| Author |
Message |
Grooch
Member
06-16-2006
| Sunday, August 18, 2024 - 6:20 pm 
Naja, I'm so sorry too. And poor Patsy! Well, the owners will be there in a few hours, they can take the dogs to the vet. Naja has been traumatized enough for one day.
When I was in college, my friends mother adopted a small dog. The poor thing was terrified of hair brushes and would go completely bonkers and attack them like what the pit bull did to the rake. You couldn't let the dog ever see one. The vet had said that the dog was probably beaten with one by the previous owner, or some other horrible thing.
I wonder if the pit bull ever had a traumatic incident with a rake.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Sunday, August 18, 2024 - 7:12 pm
I think the pit bulls owner should find a new dog sitter. It’s only a matter of time that something worse happens.
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Juju2bigdog
Member
10-26-2000
| Sunday, August 18, 2024 - 10:05 pm
((((Naja, Patsy, and Dolly))))
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-06-2000
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 2:41 am
What a scary situation, Naja, and poor Patsy!
Something was triggered by the rake, which you couldn't anticipate.
I tend to worry about dogs being allowed, even encouraged, to "kill" and destroy toys, but I see it a lot, especially with pits and pit mixes, and mouthy growly play.
Still wondering what the rake meant to Max.. The sound it made, the motion, the shape.. Maybe the pits owners will have an idea, or this may give them something to avoid. It is really sad for all the dogs and people.
I hope everyone heals up ok.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 7:49 am
RN Next week we are going to try just Naveen coming over for daycare and see how he does without Max.
I told the owner last night when she picked them up that I think Naveen would be a much happier dog living someplace without Max. I hope she wasn't offended. I think both dogs would be happier.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 7:51 am
RN OH, ends up she knows about this rake/broom aggression with Max but never said anything.
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Scooterrific
Member
07-07-2005
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 8:11 am
RN that would have been nice to know ahead of time.
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Grooch
Member
06-16-2006
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 8:21 am
Max has a broom problem and she said NOTHING?!?
Not saying anything about the rake is bad enough. What are the chances you'd be raking? But everyone has a broom and uses it at some point.
Naja, just be careful. You've already had one bad incident in your house. If you have a second one with the same dogs (I know Naveen didn't start it, but she's part and parcel) and if somebody wants to sue, Your homeowners insurance probably won't pay.
I hope the owner told you about any other problems these dogs might have.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 8:56 am
Naja, did she say if Max and Naveen had ever had an altercation before that reached this level? All the data shows that once this happens it will happen again and again, and escalate in fierceness and damage.
I think you are right to tell her that the 2 dogs, having had this fight, should be maintained separately, even if they live in the same home. The next fight will be worse, and someone could die.  Plus, if you have to break it up, you could get attacked as well.
And if you have both dogs in your home, you'll have to keep them separately, for their safety and the safety of all the dogs in your home.
I belong to several trainer groups on Facebook, and they are unanimous in this regard. Once this kind of fight has happened, the dogs should absolutely NOT be allowed together for a minimum of a week, and then slow re-introductions with an trainer experienced in dog-dog aggression.
Unfortunately, it is incredibly difficult to rehome pits these days.. and when you are looking for an only dog home, it becomes almost impossible.
The saddest kind of post that I see on these trainer Facebook pages is people who said they kept allowing their dogs together even tho they had "minor" scuffles over time (all while proclaiming they "get along fine most of the time"), and then they come in and ask if they have to euthanize the remaining dog for having killed the other.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 9:11 am
What Kar says. Once it happens, it will happen again and again. This was your warning. If a tenant or another dog gets injured, you are getting sued and won’t have any recourse because they attacked once before in your house. I wouldn’t have them in my home ever again.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-06-2000
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 12:23 pm
I agree that this is a serious situation, and you are not out of line for suggesting that this pair should be separated.
Did she adopt them as adults? Separately or together?
It just seems like she had a problem she couldn't handle, and expected you to make it better, without even giving you full details.
And that isn't a good thing to add to a daycare situation.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 1:06 pm
RN Max, the scarier one, was adopted years ago as a puppy. He is 7 yrs 3 mos old. Naveen they rescued last summer and he is just over 2 yrs old.
