| Author |
Message |
Lexie_girl
Member
07-30-2004
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 8:20 am 
Jimmer, we were talking this morning at work about how last night's episode left us confused.
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Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 8:24 am
“Really inappropriate” to that I say a simple touch that is not asked for can be really inappropriate. They showed Dan time and time again putting his arms around people as they sleep. To me that is really inappropriate.
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Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 8:30 am
I also Was super confused. Wasn’t Missy saying that she was uncomfortable? Why did she deny it??
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 8:34 am
What is inappropriate behavior becomes very confusing on these reality shows. Most people don’t cuddle up and sleep with people they’ve just met and certainly not with people in a workplace but they do that all the time for warmth on Survivor.
The best thing people can do in a situation like Survivor is set boundaries and express their concerns. If they are worried about retaliation they can do it in a non-threatening way that won’t increase the tension.
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Ark
Member
07-09-2001
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 9:25 am
The thing is, we know it's cold out there at night. Dan might think that it's OK to cuddle up to keep himself and someone else warm. People that aren't romantically involved talk about doing it every season. The problem is, I don't think Dan asked if anyone wanted to cuddle for warmth. I thought it was weird that he was messing with Missy's leg at the merge feast.
I know a lot of people are going to disagree with this and that's OK, I'm just trying to make sense out of what happened last night.
First of all, a strong woman might put up with things in the game that they wouldn't put up with outside the game. They are playing for a million dollars and even though some of the things Dan was doing might irritate them, they are willing to put up with them in the game because he's not a threat to their game. So instead of voting out a non-threat they just vent and bond with the other women over it.
Then along comes Janet. The other women tell Janet how some of Dan's actions irritate them but they don't ask Janet to step in on their behalf. Janet has worked with young men & women for years and knows that in the real world things like this need to be nipped in the bud immediately and feels removing Dan from the situation is the best way to take care of the problem.
In the real world what Janet did was admirable and every woman should wish they had a Janet in their workplace. If Janet was in the game with meek wallflowers I'm sure they would be thanking her and doing her bidding for the rest of the game because they were so grateful. The problem is, none of these women are meek wallflowers. They are stong women that can take care of themselves. They saw the situation as a nuisance in a game that they could work around. Janet saw it as a problem that should be dealt with as quickly as possible because that's what should be done in the real world.
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 9:28 am
I agree Missy and Elizabeth are reprehensible... Kellee's feeling were 100% legit... but the others played it up for gameplay... Liz said as much... the words "gameplay" came out of her mouth. While I think Dan does have personal space issues... keep your hands to yourself dude! But for Missy and Liz to play it up is flat out wrong. Something like this could really ruin a person... to think that Missy and Liz would use it for gameplay is disgusting... it's amazing what lengths they will go to for $1M...
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Ark
Member
07-09-2001
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 9:44 am
One other thing, Kellee seemed to be the most negatively affected by Dan's actions and the one that cried to Janet about them, however Kellee wasn't uncomfortable enough to have production take care of the problem when she was asked if they needed to intervene. We then heard her say that she didn't intend to vote Dan out over those actions because it would mess up her game. So if Missy & Elizabeth have lost everyone's respect because they did Janet dirty, we need to add Kellee's name to that list also.
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Roxip
Member
01-29-2004
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 9:44 am
Dan can deny all he wants but his actions were shown...whether they constitute "inappropriate" is obviously in the eyes (and bodies) of the persons concerned...but as for him protesting that he is a family man with children and he wouldn't do that - I'm pretty sure Harvey Weinstein would have said the same thing, or Matt Lauer. I sometimes think men whose actions are inappropriate don't even realize how it is perceived (although not giving Harvey and Matt that much grace). Having said that, using that kind of action for game play is reprehensible, and I think Missy and Elizabeth are both equally responsible, as is Lauren also (not to mention it takes a pretty low person to actually lie to a tribe member's face as boldly as she did at tribal council). Of course smug Kellee sat there with two idols in her pocket and went home - she should have played one of those idols as insurance. She is solely responsible for her own eviction in that regard.
Can we go back to playing Survivor now? These last three shows of social justice warriors is taking some of the joy out of my Wednesday nights. I do understand that Survivor is a microcosm of life and I appreciate that they have shown this and how it has affected the contestants, but I also just really enjoy the game.
I appreciate Jamal's comments, but honestly I was kind of sick of his moobs.
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 10:05 am
https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/survivor-contestants-exaggerated-inappropriate-touching-win-game
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 10:20 am
Well, not to get all social justicey on you, but I think having these kinds of things air helps the general population get better educated on the issue.
That said, given that we only see glimpses of what goes on, it's hard to say exactly what happened.
After complaining about Dan, they said they *welcomed* his attention at times. It's hard to find him at fault if the messages were truly mixed.
The producers did the right thing, asked if they should intervene, then talked to everyone, then talked to Dan privately.
After trying to dodge the issue, I think Dan was truly remorseful and apologetic, although I do think he was confused about the mixed messages too.
