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Curlyq
Member
07-10-2002
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 3:51 pm
Did anyone else see Lex on Regis & Kelly this morning? After checking out his tattoos and his blonde, leopard-spotted hair (pretty impressive dye job actually) they got around to talking about Rob. He basically said the same thing as in the above interview, at which point Kelly asked why it was okay when he did the same thing to Ethan. His answer was that he hadn't made a deal with Ethan, so the situations were different. Seems kind of flimsy to me, but I guess it made sense in his head. It is refreshing to see one of these reality people admit that it is not just a game. I always hated when the Big Brother people would keep saying that when it was so obvious their very real feelings had been hurt. Frankly, I don't even think it's a game at all. To me there's a difference between a game and a competition. Games are fun and don't leave you malnourished or bleeding. In a game you don't tell your friend that you're willing to put your friendship on the line in order to win. This is a brutal competition for a cash prize.
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Yuhuru
Member
09-27-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 3:59 pm
Oh, by the way, let me say this. I'm not rooting for Rob. I'm rooting for Alicia for no good reason other than I like how she rolls her neck I do like All Star a lot, and I've been entertained.
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Seamonkey
Member
09-07-2000
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 4:10 pm
I think Lex spoke from his heart, but his heart was speaking with a bit of a forked tongue.. since it spoke differently about Colby, Ethan and Jerri when Lex went for them.. I think he is being honest about his own hurt, but somehow glossing over hurt he caused. Yuhuru stated things beautifully about how one would want to compete.. I know I wouldn't be able to pull it off, and so I wouldn't apply, but well done, Yuhuru!!
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Cpmfinster
Member
12-01-2003
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 4:24 pm
Isn't the statement "it's just business" equivalent to "it's just a game"? I read Lex's interview and "it's not just a game" stays the line with his mantra that Boston Rob did him wrong. If he responds to the question that it is indeed "just a game" then he really can't be upset with his boot from the game. Voting Lex out was "business" to Rob (and every other Survivor, for that matter). "Just a game" & "only business" were convenient for Lex when he was giving the heave-ho to Colby, Ethan, & Jerri. Now it's not convenient because it happened to him? I wouldn't put any credibility in Lex in this situation. He gets very excitable when things don't go his way. In Africa the whole "who voted for me?" thing shows the he takes things very personally. I'm surprised he didn't change his tune after having so much time since his ouster to contemplate it. Also, he stated early on that he was playing differently this time and going to do some things the were "out of character". I took that to mean he was going to lie & betray someone, whoever that may be, at some point. You can't have it both ways. For the record, I like Lex but it was his own fault he lost.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 4:28 pm
I just love that we're getting some excitement going for this season finally cause I've been enjoying it. Well not the filler part but the rest.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 5:20 pm
It's a game. Every player gets to decide for themselves what rules and morals they will play by. Unlike the post above that says there's hundred's of pages of rules - there's not. The only confirmed rule is that they cannot deliberately physically hurt each other. That's it. Christa even let slip last season that they don't even have to share food - something I thought might be required. The contract that's always being mentioned on the spoiler boards is the NDA - the non-disclosure agreement. It has to do with their behavior outside of the game - not inside it. (NDA includes rules about stuff like not giving away who wins, not discussing anything that happens in the game after your boot, not discussing production secrets, not letting anyone know you've been cast, etc...)