She said they were great together the first few months, then Max started getting in fights with Naveen. So it's been going on awhile.
At my house lately, Naveen could be by himself on the other side of the room having fun with a ball, and Max will charge him and make him stop playing. If I don't put Max's food bowl up right away and Naveen just walks past it, Max will get in a fight with Naveen. Max just always has his eye on Naveen and is only happy if Naveen is sitting totally still. Otherwise, Max is nervous about what he's doing. Anything and everything.
Max is horrible about storms, He will stay in my closet and not come out for hours. I found out he does this at home, too. He's also afraid of any strange sounds.
Naveen and my Dolly play all day. They love each other so much. Naveen plays and shares with everyone. Max plays, but not for long. He prefers playing with people. He absolutely won't share a toy so I have to actually hide the toys he likes when he's here.
About having Naveen come alone to daycare. This isn't some kind of solution. We are just seeing what Naveen's behavior is away Max.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Monday, August 19, 2024 - 1:28 pm
So it makes me mad that this has been going for a long time with the owner and she still lets them be together and lets Max intimidate and attack Naveen. That is irresponsible, and as I mentioned above, often leads to one dog dying and one dog being euthanized. Those dogs should be separated AT ALL TIMES.
She absolutely needs a behavioral veterinarian to evaluate Max and see if medications will help his fearfulness and reactivity. He deserves the right interventions.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-06-2000
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 1:50 am
I feel sorry for both dogs.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 5:54 am
RN This is the first time she didn't tip me and she usually tips 50 or 60 bucks. Probably because I was honest in the review. I did check the box that her dog bit another dog since it was my dog that got bit.
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Mameblanche
Member
08-24-2002
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 12:35 pm
How is Patsy? The whole event sounds utterly terrifying. And I'm scared to death of pitbulls to begin with. Although I feel sorry for Naveen too.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 12:42 pm
RN, Naja, I know you have a big heart and are very forgiving and understanding... but I kind of think you need to move on from that client.
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Mameblanche
Member
08-24-2002
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 12:49 pm
Ditto what Kar said!! 🙏
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 1:56 pm
Rn that sounds scary. I know you have a lot of experience with dogs so I don’t think I can offer anything further in the way of helpful advice.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 2:17 pm
I agree with Kar. I can’t stress enough that if one of the dogs injures another dog or person, you will be held liable because you are aware of their violent tendencies in your care. It’s just not worth the risk.
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Juju2bigdog
Member
10-26-2000
| Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 10:13 pm
She didn't tip because she knows it is over, and she can no longer count on you to hopefully train her dogs. But so sorry this whole thing had to happen.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Wednesday, August 21, 2024 - 10:43 am
RN It's hard to think about right now. It looks like Nurse Debbie will probably leave because work keeps calling her and telling her they don't need her for the day. It's been 3 days in a row. Yolanda leaves at the end of the month. I have ZERO dog bookings in the next 43 days. homeowners and car insurance due next month, have to give back $800 in deposits, plus all the bills. I am in a bit of a panic, and if I have a chance to make more money with the pit bulls, I will. It's 400 to 500 a pop for their vacations, and a weekend of daycare gets me about 150.
I talked to the pit bull mom the day after the stay to ask how the dogs were doing. They were doing fine, getting back to acting themselves again. We talked about me watching Naveen for daycare next week to see how he acts without Max. Everything seemed fine. But then no tip, no review, nothing.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, August 21, 2024 - 11:14 am
RN, Naja, I will only say again that it is extremely risky to have both of them UNLESS you keep them separated, and maybe separated from your own dogs as well. I understand your worry about your bills, but if something goes wrong and you get sued, or have substantial vet bills, you'll be in even worse shape.
I'm guessing she may be moving on anyway, given that you gave an honest review of her dogs.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Wednesday, August 21, 2024 - 2:27 pm
RN Well, she just booked the one dog without the aggression for our daycare experiment for next Thursday.
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Pamy
Member
01-01-2002
| Wednesday, August 21, 2024 - 3:04 pm
RN has anyone ever tried birkenstock sandals? I heard they are comfy but they are hard as a rock. Guy at store said give it 2 wks to try.
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