| Author |
Message |
Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 4:45 pm 
Kooklie, I am sure you are correct. In fact, I said that the pressure NOT to speak was probably greater in the game, because other contestants are the ones that vote you out, and they don't have to be honest about why.
They handled it exactly as they would in a workplace. Talking to everyone, and talking to Dan privately and individually.
It can be harassment (in the workplace), but not legally charged "assault"... again, I see no evidence of assault.
And Survivor is also unique again, in that you are in various states of clothing, AND sleeping in close proximity, which you don't do in most workplaces. Some, I suppose. 
FWIW, as I said before, I think they handled it correctly. I don't think Kellee is any hero (because she exaggerated her claims), and I do think Janet and Jamal were outstanding in their views. They were the heroes, if we needed some.
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 5:12 pm
Kar, for me, I don't really know if Kellee exaggerated her claims or not based on what was shown on the show. We are only seeing an edited version of what happened and will never see what really happened there.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 7:59 pm
Yes, from what I saw I didn't see Kellee exaggerating. I saw Dan try to put his hand in her hair. Gross. I wouldn't want anyone touching my hair. Not even guys that don't creep me out. I don't see Kellee as a hero. I see her as telling her truth and trying to find out if other women felt the same. I see her as someone who felt very uncomfortable and struggled with how to handle it because she was playing a game. I don't think she was assaulted. I think Dan ignored her requests to not touch her so I think he has a bit to learn. His continued touching of Kellee was inappropriate.
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Pamy
Member
01-01-2002
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 7:59 pm
I just hope this forces CBS to listen to all of us and give them bathing suits!!! I hate seeing the men flip flop as they start losing weight and their underwear get so loose
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 8:32 pm
The touching started earlier and was shown on an earlier episode. The hair touching was just an add on.
It does not matter what anyone else would feel. I think accusing someone of exaggerating their own feelings is unfortunate.
Grace is asked for the guy who ignored requests but not for the person, Kellee, who asked that the touching be stopped.
I don't see how Kellee has anything to "admit".
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 8:40 pm
Pamy, yes. I sure do not enjoy seeing them humiliated by having to wear underwear and do not see where it enhances the show.
Sure there will be some who want to expose more skin, but let it be a choice.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 8:53 pm
Kar, for me, I don't really know if Kellee exaggerated her claims or not based on what was shown on the show. We are only seeing an edited version of what happened and will never see what really happened there.
I don't know how you can't see it.
She talks about him "massaging" her scalp, when all he did was touch her dirty hair after she said it was dirty.
She said he stroked her hair, when all he did was tuck a wayward hair behind her ear.
Sorry, that's exaggeration. And it was clear to me. To say that wasn't exaggerating what happened means either the producers purposefully juxtaposed incidents that didn't refer to what she was saying, or to say that what was clearly less obnoxious was something that it wasn't (tucking a hair behind an ear is not stroking your hair; touching your dirty hair is nowhere near massaging your scalp). That's not to say she may have seen it as obnoxious, she did. She just described it in a way that sounded worse than what actually happened.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 8:54 pm
Yes, from what I saw I didn't see Kellee exaggerating. I saw Dan try to put his hand in her hair.
So would you describe that as trying to "massage her scalp?".....??????
We saw two incidents. One where he tucked her hair behind her ear; one where he felt her dirty hair when they were TALKING about her dirty hair.
Neither of those were stroking or massaging, as she described them.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 8:55 pm
I think accusing someone of exaggerating their own feelings is unfortunate.
I didn't say she exaggerated her feelings.
I said SEVERAL times that her feelings were real, that it clearly bothered her a great deal.
And in fact, I said she had a right to feel uncomfortable. She had a right to ask to him to stop. She had a right to be upset if she asked him to stop and he didn't.
So, yes, I gave her grace as well.
I said she exaggerated his behavior, not that she exaggerated her feelings.
So, please, try to get it right.
But this thread is a really good example of how we see things through our own lenses and not what's really there. That's for sure.
Because I've been quite clear, and people are getting what I said wrong.
