Archive through May 21, 2002
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The ClubHouse: Archives: Thoughts on the Finale & Reunion Show: Archive through May 21, 2002

Car54

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:01 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Moon I agree with you and Grooch and Wink (and I am sure Fruitbat will agree with me).

I think MB totally set us up and I hope he doesn't do it again.

Spear

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:16 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
(Car, that's Penpoint you've agreed with.)

Lance, I can accept the possibility that Vee just didn't talk about her strategy to the camera (and the producers didn't pick up on her strategy to prod her about it). I think that's more likely than MB deciding to cut out footage. Oh, and the bit with Jeff asking for a receipt from the cab driver did get a laugh out of me so it wasn't completely wasted. :-)

Jbean

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:25 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
ok, here is my thing. what is up with these people who make asses out of themselves because they are mad that they aren't the ones up there? ie, tammy, john....from the last survivor kelly? it's bad enough that they didn't win, but then to make a total ass out of yourself on national television? what purpose does that serve?

also i was disappointed in rosie as the host. she did leave several people out. she didn't even ask if any of the jury regretted the way they voted, etc. and not to mention gina, patricia, robert, peter and zoe were overlooked. it would have been nice to have learned a little more about their lives now, rather than just a recap of the survivor episodes.

i wanted kathy to win too, i would have picked neleh over vee though. even though the outcome wasn't what i wanted, it was cool as hell that the final three were women. JMO

Car54

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:49 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Ok, I give up.
Would it be ok with everyone if I enjoyed the whole series, I am glad Vee won, I think she deserves it, I am not mad at anyone nor do I resent anyone and I would totally watch Survivor again in the fall! Sorry guys!

Moondance

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:55 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Car

Julieboo

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 04:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Well okay, but only if I can enjoy The Amazing Race

How many more days til S5?

Car54

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 05:03 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Not long enough, Julie.

Seamonkey

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 05:14 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I think the FINALE isn't really for us, the most attentive and rabid of fans.. It was a big, hyped event with a big and hyped host with big and hyped scenes like the helicopter and that was all for the more casual viewer who maybe didn't see ever show and this way, they got caught up on the "highlights" and "lowlights" and saw who won.

We already know about that stuff so we longed to get updates on all of the survivors, see their families. hear questions and answers that gave us more information, analysis, insight and so on.

I also feel cheated by MB for a number of things.. especially the finale.

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The rock decision was cheezy. Period.

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The thing Sean kept saying about Vee crossing him several times.. There was only ONE time that they voted differently at tribal council, so regardless of the supposed lack of alliance there was only one "cross" that I can see.

Yuhuru

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 05:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I loved s4 it was very entertaining and unpredictable !

Kathy, my pick, didn't win. But generally my picks (in anything) don't win so I can deal with it.

I wasn't upset by Vee's win. She played the game. I was surprised she made the deal with Neleh, but even as a kathy fan I can admit that nothing they had was solid. Give me a break a day or two before, Kathy clearly sided with N&P.
I didn't see any loyalty from anyone. Felt bad for pap, but he chose his fate by not being willing to sell Neleh out & I didn't see her volunteering.

I'm gonna take a bold step and speak for some African Americans(so for those who disagree I'm not speaking for you). African Americans are pleased that Vee won, and I'll predict that African American viewership of Survivor will increase. Many AA have felt that minorities weren't portrayed fairly on reality shows. Some also felt like Survivor wasn't something that black folks do. So I don't think Vee spoke out of turn last night. I believe that she was reiterating what people on the streets have told her. My husband paid so much more attention to Survivor simply because Sean was on, and he was black. But this shouldn't be seen as negative to non blacks/AA. Talking about race/mentioning race is not always a bad thing. I think that's the point that Sean was trying to make. It seems like some non blacks want black folks/AA to forget we're black. We can't there's way too much pride in our past, present and future journey to do so. Please try not to be offended because it's not meant to offend. I wasn't offended & I wasn't even rooting for Vee, but I understood what she meant.

As a Christian I truly believe that God is not petty, and he does not pick & choose who's going to win this or that, But I do believe that by believing in his love for you and tapping into his strength you can do things that you never thought you could, like Kathy hanging on for 4 hours, Sean swimming, diving and picking up a stone, Pappy and Sean forming a bond, Neleh having the confidence to make a pivotal move on day 24, etc. Maybe I'm wrong(ha), but I think Vee was talking about what God did for her by enabling this to be possible where she couldn't fathom it based on her insecurities, etc. I was so pleased to hear the name Jesus as many times as I did this Survivor. Talk about embracing diversity. Tolerance doesn't mean making people identical. It means everybody is themsleves, uses their own Jargon, doing their own thing, and people don't gripe about it. So I say let 'em say, "Thank You Jesus," "My balls, my balls," "Bible thumpers," "Oh my heck!," "I didn't like you from the beginning" That's what made this show great.

