Nadi | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 05:05 am  Come on raise your hands. How many of us even bothered to read the rules? How many of us actually know the rules? I think I remember reading them early on but wanted to re-read them once again. There has been so much talk and accusations of Tali, Vykin and Arreal cheating. The only mention of chatting is mentioned in this section of the rules... Players may be disqualified for any of the following reasons: * attempting to create a secondary user ID on the TVClubHouse (this is against Club rules and could also result in you being suspended from the entire board) * not posting when required * chatting in the Chat Room when not designated I guess the last one translated to many of the posters here as no IM. I don't think it necessarily does. I don't really consider IM or Icq as chatting. I think restrictions were put on the BGs regarding this site. I don't think anyone can or should mandate what the BGs do outside this site. Personally I don't have a problem with the IMs seeing as there is currently no way the BGs can talk 1 on 1 with each other. I just think that if there ever is a game 2 the BGs should have to provide logs of their IMs so that the outsiders can be privy to the conversations. |
Affinity | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 05:13 am  I agree with you. But instead of providing logs of outside conversations, there could be a special chat that only the BGs could log into. This chat makes a log of its conversations and stores them on the server running it. I know the technology must exist somewhere. |
Ocean_Islands | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 05:22 am  You don't consider IM or ICQ chatting? What is it then? Get real. Everyone knew what the rules were. The rules don't have to list every available chat program to make it clear that chatting outside the game is against the rules. I think we all know that the point of the game is for us to see their discussion and, in fact, that is what makes the fabric of the game. Without it, there is no game. Those who say the rules don't mention "AOL" chat or somesuch are not giving Neil and Lisa the benefit of the doubt; I really don't think they have written game rules before and they are not lawyers, either! |
Nadi | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 05:24 am  The only problem with that there would have to be a way to cap the number of BGs in the room so that the BGs feel they can chat in private without any of the other BGs walking in on them. I think they'll be more likely to open up to just one other person. I'm also not sure how much work would go into setting something like that up. |
Nadi | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 05:42 am  Ocean Islands I guess if you can tell me to get real I can tell you to Chill out. Personally I use IM and Icq more along the lines of email and to notify me when certain people I know are online. Then I can send them a message to meet me somewhere. Its much faster than using email. It can be used for chatting but doesn't have to necessarily be the only use. I think the rule regarding the Chat room was probably put into place to keep the BGs from coming into contact with the outsiders. |
Affinity | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 06:28 am  "The rules don't have to list every available chat program to make it clear that chatting outside the game is against the rules. " Right, but the rules could say: "No chatting on any available chat program when not designated" But, instead they say: "No chatting in the chat room when not designated" Thus, people would think it is ok to chat elsewhere. |
Ocean_Islands | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 06:36 am  Read the last paragraph of my message. If you have suggestions for rules, post to the game suggestions area. You're making a mistake to blame the rules instead of the people who broke them. |
Vasix | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 06:47 am  Many of the posters have decided that ONLY they know what the rules are. And they will witch hunt out those who violated "their" rules. They drove Arreal out of the game over it. They practically lynched Gail (wasn't that vote count amazing how it came out? Gee, any cheating there?). Here's what all the Holier Than Thou Cheat Police can't handle: Host SEES it all. Its HIS game. He knows whats going on. And if HE thought that there was cheating BY A PLAYER he'd have yanked them. Host hasn't yanked a player yet. Let's see: Host makes rules. Host enforces rules. No Players sanctioned. That leads me to believe the Host doesn't BELIEVE the PLAYERS are cheating. |
Ocean_Islands | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 06:53 am  Some players broke the spirit of the rules, if you will. You'll have a hard time convincing me of anything else, and the players agree. Host is not enforcing these rules -- but so what, worse things have happened. Obviously no proof is available that these rules were broken except for accusations and confessions. "They" drove ArReal out of the game? "They" had no contact with ArReal so that argument is full of holes. I think Vykin drove ArReal out of the game by questioning whether or not her computer was broken. I also believe that Vykin got this idea because someone emailed Vykin chat discussion on this issue. And another thing: Host is female and it's her game. |
Azriel1104 | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:00 am  Or...maybe Host thinks rules were broken, but is simply giving some people a break because they seemed to lack common sense.
