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Message |
Carrly
Member
09-28-2000
| Sunday, June 29, 2014 - 8:53 pm 
Saw the premier of this show tonight created by the writers of Lost. Looks interesting, I have read that we will never find out how 5% of the population on earth disappears. It is all about the journey. In a way it reminds me of The Dome. Justin Theroux stars as a small town sheriff and Amy Brenneman from Judging Amy and Private Practice is a member of a silent cigarette-smoking cult. Reminded me of the Cigarette-Smoking Man on X-Files, are these the same writers?!
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Kappy
Member
06-28-2002
| Sunday, June 29, 2014 - 11:12 pm
Wow - what a depressing hour and 15 minutes. I really wanted to like this but I don't know. One site says it's about the characters rather then a "story" and yet after an hour, I don't care about a single one of them so what's the point?
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Spunky
Member
10-07-2001
| Monday, June 30, 2014 - 8:04 am
I watched it because I was curious but I agree, what a depressing tale of 'nonsense', it's one of those shows that it will take for ever to explain to the viewers what is going on that I may just give up on it. When the girl asks his father about the dog and he doesn't say anything, how frustrating, just tell her he was shot and the owner didn't care. No, the agony of not knowing what is going on does not keep me interested in this one.
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Kappy
Member
06-28-2002
| Monday, June 30, 2014 - 8:35 am
You can go to Amazon and check out reviews of the book. The two creators of the show are the author of the book (Tom Perrota) and the writer who came up with the ending for Lost (Damon Lindelof).
Seriously, someone should run an online poll of "Which depressed character is your favorite?" Spoiler alert . . . . You can't choose the family dog!
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Rieann
Member
08-26-2006
| Monday, June 30, 2014 - 3:13 pm
I haven't watched this yet, but I'm bummed to hear it was disappointing. I've been looking forward to it.
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Denecee
Member
09-05-2002
| Monday, June 30, 2014 - 3:16 pm
ditto, to Rieann's post
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Reenie
Member
06-24-2006
| Monday, June 30, 2014 - 5:48 pm
Ok, I watched it. I think it has potential. I will say though, the characters aren't very likable at this point. Who are these cigarette smoking people and why is the Chief's wife one of them?
I will give it another shot - but I do understand everyone's concerns.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 12:46 am
Wow.
I don't think it was disappointing at all. It was completely spellbinding.
Every TV show or movie is about people in situations that affect their lives in one way or another. The Leftovers is about an incomprehensible situation that dramatically affects the lives of people all over the world in ways they never could have predicted or even imagined. It is a unique situation that devastates many but gives purpose to others, even if that purpose is to join a cult and become a silent, chain smoking protester.
I was mesmerized from the first minute to the last. This is excellent storytelling even if the "why" is never to be revealed. They could have done this story about a worldwide natural disaster like an asteroid hitting the earth or a epidemic, but they have chosen to make the disappearances not only emotionally devastating but also impossible to understand, which just makes it even more difficult for the characters to deal with.
To tell you the truth, The Leftovers reminds me of losing dozens and dozens of friends that I loved dearly within a just a few years (sometimes up to 4 per week!) when AIDS first presented itself. A lot of people were asking how this happened and where that virus came from, but most of us were asking "How can I deal with is? How can I accept the loss of so many really GOOD people who were loving and generous and made the world a better place?"
The fact is, my life changed when 99% of my closest friends died so suddenly. The way something like that changes a community or an individual is the important part of the story. Even if you know "why" or "how"it happened you still have to deal with the loss and the sudden realization that you are a lot more alone today then you were yesterday.
And I'd bet I'm not the only person who noticed the similarity of the Heros Day (memorial) parade protestors and the Westboro Baptist Church protesting at funerals.
If I just wanted to know "why" this happened, I'd watch a different show. If I wanted to see how a lot of people handle themselves in an extreme and unique situation that, by it's very nature, is un-knowable, then I would definitely want to watch The Leftovers.
I highly recommend it. I think it will take each one of us to a different place because loss like this is a distinctly personal thing. We won't all react the same watching the story unfold and if we were actually in such a situation, we wouldn't all be the same when we came out of it. Trust me.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 12:48 am
Oh jeez, SFJ, it was just horrible.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 12:52 am
People told me the same thing about "Lost". It was still my favorite television show of all time, despite the criticism that it didn't fit into a nice little box with a nice little bow.
Like I said - "We won't all react the same watching the story unfold".
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 9:16 am
I thought it was a bit... bleak... but I thought all the characters' stories were honest and interesting except the smoking people. Why?! The silent part wasn't a problem but the smoking? Come on, you may not know when death or disappearance will come but you don't want to unnecessarily affect the quality of the life you do have.
They had a few very good lines that made me think. One was someone (can't even remember who) saying that they will be one of the missing one day. Just up and gone, snap, like that. Before that I was focusing on them living without the ones who'd gone, not the uncertainty it gave to their current lives.