And while we're here whining and moaning, they were all hugging each other and jumping for joy grabbing the keys to their new SUVs.

See ya in Thailand !!! I can't wait. By the way Kathy looked Great!

Weinermr

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:32 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Oh well, I'm coming late to the dance with my comments. I agree with major parts of what Wink, Grooch, Car, and Kar said, and I won't repeat what has already been said a number of times.

I do feel cheated that we didn't get to know Vee better before she swooped in at the end and won the prize, and I do have many reservations about how she conducted herself, but I don't begrudge her the win.

I also don't have any problem with the way Paschal was voted off. The Survivor's were told they had to come to a unanimous decision, or EVERYONE was fair game. If I were Paschal and I wanted to stay, I would have spoken up very loudly on my own behalf at that point. It would have also been the perfect opportunity to test the true strength of the Paschal/Neleh alliance. Would Neleh sacrifice herself for the sake of Pappy? Did she indeed do so? No. She was acting all on her own behalf at that point. Although she stated she would never vote for Paschal, her actions put him at risk, and gave her a better chance of staying. Of course that purple rock could have ended up in someone else's hand, but it didn't. Paschal put himself on the chopping block, and out he went. Just my two cents.

Whit4you

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:43 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Folks folks folks - VEE did NOT promise to go to the end with Kathy - KATHY promised to take VEE to the final two if VEE did not vote her out during that TC. I can not understand how VEE should owe Kathy a favor for NOT voting Kathy out? I really dont. I watched the show and Kathy was doing a desperate manuever to stay in by offering to take VEE to the final two over Neleh if Vee didnt vote her out. She somehow turned Vee not voting her out into a favor Vee owed her - ie taking Kathy to the final two.

Mamaanja

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:49 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yuhuru!
Well said. Thank you for some much needed clarity.

Pamy

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:57 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
My thoughts....
1. This finale started dragging the last hour, probably cuz it was mostly Vee and Neleh, who, to me, were BORING!! and that walk with the names on the sticks, come on! with the budget MB gets for these now, he can't come up with something more clever to be able to show clips of the losers?
2. I still think Vee is fake, and says/does whatever she needs to at the moment. The way she kept saying Jesus helped her was really irking me, I am sure Jesus' hands were pretty busy after 9-11. I will eat my words when I hear how Vee donated a lot of money to the church.
3. Sean just keeps getting better, Teacher of the year!!! I hope he goes far in life
4. I kept wondering why Darma(of Darma and Greg)was on stage until I realized it was Neleh
5. Kathy looked great, so did Gina
6. If John would have askeed why to vote for me I would have said "If you vote for me I will donate 100,000 to your favorite charity"..I know they are not allowed to make money deals with each other but I wonder if the charity thing would fly
7. Overall my 2nd favorite Survivor
Thanks to everyone here for making it even more fun!!!!!!
ps....How do you think they will start the next survivor? MB hinted to a new way they will start, maybe all in same tribe for 1st 14 days????

Lancecrossfire

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:59 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
The more comments I read, the more I'm convinced MB is going a great job with the show.

There was only one program that we all saw--yet therre are so many views and perspectives on each player, the rules, the strategies--everything. MB's job is to entertain as many people as possible, while making the game tough/interesting for the players and those who just like to watch a game.

Talking about trying to please everyone--it just can't be done. Yet in all of it, there are millions watching and just aboput as many different opinions--lol. For all of the problems we've all expressed, most have also expressed something they like, or cxan relate to, or something that grabs their attention.

Even the reunion show creates so much feelings. Isn't that what MB wants though--for as many of us as possible to feel something about all of it? I think he succeeds in mant few could, and our interest proves it (and the interest of a few million others).

I like the way this show gets me going about a game and the people in it--and about the folks here to have som many great things to say.

Karuuna

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 07:29 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Car wrote: <<Would it be ok with everyone if I enjoyed the whole series, I am glad Vee won, I think she deserves it, I am not mad at anyone nor do I resent anyone and I would totally watch Survivor again in the fall! Sorry guys! >>

It's okay with me! And just for the record, I don't think you need to apologize. We all have different opinions, and that we can all share them is one of the things I love about this place!

