| Author |
Message |
Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 4:48 pm 
It's not enough to not intentionally be "mean". It's extraordinarily self-centered to not think about other people's feelings.
Thank you, Karuuna. Exactly. I never said she was mean. I said she is not a nice person. She seems very self-centered and not aware of others' feelings. She demands "honesty," but as soon as she doesn't agree with someone else's honest opinion, she gets angry and feels her judgment is being called into question. I just don't like her at all.
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 5:26 pm
The distinction that seems to be drawn between "not nice" and "mean" is rather interesting. All a matter of interpretation. I guess "not nice" is some lesser form of mean.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 5:38 pm
I don't know. Is not caring about the feelings of other people "mean"? It seems like it could be.
Of course, in this show, they are encouraged to behave that way. But some people seem more suited to that than others.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 5:44 pm
I live with a teenager who's very self centered and I wouldn't use the term "not nice" or "mean" to describe her. Immature is more of what comes to mind, self centered. And yes Kaitlyn could fit both of those. I understand why she brought Nick in and I would have too, but she was not sensitive to how the guys would feel about it for sure. She talked way too much about Nick to the guys! Foolish!
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 6:03 pm
I would understand it more in a teenager. But once you are in your 20's you should be transitioning out of that view.
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Needmylifeback
Member
08-14-2000
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 6:09 pm
I had to laugh at Nicks assessment.. something to the effect that the guys have such little time with her .. and shouldn't use their time to talk about him.. but his time with Kaitlyn was all suck-face...
Oh.. and who in the world was Cory? ..
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Tuesday, June 16, 2015 - 6:29 pm
Cory who?
And Nick is spot on. I'm sure he gets a kick out of the guys wasting their time talking about him.
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 6:52 am
We have to try to keep the rather ridiculous premise of this show in mind. It's pretty hard not to hurt feelings and be perceived as inconsiderate when you are dating and rejecting 24 people over the course of a few weeks in an attempt to find a lifelong partner.
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Cinnamongirl
Member
01-10-2001
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 10:17 am
Kaitlyn may be insensitive, but she's not mean. Ian was mean! and arrogant, and a host of other things. Glad he left
I DO hate that she brought Nick back..I get her reasoning and all ..but I just don't like it one bit. ick!
I haven't liked many of the group dates.. whatever happened to race car driving or a football game.. or something less humiliating.. I really hate when Bachelor/ettes have to do stand up comedy/rap/sumo/mariachi type stuff... its painful to watch...
I'm liking Kaitlyn. I hope I can say that after next week.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 10:29 am
I maintain that insensitivity is, in fact, a kind of "mean."
Whether you intend to hurt someone, or you don't, it still hurts. You have to intend to NOT hurt someone to be considered a kind person.
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Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 10:54 am
Ian may have been pretty full of himself, but I think he was spot on about Kaitlyn. Is being brutally honest mean? I think a lot of viewers were applauding him. He just wasn't that into Kaitlyn (and she wasn't really that into him either), so he was right to take himself out of the competition. I love that he spoke his mind before he left though.
I've been reading some other articles online about this season, and the opinions on Kaitlyn are overwhelmingly negative. As long as she hasn't hurt the ratings, I'm sure ABC doesn't care how she's portrayed on the show. She may be the worst Bachelorette ever, but as long as the ratings are good ABC is happy.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 10:55 am
I think she would declare that she intended Not to hurt the other men by doing what she did in bringing Nick back, thinking long and hard about it, talking incessantly about it, talking to _them_ about it. She's more clueless than anything I think.
Ian was just being nasty with his "my ex was prettier and you're shallow" stuff. completely uncalled for.
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Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 10:58 am
Ian was just being nasty with his "my ex was prettier and you're shallow" stuff. completely uncalled for.
Yes, I agree with you there, Brenda, but I did enjoy seeing her taken down a peg or two. Everyone is so busy kissing her behind and telling her how amazing she is, it was kind of refreshing hearing someone say she's not all that. I'm sure she was shocked.
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:07 am
I still think there is a big difference between someone who is rather oblivious and hurts someone else and someone who deliberates goes out of their way to hurt someone else.