Big hug to Sanfran  .
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Kappy
Member
06-28-2002
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 11:53 am
I came back today to apologize because I don't think anyone should avoid the show simply because I and a few others see it as so depressing. I have no doubt that many will like the show.
The aids epidemic is a good analogy but with aids, many took it upon themselves to organize and start fighting back socially, politically, medically. With this show, I just see a complete lack of hope among the ones that are left and that disturbs me.
But like with Lost - many will also enjoy this!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 12:53 pm
"but I thought all the characters' stories were honest and interesting except the smoking people."
Kitt, that is no stranger than churches who celebrate their faith by eating the flesh of christ and drinking his blood. And that, as I understand it, isn't just a symbolic gesture...they actually believe that the wafer and wine transforms into actual flesh and blood inside the body.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 1:07 pm
Yes but eating a wafer and drinking a little wine isn't going to give you a drawn out agonising death, unlike lung cancer. If the cult was into risk taking or free love (like that kids' extreme spin the bottle game!) I would have thought it more sensible, but to force a dangerous habit just seemed... silly.
I understand if people were smokers already they wouldn't bother to try to give up, but to force people to start... hmmmm, I don't know. I mean is the non-smoking Liv Tyler now going to chain smoke? How is that going to make her life, however short or uncertain it might be, any better?
Maybe if I were a smoker I would understand!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 1:15 pm
"The aids epidemic is a good analogy but with aids, many took it upon themselves to organize and start fighting back socially, politically, medically. With this show, I just see a complete lack of hope among the ones that are left and that disturbs me. "
Oh there was lack of hope for quite awhile when AIDS first started....we watched our friends dying and it was still just a blip on the radar of the media and the government. Reagan never even mentioned the word AIDS in public until ten of thousands of Americans had already DIED from it!
In the early 80s I was a member of a discussion group of about a dozen concerned gay men who wanted to talk about this new "plague". Each week it was a big deal if someone actually found an article about it in the paper, although they were usually little more than a reiteration of previous articles that had nothing new to share. I remember there being so little in the way of newspaper articles or tv news talking about it....this was years before personal computers and the Internet became a ubiquitous part of our daily lives.
Before it was labeled AIDS, it was called GRID (Gay Related Immune Deficiency). Since it was seemed to be affecting mainly just gay people, it was not a mainstream topic of conversation except in the gay community. I remember after several of my friends had already died, there was a local SF Bay Area nun who contracted it through a blood transfusion. I got to work and that was all everyone was talking about! It was a revelation to see how suddenly AIDS was important issue because it affected a nun and not just another gay man....and this was in San Francisco in 1981.
It took an infected child, Ryan White, who eventually died of AIDS to turn it into a real national issue that was discussed openly.
There was not a lot of expectation in the gay community that the government had any concern with this epidemic until it was apparent that it was affecting more that "just" gay men and drug addicts. It sent the message that gay men and drug addicts were expendable and their deaths didn't raise much concern.
Hope was less visible than fear and anger was in those early days. I also see that attitude reflected in The Leftovers.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 1:29 pm
"I would have thought it more sensible, but to force a dangerous habit just seemed... silly. "
Kitt, I don't remember seeing or hearing anything in the show that said they were "forced" to start smoking.
I just figured that the cult was made up of mostly smokers and it was just acceptable behavior so they took advantage of it. I would think that most nonsmokers just wouldn't want to join a group of chain smokers.
"Maybe if I were a smoker I would understand!"
I was a smoker for 12 years but I quit in December of 1981. It's hard for a nonsmoker to understand, but cigarettes were like a best friend. They were always there and smoking a cigarette always made you feel better....emotionally better, that is, even though it was physically killing you over time.
It's an addiction. Addictions cause your brain to work differently. Even when I had a case of severe bronchitis, smoking a cigarette hurt my lungs and made me cough even more....but it still made me feel better emotionally. That's how addictions have so much power over a person...they make you think differently because your brain is craving the endorphins that affect the pleasure centers of the brain (whether the addiction is tobacco, alcohol, cocaine, or heroin) and those endorphins become your brain's highest priority.
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 1:41 pm
There was a poster on the wall that said something like "We don't smoke because we want to, we smoke to show our faith" or something like that. So I thought they had to, even if they didn't. It might be that it only attracts smokers though, that would make more sense. Have to see what happens to Liv Tyler.
"smoking a cigarette always made you feel better....emotionally better"
Like chocolate. Seriously. I do get that bit of it.
Sanfran, a little off topic with the show, but not the conversation. Can I ask how long it was before you realised you were different, and for some reason you weren't going to die then? And did you feel worse because of that or did it fuel you in some way?
I keep seeing Sheldon's piles of file cards from The Normal Heart.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 2:58 pm
"There was a poster on the wall that said something like "We don't smoke because we want to, we smoke to show our faith" or something like that."
Aha! I totally missed seeing that poster.