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Norequerdo | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:02 am  Well I would just like to quote roger (Archives October 10th 12:02) in conversation with ArReal: "I don't know, when someone walks away because they are losing or because they cant handle it anymore, that's what comes to my mind for quitter." So you are saying that Vykin drove Arreal out, what happened to ArReal finding religion??? |
Vasix | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:10 am  Ocean LOL, for the longest time I thought you were female. These gender things are hard sometimes to deciper on board. Apologies to Host, whatever gender you are. As for your "spirit of the rules". LOL! Love to have the all knowing OI sit and judge the "spirit" of the rules. As for Arreal and outside contact, she admitted she had outside contact. If Arreal left because of Vykin then that's Arreal choice. She may have left because the talk on the boards bothered her. Either that or she just, after a week got soooo upset that she I/M'd someone, that she quit. Or whatever her reason is. And the her puter problems she frequently alluded to, no secret there. |
Whit4you | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:36 am  Nadi, the RULES say they are to be sequestered - now tell me .. chatting together in IMs in private, meeting in private chat rooms out of the game area, getting outside information from friends and posting it inside the game. Do any of those sound like being sequestered to YOU? |
Affinity | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:40 am  Whit: How can you "sequester" people in an online game? Just wondering... |
Whit4you | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:42 am  Vasix, see the response of all the other BGs when they found out these guys were chatting in private chats and private IMs. And see the response out here. For anyone to say that there was no reason to believe that these folks were to be sequestered, and that their chats/ conversations would be posted for US to see. That they were to avoid posting information they learned from friends about going on out here, in there. Roger said clearly before those three met - that he believed that it was cheating and refused to go to a private room and chat. When it was written in the rules not to "meet in the fan club's chat, it was not planned for them to know how to secretly IM each other and arrange to meet in OTHER chats. I don't know sequestered means one thing to me - apparently means something different to you. |
Whit4you | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:44 am  Affinity - Roger, Moon, May and Luke have been sequestered there. |
Affinity | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:45 am  Whit I'm just playing with you. I agree with you |
Vasix | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:47 am  Whit exactly why didn't the Convent accept you? Was it a sequestering defintion issue? |
Nadi | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:51 am  Whit where to draw the line? You seemed to feel it was fine for you to email Arreal/Kearie based on how you saw her behaving within the game and your concerns about her. So its ok for you to email her about that but all other outside contact is wrong? They are being sequestered within an area of the game site. In order to mandate contact outside of the site you have to mandate no outside contact of any kind. That means Vykin has no contact with any of his friends who post here. Moondance has no contact with with Jana or any of her other friends here and Kearie should have had no contact with you, Katie or any of her other friends here etc. That wasn't done and it wasn't made clear. I don't have a problem with that in the least. It should have been done and it should have been made clear. And there should be no exceptions. |
Whit4you | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:56 am  Well I don't know about you guys, but I thought this game was a take off of big brother, on a site that at the time was about big brother, involving those watching big brotehr. Imagine if you will the BB house, where instead of us getting to watch their every move. They got to leave whenever they wanted and go to private houses to chat. They could take off their mikes whenever they wanted to say something they didn't want us to here. And they were sharing information they learned from outside the house with those inside the house, and so on. This sounds like the MTV "real world" show, NOT big brother. |
Norequerdo | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:56 am  Well as near as I can tell a lot of people were emailing ArReal "just to find out how she was". I applaud their self restraint in not discussing the game with her. And I applaud Arreal for not engaging in email discussions with these people. I certainly take them at their word when they say they never discussed the game. |
Whit4you | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 07:58 am  Nadi, my email to Kearie did not in any way discuss this game, or even WHY I was concerned about her (ie something about this game that concerned me) I understand why you can not see the difference between that, and Vyking's friends sending him messages that "Kearie's friends are cheating" and him posting THAT into their sequestered environemnt. |
Nadi | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 08:11 am  Your email to her was private and should remain so. My point was that ALL outside contact should have been terminated. The rules should be in effect for everyone. |
Norequerdo | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 08:18 am  Well it looks like Lafatme's email to Arreal isnt private any more. THIS IS TOO FUNNY. Check out in general discussions, Questions asked and Answered. AReal has been lying through her teeth yes, and those emails asking about her health. READ IT AND WEEP |
Vasix | Wednesday, October 25, 2000 - 08:19 am  Nadi keeps making perfect sense. |