Case in point is Ian and Kaitlyn. Yes Kaitlyn may be oblivious and not equally interested in all of the remaining guys including Ian but she isn't going around telling them that she has dated better looking guys and that they are shallow, etc. Big difference.
Just like not all crimes are equal, these things are not equivalent either.
As far as bringing Nick back being hurtful to the other guys, it's not like the other guys are on a team. She is still supposedly undecided between them and adding one more guy into the mix isn't any different. It's also not a competition or a game where there are rules and everything is supposed to be fair and there is a winner. She is supposedly looking for a husband. There are no winners and losers. Either there is something there or there isn't.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:15 am
Yes, I don't have a problem with someone telling her that she seems selfish or just isn't the girl for him. A little wake up call may be in order for her for sure. But the "my ex is prettier" stuff is just being mean and nasty and while I don't think he said it to her, but it displayed his attitude and lack of graciousness before he spoke to her. It is wise to leave when you figure out she's not the girl for you, but there's a classy way to do it. That said, I'm loving the drama. Can't wait to see how she reacts to Ian's declarations!
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Gldnlvr
Member
08-03-2007
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:15 am
There's no way Nick could have just shown up on his own, right? How would he know where/when they were filming. I think the idea was planned all along by producers and Kaitlyn agreed to go along with it. I'm sure even the reaction from the guys was scripted.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:21 am
Yes, what Jimmer said.
Regardign Nick -- someone, either Kaitlyn or Nick has to clue the producers in on their budding interest and lack of resolution. Of course the timing of when Nick shows up is completely planned by the producers to create the most drama.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:42 am
Just like not all crimes are equal, these things are not equivalent either.
Well, I maintain that if someone hurts you because they wanted to hurt you, or hurts you because they didn't give a crap about your feelings, it still hurts the same. 
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:51 am
True! But I think someone who's clueless or self-unaware doesn't necessarily not care, they just maybe are ready for a teachable moment. LOL. You can say to them "hey, that hurt me" and they might actually feel bad and learn something, be more careful next time. But when a mean person hurts us and we say "that hurt me" their response is not remorse, it's "good, I meant it to!" LOL. I haven't seen anything that displays Kaitlyn as not caring. But clueless? Yes indeed!
Is is Monday yet? I'm loving this season!
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 11:54 am
Let's say someone is calling for help. One person hears and deliberately decides not to help because they don't care. Another person just doesn't hear. The end result may be identical but I like the second person much more than the first.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 12:01 pm
Brenda, perhaps, but I think the guys have been telling her, and she is still not caring. here's the thing, she has NO reason NOT to know how difficult it is, because she has been in their shoes, and felt that pain.
Jimmer, I don't think your analogy is the same. It's more like one person hears and says "wow, I like that you're getting hurt" and the other one hears and says "not my problem."
Either way, you are still hurt and/or not helped.
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Cinnamongirl
Member
01-10-2001
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 12:02 pm
Yes, being brutally honest CAN be very mean...and I try and teach my son that as best as possible. I don't think Ian was "spot on" at all. And I certainly didn't enjoy his "take her down a peg" convo with Kaitlyn. That's the kind of crap I could do without watching.
I wholeheartly agree with you Jimmer. Big difference.
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Babyjaxmom
Member
10-20-2002
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 5:58 pm
es, being brutally honest CAN be very mean...and I try and teach my son that as best as possible. I don't think Ian was "spot on" at all. And I certainly didn't enjoy his "take her down a peg" convo with Kaitlyn. That's the kind of crap I could do without watching.
I did. I enjoyed it. 
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Flossiebebe
Member
09-01-2005
| Wednesday, June 17, 2015 - 6:26 pm
I'm not really into Kaitlyn and her self-centeredness, but it does make for an interesting season. I'm not so sure that she is really into many of the guys remaining. For someone who has been through all this before, I think she knows enough to play it up for drama.
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, June 18, 2015 - 6:48 am
Why do people feel that Kaitlyn is exceptionally more self-centered than previous Bachelors and Bachelorettes? It's not like there has ever been a season without lots of hurt feelings. It's inevitable considering the way the show works.
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