In any case, I think trying to find logic within the faith of any cult (or any religion, for that matter) is a waste of time, IMHO. Neither cults or religions are based in fact, logic, or science.
In fact, the idea of "having faith" is believing in something even if it defies all logic, facts, and/or the laws of physics and any other scientific explanation.
"Sanfran, a little off topic with the show, but not the conversation. Can I ask how long it was before you realised you were different, and for some reason you weren't going to die then? And did you feel worse because of that or did it fuel you in some way? "
I still don't assume I'm not going die of AIDS. I take drugs that add up to more than my entire monthly income and so far they have worked for me.
Yes, of course, I do have survivor's guilt...I was the first person in my circle of friends who was diagnosed (with GRID) in 1982. I remember trying to explain what little I (and my doctors) knew about it to my friends who, since that time, all became infected and died. (Of course, most of them had probably already been infected for years and just didn't know it because of the sometimes very long incubation period - often a decade or more).
I have one friend today who was so far gone in the early 90s that the rest of us thought he'd be dead within months...but that's just when the new antiviral drugs came out and that friend of mine is still alive and kicking, too.
"I keep seeing Sheldon's piles of file cards from The Normal Heart."
I still haven't been able to bring myself to watch that movie, even though I have it recorded and saved on my TIVO. It's difficult to even think about watching a dramatization of the worst decade in my life. I happened to be channel flipping recently and saw part of a scene from it....when one person in a new relationship admitted to his extremely distraught lover that he had purple spots on this foot (often a sign of KS, Kaposi's sarcoma, a very deadly disease often found in AIDS patients). Just seeing that two minutes brought up so much, including tears in my eyes, that I have not yet built up the courage to watch the whole film.
Sorry if I'm getting too emotional in this TV show thread, but The Leftovers really touches on a lot of aspects of the darkest time in my life, but without all the anti-gay rhetoric and outlandish suggestions that came along with it. There were actually people calling to put us all in quarantine "camps" away from the rest of society. One conservative columnist who wrote for the NY Times even suggested that all IV drug users with AIDS be tattooed with the word "AIDS" on the inside of their arm and the same tattoo on the buttocks of gay men with AIDS.
Those were scary times when we heard respected people in print and on TV calling for "camps" and "forced tattoos".
March 18, 1986
OP-ED
by William F. Buckley Jr., editor of the National Review
Crucial Steps in Combating the Aids Epidemic; Identify All the Carriers
<snip>
Everyone detected with AIDS should be tatooed in the upper forearm, to protect common-needle users, and on the buttocks, to prevent the victimization of other homosexuals.
You have got to be kidding! That's exactly what we suspected all along! You are calling for the return of the Scarlet Letter, but only for homosexuals!
Answer: The Scarlet Letter was designed to stimulate public obloquy. The AIDS tattoo is designed for private protection. And the whole point of this is that we are not talking about a kidding matter. Our society is generally threatened, and in order to fight AIDS, we need the civil equivalent of universal military training."
http://www.nytimes.com/books/00/07/16/specials/buckley-aids.html
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 3:14 pm
I wouldn't recommend you watch it. You lived it and once is probably enough. It was one of those movies. Thanks for answering my questions. For what it's worth, I am very happy you survived.
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Libshea
Member
08-31-2006
| Tuesday, July 01, 2014 - 11:36 pm
I enjoyed the show enough to give the next episode a chance. I seriously LOVED reading all of Sanfran & Kitt's conversation. Thank you!
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Daydreamer
Member
05-30-2008
| Wednesday, July 02, 2014 - 4:54 am
I thought the cultists' smoking has something (ironic) to do with their written message on Hero's Day: "Save Your Breath."
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Hskrfan
Member
06-30-2011
| Monday, July 07, 2014 - 7:31 am
Watched again last night. I really wanted to like this show but I don't think I can get into it.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Monday, July 07, 2014 - 11:43 am
I am still mesmerized by The Leftovers. It is very dark, but the excellent writing gives it substance and it's completely unpredictable...something that cannot be said of 99.9% of television shows.
I don't know much about the Rapture, but if that's what caused all those people to vanish (as the opening credits suggest) this show is giving us a peek at how things might play out for those left behind, if such a thing were to actually happen.
Btw, in this episode I finally heard what "GR" stands for. The smoking cult is actually named "Guilty Remnants".
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Monday, July 07, 2014 - 12:01 pm
In reference to my previous post, I got these 3 images from the opening credits of episode 2, which aired last night:
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Kitt
Member
09-05-2000
| Monday, July 07, 2014 - 9:19 pm
I hadn't noticed the opening credits. I'm not sure I like that idea for the show, what we saw in the opening episode was people just disappearing, not floating upwards. The bottom picture looks like it's in a church, I wonder if it's to show how the church has taken the event and rewritten it in their minds (and scripture) to match with their prior religious beliefs.
Liv Tyler hasn't smoked yet, although she asked for one. But then I guess she's not a full member yet.
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