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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 6:45 pm
I said this in another thread but Lex and company have given Rob too much power by saving Amber. Having a voting block of 2 isn't good. They should've broken them up. Hopefully one of them will see the light in the next couple of shows.
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Blacksheep
Member
10-18-2003
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 8:07 pm
Conspiracy Theory Alert It was a fixer! Even with Jiffy's remarks about how coincidental it was that the teams happen to pull the exact colors to keep the tribes the same with the exception of Amber. Didn't convince me it was luck the outcome happened the way it did. He seemingly tried to play it off like it wasn't intentional...but was it? If you look at the buffs pulled from the jar they appear to have been laid flat inside the container (one on top of another), essentially pre-determining by the order of line up, which color would go to whom. Add that to how much play Rob/Amber’s little romance was getting, it seems like intentional drama to spice up the season. I dunno, maybe it’s just me, but it all just seemed TOO coincidental for my liking. **Notice the buffs as they were pulled out (a few of the players didn’t have clear shots of the ‘hand withdrawl’ so didn’t include those or where folded over upon withdrawl i.e. from wrapping around the thumb from the grab)
See how it 'unfolds' as it's being removed
Clear fold
Folded!
Snafooey - I'd say folded again. If anyone rewatches the episode, it is clear even after the removal from the jar that they are folded (If I need I'll post those too if there are any nay-sayers about my theory!) So was the tribe switcharoo a fix or just really darn coincidental?
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Rupertbear
Member
09-19-2003
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 8:40 pm
I definitely agree Blacksheep. They may say that the buffs were folded in order to get them to all fit but I'm sure they'd fit in there irregardless of being folded or not. I also feel the neck of the jar was just wide enough for them to dip their hand in for a buff...they weren't able to really move the hand around to 'rummage' for one.
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Curlyq
Member
07-10-2002
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 8:48 pm
Blacksheep I got that impression the minute I saw it happen. The PTB weren't trying to mix up the tribes, but just deliver one of Chapera's members to Mogo Mogo. Well, Old Mogo Mogo showed them! They cut their own tribe down anyway. The only thing that couldn't be fixed was which two tribe members Chapera would choose as numbers 5 and 6. They might as well have just had Chapera draw straws to see who goes, but I guess this way they also got an excuse to have the two tribes switch homes and possessions. In any event this all felt way too manipulated for my liking. If it had been a completely random drawing that would've been more fun. All alliances would've shifted. This felt more like they were targeting Chapera for punishment.
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Ark
Member
07-10-2001
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:16 pm
I'm not sure that Jeri is in a "band". From the web site, it looks more like a group. I counted 23 people in the picture. A quick check of the bio page tells that the group was born from Burning Man. Jeri isn't playing drums like Ringo did. She's playing bongo's and doing stuff with fire. Jeri goes by the name "Kalamitee". It looks like an odd group. If you want to check them out they are here http://www.mutaytor.com/
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Pamy
Member
01-02-2002
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:17 pm
it is a game show..they have big time rules against that sort of thing
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Crossfire
Member
08-07-2001
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:18 pm
Provide evidence that the contestants were lined in a predetermined order, and I'll go along with it. The folding could just be so that when someone grabbed one, they did not have three fall on the ground as they were removed.
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Karuuna
Member
08-31-2000
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:30 pm
I seem to recall Jeff saying specifically to the Survivors to "line up in any order" as they returned from their picnics.... didn't he already have the jar with the new buffs in hand at that time? Admittedly, the way it turned out made for an excrutiatingly boring twist... IMO. I'm guessing if they wanted to manipulate it, they would have forced more changes in the tribes.
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Starshine40
Member
07-30-2002
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:36 pm
If this "switch" was a set-up then that stinks! It would have been soooo much more interesting if there had been a total mixup of the whole bunch ending with 2 men and 3 women on each tribe. A lot more possiblities for alliances to switch that way also. Now I look for the OLD chapera tribe to wipe the (jungle) floor with the old mogo mogos.