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Pamy
Member
01-01-2002
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 9:55 pm
Kellee gave an interview with EW
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Mimi
Member
04-30-2009
| Tuesday, November 19, 2019 - 10:49 pm
Someone mentioned there are cameras 24/7 which clearly there are, but how many cameras? if one group is sleeping under the shelter and the other group is at the fire is there a camera crew on both?
I'm wondering if all is not recorded. Does anyone know?
BTW somehow the end of my comment yesterday got cut off in case anyone thought it ended abruptly.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 12:22 am
Sorry, we could go on for weeks and I would never be "right", because we simply don't see things the same. Ten people can see the same thing ten ways and that does not mean anyone is absolutely right.
I don't think there was exaggeration by Keller about anything.
The two women, yes, the admitted to purposely misleading Kelle AND then telling Can they did, but it was not true. That was wrong and harmful in all directions.
There have been apologies.
I don't think Kellee had anything to apologize for, but I gather she asked people to stop bashing others.
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Dogdoc
Member
09-29-2001
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 6:25 am
I don't have the replay, but I though Dan told Kellee he wanted to massage her scalp.
She walked rapidly away from him.
That is when he said he had just washed his hands.
Yuck!
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 9:07 am
The question for me is, would he have done the same thing to one of the male contestants.... no, probably not.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 9:10 am
The question for me is *also* did the women think it was okay for other people, just not Dan, and were their claims truthful.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 10:40 am
I found the EW Kellee interview well worth the read. There are also articles showing the public apologies from the two other ladies. Also an article where Jeff answers a few questions about it.
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 1:12 pm
For the first time ever... I'm not looking forward to the reunion.
Also, has Dan issued a statement yet?
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 2:25 pm
I rewatched what happened on the beach.
The scene starts with Kellee and Dan walking down the beach together.
Kellee: "I probably need to wash my hair too?"
Dan touches her hair.
Kellee: "Oh god!"
Dan stops immediately and Kellee walks ahead.
Dan: "I'm sorry Kellee, I'm sorry. I was looking to see how much sand there was. My hands are clean."
Kellee: "Your hands are not clean, Dan!"
Dan: "Oh my god, I just scrubbed them in the water."
And that's where the scene ended.
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Dogdoc
Member
09-29-2001
| Wednesday, November 20, 2019 - 3:16 pm
Thanks Jimmer. I don't know why I thought he wanted to massage her scalp.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Thursday, November 21, 2019 - 8:42 pm
If I thought and/or said my hair was dirty, the only person besides me who I would want touching it would be Peggy, my hair stylist.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, November 21, 2019 - 9:01 pm
Thank you, Jimmer.
Dogdoc, you thought that because that's what Kellee said he said. She exaggerated.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Thursday, November 21, 2019 - 9:30 pm
I still don't think she exaggerated. When I want to see how dirty my hair is, I touch my scalp. If I want to see how much sand is in my hair, I would have to touch my scalp. So when he said he was "looking to see how much sand", my interpretation is that he was going to dig his hands deep in her hair to touch her scalp. And when his grubby hands came toward my head I would have reacted in a bad way too!
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Thursday, November 21, 2019 - 10:19 pm
What part of she had already told him whereas made uncomfortable with his touchy feely ways is not the main point. It feels like she is in court being cross examined in ways that year her down.
Actually, that happens really often, which is why so many women just sucking up and say nothing.
And I know This thread will just keep spiralling back to the hair. He needed to not even reach toward someone who was uncomfortable and HAD said something.
Jumping off the spiral
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Friday, November 22, 2019 - 8:50 am
So, Brenda, you doubt the video evidence? I don't understand that.
I'm not saying she was wrong to react, and tell him to leave her alone. He then APOLOGIZED. She didn't mention that in her retelling either.
And let me repeat, I'm not saying she was wrong to react, or speak her truth. I'm saying she should speak the TRUTH.
It's interesting that she gets a pass on almost anything, but he does not.
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Strategist
Member
07-01-2014
| Friday, November 22, 2019 - 9:12 am
It's interesting that he gets a pass on almost anything, but she does not.
She may have exaggerated, but he should have never tried to touch her again!
It's a two way street and this story has been over-hyped and over-analyzed, IMO.
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