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 5:24 pm
Lex set his moral line where he wanted. He decided that it was ok to not take care of his friends in this game. It was ok to vote them out in order to advance himself. It was ok as long as he didn't make false promises to them. Some folks would find this very objectionable, others would not. But it is a moral line, Lex saw it clearly. I think outside of the game, what Lex did would be objectionable. Inside the game, that's up to each player to decide for themselves. If they don't like something and they make the jury, they can use this criteria if they so choose to pick a winner.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 5:33 pm
Rob has also set his moral line - inside the game - where he wanted to. For him, it's ok to not take care of his friends in the game. But, in addition, it's also ok for himself to make false promises, even to friends, in order to advance himself in the game. Again, some folks would find this objectionable inside the game, but many would not. We've seen this done before. Rob C, Lill, Jon, Burton, Deena, are folks in recent seasons I can think of off the top of my head who've used this method. Outside the game, most would find this type of behavior wrong - again, not all.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 5:40 pm
Rob's moral line in the game is simply in a different location than Lex's. Both of their lines really go beyond what is acceptable in 'real' life. I don't judge Rob as bad or wrong because he's decided to use different rules than Lex inside the game. In the end, the Jury gets to decide. If they don't like the moral lines folks decided to use, then they can vote against them. Personally, I think the jury is more likely to decide using the 'popularity contest' method we've seen in the last few seasons. BTW - sorry for splitting this into so many posts - but we keep losing power . I lost a long post earlier and I didn't want that to happen again! 
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Jimmer
Member
08-30-2000
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 9:18 pm
The thing that I respect the most among Survivor game players is a consistent attitude in the way they treat others and how they expect to be treated themselves. I respect it if the person states that it’s only a game, it’s just business and plays the game that way and then accepts being played the same way by their opponents. A good example of this is Rich saying with considerable humor and enthusiasm “I’ve been bamboozled!” when he was voted off. I equally respect a person who decides to play a fair and honest game and then sticks to that level of play throughout the game. What I don’t respect is the player who wants it both ways – who says it’s just a game when he is on one side of the fence eliminating friends/opponents and then gets upset when he is eliminated in the same manner. Having said all of this, I still like Lex as I get the impression that he is a decent person, with similar frailties and doubts that many of us deal with.
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Tobor7
Member
07-19-2002
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 11:31 pm
Spear smartly stated: But what about how you act in confessionals? Is there any reason an honest person would lie or pretend to be a jerk in private? Is that still part of the game? Yes. What of it? I totally forgot about that part. What is the purpose of being a tihs in the pvt interviews? It has no effect on the outcome of the game. Why not garner sympathy for yourself from the viewers? Why? Because your personality just won't LET YOU DO IT. You can't help yourself. You can't hide your personality when it does NOT count. It just spills out and dribbles down the side.
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Tobor7
Member
07-19-2002
| Tuesday, April 13, 2004 - 11:38 pm
Caycaye smartly stated: From observation (as if I were one of the contestants and not privy to camera confessionals) I probably WOULD be fooled by Rob...but also, there is a part of me, that if I had been in Tom's position the day that Rob was ridiculing Rupert behind his back about being obsessed with the best fishing ability....a red flag would have gone up in my head...things like that always lead me to ponder someone's true character. When someone acts differently behind someone else's back, I always think, "what must he say about my flawed self?" I don't trust people like that. So what was Rob's strategy in badmouthing Rupert to Tom? To make Tom feel closer to him and trust him over Rupert? I agree with you. That moment was a clear "tell" on Rob's personality. I think most people would have seen that. (For the record, I enjoy watching Rob on the show and I hope that he wins the game. That said, I think we are getting a good view of what he is really like. I'm sure there will be more evidence to come.)
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Kaili
Member
08-31-2000
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 7:15 am
Obviously they can set their moral bar where they want for the game, but they need to understand that, game or not, there are consequences. You may walk away with a lot of money, but you don't walk away with a lot of friends. It's very hard to put aside your feelings for a short time, much less 30+ days. If you're going into Survivor with a bunch of people you've never met, I can see how you may be able to pull it off and play as just a game- like Brian did. He had no emotional investment in any of the other players because they hadn't met. In this one, there is all the emotional baggage being brought in. I can say with no doubt that I personally, if I were playing, could not put that aside. Look at Jerri- her vengence for Colby was obsessive (shown after he was voted out).
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March
Member
10-02-2003
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 8:45 am
You would think they would have made this clear to each other before the game started. That any decisions made during the game for or against the other person, they were not going to bring their friendship into it.