I hated that Janet was the victim of their manipulation. She was played. I like Janet.
And Jamal? What a great speech! I was so sad that they voted him out after that.
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 10:23 am
I agree with Kar's post 100%.
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 11:09 am
I also feel a tinge of discomfort that Survivor manipulates these situations because it’s a current issue and they want to make “good TV”. These contestants are some of the most highly observed people in the world and Survivor could easily intervene the moment a contestant expressed discomfort.
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 11:23 am
What were TPTB supposed to do? Ignore it? Not show it?
Did I enjoy last night's episodes? Not really, but I think it needed to be shown... Survivor doesn't want to be accused of sweeping issues under the rug... they should show the good/bad/ugly... mirrors real life...
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Roxip
Member
01-29-2004
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 11:39 am
Not saying that I don't agree, but I am missing seeing competitions and camp life too. What I would like to see is if these women end up paying a price for their silence...and how is this going to affect them when they return to their real life. It might not be pretty for them. The difference between Survivor and Big Brother is that BB players come out into the real world not knowing how their actions inside of the house (some of which they don't even remember or recognize) have been perceived by the public, whereas the Survivor players have been out and will have time to craft politically correct responses.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 11:44 am
Manipulates is a pejorative word, and I'm not sure I agree. But then, we don't know completely what happened, since as I mentioned, we only see what they show us.
My impression was that they chose to highlight an issue that is current.
It mirrors real life in that women often feel like speaking up may damage their life more than not speaking up will damage them.
My impression was that the women WERE really disturbed by the touching, and that seems to be what Janet picked up on as well. But then when confronted, they backed down. Did they back down because they exaggerated it? Or did they back down because they didn't want it to affect their game? Can't tell.
But that goes to show how complex these situations are. I think Dan is just a highly affectionate guy with poor boundaries. I honestly don't think he was of ill intent, just poor knowledge about how he might be perceived.
In the real world, we would hope that women would just say that they are uncomfortable with the amount of touching, but just like in Survivor, that's not always easy.
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Vsmart
Member
02-09-2003
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 12:11 pm
Or that the women wanted to take Dan to the end as a "goat".
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Cass_cat
Member
05-09-2011
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 1:00 pm
I was listening to RHAP this morning and Rob and his guest host commented that at this rate the final 3 are going to end up being Karishma, Dan, and Noura..
I actually lol'd...
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Jimmer
Board Administrator
08-29-2000
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 1:41 pm
Manipulates is a pejorative word, and I'm not sure I agree.
Well manipulates may be a pejorative word but that’s why I preceded it with “tinge of discomfort”. I don’t know how Survivor handles these things but I would think that they could squash it quickly if they wanted to. It’s not like they don’t know what’s going on.
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Mizinvanccouver
Member
02-21-2003
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 1:48 pm
Just finished the first hour of the show. I felt for Janet.
I have to say, in real life peoole choose to ignore co-workers bad behaviour to keep their jobs and further their careers so I wasn't surprised by Missy, Elizabeth snd Kellee complaining but then willing to let it go for the game. Not that it is right, just saying .
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Lexie_girl
Member
07-30-2004
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 1:55 pm
"But that goes to show how complex these situations are. I think Dan is just a highly affectionate guy with poor boundaries. I honestly don't think he was of ill intent, just poor knowledge about how he might be perceived."
------------------------------------
Karuuna, ITA with this post - 100%
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Mizinvanccouver
Member
02-21-2003
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 2:12 pm
Watching the second tribal council, whoa!!
I do not think Dan is aware of how his affection/touching is taken. I don't believe he was trying to make anyone uncomfortable.
Feel for Janet, that she feels some don't believe her intentions with her vote were for the greater good.
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Mizinvanccouver
Member
02-21-2003
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 2:16 pm
Ok, after vote.. lol...have to say it was interesting that it was all the men who voted Jamal out
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Worldtraveller
Member
06-26-2019
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 2:35 pm
Enjoying the season until last night, and despite Boston Rob on for the 20th time. Anyone with their arm on my body at night, caressing my calf, touching my face and hair is gonna lose an arm. I know its a game but, hey Dan, I don't like being touched by anyone but my husband please stop now. He mentioned coming from the industry that started the MeToo movement, being married with two kids doesn't give you an excuse for creepy uncle behavior.
Janet was a star last night and Missy and Elizabeth will regret last night. Shame on Missy, was routing for her, not now.
Tribal turning into a Dr.Probst therapy session.
He never shuts up.
Guess B Rob isn't eating only rice, nice beer belly going on there.
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Roxip
Member
01-29-2004
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 2:44 pm
I've found Jamal's Ponderosa video but not Kellee's - anybody seen her's posted?
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Kookliebird
Member
08-04-2005
| Thursday, November 14, 2019 - 3:01 pm
I adore Jamal and have all season. To hear someone talk so eloquently about various topics is refreshing. I wish he had gone farther than he did. Just seems like a really good guy.
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