Viva la diversity! Or some French saying. Or some Jewish gay African-American middle-aged white woman thing.

Luv ya all! I'm out!

Knightpatti

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 07:59 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
It was a great Survivor and we were in suspense until the end. Vee won. Congratulations to her. It is game and win how ever you can. It is luck plus the decisions you make and some have to made quick. What I have enjoyed besides the show is reading all of your thoughts and posts. A big thank you to all of you!

Prettywomen

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 08:24 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Well what a speech Yuhura, Survivor is for anyone, any race, any religion and the more variety the better it is...We are all Very Unique and that is what makes this planet so special...Vee was woman of color....She outwitted, outplayed won so my hats off to her...But don't make her out to be the blessed Virgin Mary. Most people have some sort of faith whether they are straight forward with it or private with it...She was no more than any one else...God may or may not played a role in her win...If you ask me I think it was probably God and some good old fasshion good luck...Pappy may have won if he didn't get that purple rock...Kathy May have won if she didn't get greedy towards the end and make a bad deal with Vee right in front of the others...

Prettywomen

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 08:27 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Goodnight all see ya in thailand in the fall...Can't wait

Sia

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 10:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
"Kathy checked her bags!!" ROTFL, Car! I've never heard that expression before. It's become my favorite. Thanks for the humor. It seemed to me like Neleh told Kathy she was exposed, just HOPING Kath would get distracted and fall. It worked, too. That was mean of Neleh, IMO.

Car54

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 11:00 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Wasn't that what Neleh said? I thought when she looked down and Kathy's shirt was open, I thought that was what she said to her and Kathy reached down to grab her shirt. Maybe I was hearing things.

Given all the comments we had about Kathy and her no-bra look, it seemed like it was appropriate.

Catfat

Monday, May 20, 2002 - 11:23 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
When asked what she would do with the money, Vee among other things, mentioned tithing to the church. That means 10% which means $100,000. Maybe that will make up to Jesus for all the lies she told. Haha
I will bite my tongue if I am wrong, but I am thinking she is not going to donate that kind of money. I know I wouldn't.
Vee looked pretty last night, I thought.

Seamonkey

Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 09:29 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I'd bet Vee and Neleh will tithe from their winnings.

And tax-wise it isn't a bad thing anyway.

Vee said the wisest thing.. getting a financial advisor first off..

Webkitty

Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 09:56 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think Vee will do what she said and contribute.

Car, LOL! My husband insists that Neleh told her to watch her shirt on purpose to throw off her concenstration.

I didn't get to watch the tape of the show on the "big screen" until last night.
I picked up a few nuances I missed Sunday night.

Did anyone else think that Jeff was perturbed at the turn of events at the last IC?

He is a smooth professional and hid it well, but when Kathy fell off, and then the Vee and Neleh thing went down, he seemed a little ruffled at the turn of events. He said something like, well, I guess we have a new alliance now!

Like, they, (MB and Jeff and the powers that be that were overseeing the events on the island) thought for sure that Kathy would take this. (and had been editing accordingly) and now there was nothing on Vee.

Ok, I know I'm reaching, but where else can I go and just ramble this? LOL

Also, I missed how worn out at the end Kathy was, and actually it looked like Vee was starting to tire as well. Only Neleh looked like she could have REALLY hung on all night. (IMO)

After seeing this I can understand a little more (I think) why Vee made the deal. I don't think she had it in her to outlast Neleh, and she knew it.
Rather than take a chance that Neleh would win w/o a deal, and maybe take Kathy instead of her, she jumped on it.

Maybe if she had held on a little more, and THEN made the deal w/Neleh it wouldn't have seemed so back-stabbish (and the look that Kathy gave her said just that)

Don't want to beat a dead horse, just some things I noticed after watching the tape.

Seamonkey

Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 11:01 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Yes.. I thought the same.. if she hung on awhile longer then did the deal but it was done before Kathy could even stand up straight.. that had to hurt.. and of course she later said she could have hung on indefinitely (Vee).

Oh well. Dead horse indeed.

Jeff was definitely more "opinionated" and did more "narrative" this time.. but if they were perturbed.. well GOOD!! I get the idea MB was delighted ..

But remember, they did all this editing after they knew F2 and even the winner.. so my guess is either they purposely edited out much of Vee's stuff OR, she didn't give them much.

Fruitbat

Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 11:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I doubt Vee gave them much. It strikes me that all her talk of strategy is after the fact and she was really just wininging it, so did not reveal this to the camera.