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Rupertbear
Member
09-19-2003
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 10:31 am
Well, this show goes to prove that some people will even set aside their morals just for the winners purse. Speaking of Colby...I have to admire the guy, that he did NOT compromise his values in order to win the game. Some people may think he's a fool and be willing to suspend their beliefs, in order to win money but I think he was a very honourable player and I think the most highly of him, out of all the people who have played this game. He was true his values and thought more of himself than the payoff.
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Pcakes2
Member
08-29-2001
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 11:02 am
I won't debate the "is it a game?" / "not just a game" issue, but what it is for me is simply a TV show. It's an hour of entertainment every week.
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Guinevere
Member
03-15-2001
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 1:38 pm
Lots of interesting stuff to respond to: >The thing that I respect the most among Survivor game players is a consistent attitude in the way they treat others and how they expect to be treated themselves.< I think this is an excellent point. I have no problem with the "it's just a game" philosophy - it's one I pretty much subscribe to myself. What I have a problem with is the hypocrisy of so many players (Lex being just the latest example) who don't follow the Golden Rule. I also have a problem with players who are excessively cocky about lying and cheating (Boston Rob - more in him in a minute, Hatch, Jon from last season). But that's more just that such players annoy me. >What is the purpose of being a tihs in the pvt interviews? It has no effect on the outcome of the game...<snip>Because your personality just won't LET YOU DO IT. You can't help yourself. You can't hide your personality when it does NOT count. It just spills out and dribbles down the side.< I sort of disagree. I don't know that the cockiness we've seen from Boston Rob, for instance, is his real personality. A facet of his personality, perhaps, or perhaps just a facade that he puts on for whatever reason. There seem to be certain players who relish their roles as the villain and act accordingly in interviews. I don't necessarily think these people act that way in their daily lives (well, I'm not so sure about Jon...) I may just be blinded by Boston Rob's hotness (I've had a love-hate relationship going back to his season of Survivor - I love his sweaty hotness but dislike his arrogance), but I felt that he was being sincere in his discussion with Lex and Kathy this past episode. If he wasn't, he's a great actor. He seemed to genuinely feel bad. I felt he was honest when he was talking to them and his interview was just macho bravado crap. That may just be wishful thinking on my part, I suppose. >Well, this show goes to prove that some people will even set aside their morals just for the winners purse.< I disagree. To me, it's akin to playing poker. If one bluffs in poker, is one setting aside one's morals?
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Seamonkey
Member
09-07-2000
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 3:05 pm
Readers and posters in this thread should check out this thread, then return and perhaps comment.. ../9204/1357645.html"#E7EFEF"> | Luvmyjrt
Member
09-18-2003
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 4:01 pm
Oh my, Brian loves his new Thesaurus in that thread, Seamonkey! A hoot to read, though!
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Caycaye
Member
09-14-2001
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 4:30 pm
Guinevere, I pretty much agree with what you just posted...I, too, at one time, anyway, kind of liked Rob's sweaty cuteness...but his arrogance gave way to my disdain of him almost altogether. I agree with ypu that a bluff in poker game is similar to them lying to each other by omission and maybe even out and out lying to each other....but to LAUGH and ridicule behind the person's back is immature and shows a lack of character to me. So, even though I would love to applaud Rob's game-playing at times...I just can't....given his arrogance and seeming lack of remorse. (Even though...I was STILL trying to give Rob the benefit of the doubt....just like you...I THOUGHT he looked sincerely sorry when he was talking to Lex, and then that camera interview!!! BLECH!!!!) NOT NECESSARY ROB!!!! Why can't you play with some humility... Even though Lex totally over-reacted to Rob's betrayal, IMO, he SURELY can't find it easy to forgive him after watching Rob ridicule Lex's gullibleness...