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Blacksheep
Member
10-18-2003
| Friday, April 02, 2004 - 9:58 pm
Crossfire - the predetermined order thing is in re: to this thought. Initially the order was a lineup chosen by each tribe. Ending with the following selections (selector named first) Lex/Rob, Tom/Jerri, ShiAnn/Rupert, Alicia/Kathy, Jenna/Amber. Upon return (Jeff did say any order- though the audio sounds funny, like perhaps an audio add-in after-the-fact), both teams are lined up in order of the picks - Lex, Rob, Tom, Jerri, ShiAnn, Kathy, Alicia, Jenna, Amber (Ok the last four could have gone either way, as they were last man out). However, they were lined up in relative order, this is where some speculation has to take place, we have to consider CBS planned to have them re-line up in this order (because of how everyone shifted to their position in line = pick selection), which doesn't seem odd as it is matched up with their private convo time, but by having them line up in the manner they did, it give CBS the opportunity to layer the buffs before the tribes return - essentially fixing the outcome. Like I said it's a conspiracy theory, and I've strapped on the ole tinfoil hat, and just like swiss cheese my theory isn't without holes - that's why it's my theory! lol
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Kitt
Member
09-06-2000
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 1:35 am
This all sounds a little too paranoid to me! The producers might have guessed that the pairs would have lined up together, but it was just chance that they lined up Mogo/Chapera, Mogo/Chapera, ... Plus they didn't know which two would be the extra players, so they didn't know Amber would be one of the final two. Also, who's to say that the current combination is any more or less 'interesting' than any other combination would have been? Putting Lex and Rob on one team to compete for alpha male would have been interesting. As would a tribe consisting of strong headed women, such as Kathy, Jerri, Shi-Ann and Alicia. I just think they've realised that things that happen by chance are as good television as anything they could manufacture. Now if you'd have said that there was a suggestion to the new Chapera team that they drop Jerri instead of Amber, I might have believed you!
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Lauram
Member
07-13-2000
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 7:55 am
Whenever I pick a number or any object out of the jar, I NEVER pick from the top.
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Kappy
Member
06-29-2002
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 8:08 am
Blacksheep ~ I had the exact same reaction and thought when I watched it. But mostly, I kept wondering why the survivors didn't try to mix them up a little as they reached inside. But while I agree it looks fixed, I think the editing of making a big deal out of Amber and Rob came after they were finished filming. So knowing that Amber ends up being switched in tribes, they could go back and build the romance up in the editing to make it that much more dramatic.
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Justalittlebean
Member
08-15-2003
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 8:50 am
You are so right Blacksheep. The producers knew what they were doing. They have really been playing Rob and Ambers romance. Just needed more drama. I realized this soon as I saw it and reviewed the tape. Totally a set up.
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Kaili
Member
08-31-2000
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 9:30 am
They may not have been laid flat on top of eachother. What if they were folded, but all facing up (like CDs in a case to try to make sense here).
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Hukdonreality
Member
09-29-2003
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 11:38 am
I agree with Kitt...and, cries of a "set-up" is apparently the theme of all of the reality shows this year. The Apprentice, the Batchelor, Batchelorette, the Mole, ALL have been acused of being set-ups with pre-selected winners. Hogwash, I say... Actually, even if they were proven to be just that, I'd still watch 'em!
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Catfat
Member
02-27-2002
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 11:43 am
Just goes to show how boring this season is, if the best story line they could come up with is Rob & Amber. Yawn. I'll keep watching, though, hoping I'll get caught up in the program again. Maybe when the tribes merge, we'll see some real playing and less under-the-radar stuff. Maybe Rupert will be a pirate and show his strength and power again. Maybe Lex and Big Tom will form an alliance and boot the other men out. Maybe ----what?
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Duckie
Member
09-13-2000
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 11:52 am
Jerri said in her chat, they did not have to take the buffs on top, so they could have dug around, and maybe they chose not to. They didn't tell them to line up in any order either, so while it is very strange, I do not think it was a set up
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Ketchuplover
Member
08-30-2000
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 6:30 pm
Double immunity this coming epiosode!!!
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 8:17 pm
The probability of them picking the buffs the way they did is 1 out of 252. While there are many other combinations that were possible, none were more likely than the one that happened. During each buff pick the odds of the person picking the color they did were 50% or better. It wasn't set up. I'm pretty darn sure production WANTED the tribes to be mixed more than they were. This result makes the show more boring, not more exciting. The whole purpose of a twist is to shake things up - that's why they started using. It's because Survivor does not fix things that they were stuck with this sucky result. The odds on how they picked (from a SS post): Lex - 50% to pick Red (5 red buffs out of 10 total buffs in urn) Rob - 55.5% to pick Green (5 green of 9 total remaining) Tom - 50% to pick Green (4 green of 8) Jerri - 57.1% to pick Red (4 red of 7) Shii - 50% to pick Red (3 red of 6) Rupert - 60% to pick Green (3 green of 5) Kathy - 50% to pick Red (2 red of 4) Alicia - 66.6% to pick Green (2 green of 3) Jenna - 50% to pick Green (1 green of 2) Amber - 100% to pick Red (1 red of 1) Notice every pick had a 50% or better chance of occuring. Simple odds.
