh yeah. That’s a given.
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Strategist
Member
07-01-2014
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 3:44 pm
Why should Kate live with someone who is clearly expecting her to give up everything to cater to his dreams without any regard for her?
Toby can pay child support while Kate lives a happy and fulfilled life. She can certainly raise two beautiful children on her own. He can continue to go to his fancy parties, make great money, be "adored" by his co-workers, and visit his children when he has time off. That is what real life looks like for many people these days.
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 5:29 pm
Okay but in fairness to Toby they made it obvious that he adores Kate. Everyone at that party knew who she was and Toby had told them all about her and was proud of her. She wasn’t ignored. She was loved.
Kate isn’t giving up everything. There are lots of blind children in San Francisco that would benefit greatly from her help.
Yes Toby could be better. We all could be better. It’s just sad to strive to be better and fail for the people you love. That’s why I feel sad for both Kate and Toby.
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Snoopsmom
Member
02-18-2003
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 5:53 pm
I dislike this whole Kate/Toby storyline. Find it contrived and feel the producers and writers were grappling with a storyline for these characters.
Many people in the real world have to live similar lifestyles for the sake of supporting a family and make it work. Think of people in the military, firefighters who spend round the clock shifts at firehouses, long haul truckers, people in the medical field working opposite shifts from their partners.
We went from the early seasons of wondering what Toby and Kate did to make a living to now having Toby a high powered and paid tech guy that has to easily be earning a 7 figure salary.
I ended up sympathizing with Kate after watching this episode and also wanted to hear a number he was offered for the LA job. Find it hard to believe it was low enough that the salary difference wouldn't have been offset by the savings of having a mortgage in LA, plus the cost of a pricey apartment in SF along with the flying back and forth every weekend. Not being told he had a job offer that would have kept the family together, made it possible for Kate to keep her job and be near her ailing mother would have been the last straw for me.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 6:39 pm
Isn't Toby working for a start-up? I'm pretty sure that's what they said. If this were real (which it isn't of course) he is likely to have a salary that would be less than the industry standard for his work, because the idea of start-ups, even well funded ones, is that you get all your money - years later when your company gets sold - from the stocks you're granted for peanuts when you join. So I'd be surprised if Toby (in the real world) would be getting more than $200K salary. Probably plus lots of perks, but nothing that would realistically make him able to afford a $4M (or $3M maybe if he has capital) mortgage.
Not that that's really relevant, as Chandler and Joey rented that NY apartment... tv is not real life.
My view on the relationship is that Kate is the practical one and Toby is the impractical one. They tried a long distance relationship in great part because of Toby's need for control, his ego, as well of course because of his want to provide for his family. It didn't work, again in great part due to Toby's insecurities, so they have to either split up and live as best they can managing a split family life, or find a way to make it work together. Kate didn't want to live Toby's new life, and Toby didn't want to live Kate's current life (his old life). Unless that changes they are better off finding a new life apart.
I liked the end with Kate. Two things, she climbed the hill when Toby had assumed she couldn't, and she took the job she wanted, something that would give her joy and help support her life with the children. Seems to me that whole scene was symbolic of her realizing she didn't need Toby, and not just that she *could* manage without him, she could have a *fulfilling* life without him too. Yey Kate.
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Mameblanche
Member
08-24-2002
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 7:17 pm
Wish I could cosign your post Kitt. Agree with your assessment completely.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 7:18 pm
But a fortune that takes his family away from extended family is worth what? It is pretty clear that even on this weekend supposedly for him to be with Kate, he was constantly taking calls and being important, also dealing with clients many time zones away, so it would seem that Kate would be pulled away from her brother (when he is in LA) and her mom and Miguel and her friend Madison, who happens to be mother to her niece and nephew who are cousins to her two kids. Toby's job doesn't look very family supportive, and neither does that neighborhood/house on a hill.
Still, Kate went up there with the idea of seeing if they could reconnect as a couple and instead he had scheduled a campaign to show her how successful and popular he was and what he could pay for, including expensive dinners. (It almost felt like when the company I worked for wanted to move our operation from So Cal to Irving Texas and they flew groups of us out, hotel, dinners, video from the governor, line dancing lessons and tours with agents showing various homes, also promises to buy homes here (lol, that was when the market was down, today people are clamoring to buy homes here, especially before interest rates go up), and all very pushy as to how wonderful it would be there and all.. but that meant relocation away from everything here. A few were actually ready to go, but then they sent and email saying, oops, we are not moving.)
So Kate got a sales pitch. She fought back and asked to just hang out, but that really isn't where Toby is anymore, so he still just had to take that call and kind of forgot that oops, his boss knew about the other job offer and assumed that Kate also knew and agreed. So his portrayal of Kate and the kids was kind of false, as has been his recent relationship with all three. But he is the hero for all those flights home because he HAD to work 500 miles away (Oh, but that wasn't true!! Hmm. So he CHOSE to work 500 miles away)
If Kate gets the new job that probably pays better than her old job, but this really isn't about the money but about their relationship and family.
He can keep that job make a fortune (or collect stock options, as Kitt pointed out) and still pay for a fancy school if that is what is needed.
I wish I liked the guy Kate seems to end up with more.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 7:25 pm
Several posts could use a LIKE button!!
Yes, Kate walked up that hill!
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 7:44 pm
Unless that changes they are better off finding a new life apart.
But not better for their children. JMO.
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 9:55 pm
I think so as well.
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Juju2bigdog
Member
10-27-2000
| Friday, March 25, 2022 - 10:12 pm
I was guessing that house at around $5 million as well.
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