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Bonzacat
Member
07-08-2003
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 6:37 pm
I don't mean to just pick on Brian's answers in the link Seamonkey provided, but.... if you close your eyes can't you just hear these words uttered by YODA? Brian Heidik: Do not be held a cheat, even though it is impossible to live today without being one. Better prudent, than crafty: to be smooth in your way is to please everybody, but not everybody of your own house. To have the name of a man who knows what should be done, is honorable, and inspires trust, but to have that of being a sham, is disreputable, and engenders mistrust. I would say it's all a game to Brian at the moment! 
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Landi
Member
07-29-2002
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 9:27 pm
i thought maybe he was "Caine" from "Kung Fu"
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Lancecrossfire
Moderator
07-13-2000
| Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 9:54 pm
The very first thing Brain points out is that he has a column he writes. He wants us to read it, and won't give any answers for free--just like he wouldn't do all-star survivor without being paid. I think he's just a business man not willing to give any of his product away for free, and this is his way of thumbing his nose at us. As we've seen from articles posted by Brain since AS Survivor started, he is more than willing to give his opinion (and one that anyone can understand) on the game. Another way to look at the issue of it being just a game or not. Look at the way MB approaches it. Survivor is a TV show as much as it is anything. It has to be set up to be watched by many people--the rules and the way it's played is changed in part because of that. Real games--baseball, football, basketball, golf, volleyball--when they are shown on TV, there are no gimmicks concerning the game involved. Also, MB wants it to be an experience and not just a number of competitions played out. For me, that means that for MB and others involved, it's not just a game. I realize many who watch it take it as nothing more though. Just like some who watch football see it as just a game. Some get into the face painting and arguing with anyone who roots for someone other than their team--they take it as more than a game. Confessionals--either in Survivor or in BB. I think they are there fora couple reasons. One is the entertainment factor. We get to see them free of concerns of what they say--and in that can come a certain amount of possible entertainment value. Another reason I think they are there is for therapy to help them make it through the game--the process of playing. Everyone is on guard--never knowing if they can trust someone--even those they made an alliance with. Most act out of norm at least a little--even if it's holding their tongue a bit more than usual. For 40 days (Survivor) or 100 days (BB) most people couldn't do that without an outlet. Most people wouldn't do very well either without being able to say something and not be judged for it. They need that time to "vent", or go bonkers. In situations of duress, most people revert to their default settings--their guard is down, they are not able to hold up as many fronts. Note this isn't 100% of people--it is a high percentage though. Get people hungry, tired, cold or hot--if you go too far they just get over whelmed. but before they get to that point, you usually see more of who they really are.
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Sunshyne4u
Member
06-17-2003
| Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 12:19 am
I agree... and I would further suggest that part of this "time to vent" is to just say whatever pops into your mind, no matter how condescending or mocking it is. Lex seemed very arrogant to me in HIS confessionals. It is a sad thing that he now feels that he must put blame on others for his poor decisions. ** I found last season the RUPERT show...and many of his private confessionals were not exactly complimentary of the other contestants. Jenna and Heidi were awful in their confessionals during their seasons. I really do think that Boston Rob is getting a raw deal in editing. ** During the last TC Rob really looked unhappy and concerned at how Lex appeared to be taking things personally. I wonder if Rob will be reassessing how he is going to be perceived when the public sees his confessionals. Could we see a new, more politically correct version of the Robfather in the upcoming episodes?? Surely he knows that he HAS TO tone it down or face banishment. Tomorrow shall tell.
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Kep421
Member
08-11-2001
| Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 5:19 am
I agree that backstabbing and lying are an integral part of this game. There is no getting around it. Lots of game players have done it, and done it well. However...NONE have done it with such joy as BostonRob. He takes absolute delight in making fun of other tribe members, which to me is the worst. Rob doesn't ridicule the others because he thinks he will go further in the game, he does it simply because he enjoys it. Same holds true for the backstabbing and lying. While others do such things to stay in the game, some of them do feel the need to justify their actions by saying "its only a game". Rob on the other hand, has no such need. He enjoyed what he did to Lex, and the fact that it got him what he wanted was just an added perk.
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