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Sunshyne4u
Member
06-17-2003
| Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 1:12 am
The fact that the contestants were lined up the way they were was the MOST fishy to me. I still agree with the conspiracy theory as stated above. The buffs were obviously folded and put one ontop of each other. ** Considering the boring result of the buff-pull, I am surprised they werent asked to return them all to the jar and made to do it all again. The producers make them redo competitions to get better angles and retakes, I dont see a difference here.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 10:15 am
They can't do that (re-draw). There are LAWS against it. this is not just a entertainment show. They follow LAWS set up for game shows following the quiz show scandals way back when. So if the result is borring, they are stuck with it. The producers also do NOT make they re-do competitions. The results of the competitions are the results. They do have 'stand-ins' that are occationally used for from the sky shots. Or used to show the example shot of how the challange works (like when we saw someone fall off the rolling log as JP described the rules). They in NO WAY alter the results of the competition to make it more entertaining to the viewers. That's why we have borring seasons (Like Thailand, and now All-stars) because all their planned twists and turns fall flat. The producers are not allowed to change things or alter the plans of the shows structure half way through filming to try to make it more interesting. MB was nearly sucessfully sued the first season by making voting suggesting to contestants. He doesn't want to be sued again, and they now follow the game show rules with extreme strictness.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 10:24 am
There are a lot of unhappy people in the Survivor production staff. They leak all sorts of stories of low pay and crappy treatment by the producers. They also leaked the results of who make up the F2 for three seasons running now, along with many, many inside secreats. (Like that Sue Hawk complaing of sexual harrassment and wanted to sue.) Yet, absolutely no one from production has ever leaked that it's all fixed. They all say the staff bends over backwards to follow gameshow rules. I would think if they did all this leaking on other topics, including who's final 2 they would be equally or more likely to leak the fact that it is all fixed - yet we never hear the barest whisper. Anyway - probabilities is probabilities. There was no out come MORE likely to occur than the one that did. If they wanted to fix it, they would have lined them up better. And they definately didn't want this show to get even more borring - which it did...
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Sunshyne4u
Member
06-17-2003
| Monday, April 05, 2004 - 3:04 pm
Actually, it was the first season that I remember the outcry over 'retakes' of the comps. However, the producers may not have changed the outcomes. ** Oh well, it is unfortunate that the line up buff draw was such a flub. I am getting so bored with this show I might just GO TO THE SPOILER SECTION!! and read read read!! Yes, you saw it here folks..... Sunshyne MIGHT voluntarily SPOIL HERSELF!! sigh......never thought I'd even consider it LOL
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Azriel
Member
08-01-2000
| Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 7:53 am
I had to miss this week's episode because I was out of town. Thank you soooooo much to the people that spoiled the show. You did such a good job that I felt like I could see what happened even though I didn't get to watch it. You guys are the best!
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Kappy
Member
06-29-2002
| Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 8:28 am
Aw, Sunshyne ~ I too was tempted just now to go look for that final 2 spoiler but I'm afraid of WHO it will say and then I would be stomping my feet around the house.
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Costacat
Member
07-15-2000
| Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 8:11 pm
Lex has never been my favorite player, and I do think he's not acting in the best of interests (as he claims to be) when letting people know they are gonna be voted off. I think he's doing it with the endgame in sight -- if he treats people real nice and if he makes it to the final two, maybe they'll remember how nice he was and vote to give him the big bux. Still, I think he's playing a horrible game. Still, I was so glad to see Jerri go buh bye! Rob and Amber. Gak. Ack! Hairball! Sorry... that is just royally disgusting. Boston Rob gives me the willies (I so cannot imagine bedding that man... would he EVER shut up?). WRT Rupert... I surely do hope that playing the "doofus" is strategy. And I pray to the kitty kat gods that the spoilers are wrong about the F2. This season is one big old yawn... Too predictable.
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