Archive through May 20, 2003
TV ClubHouse: Archive: American Idol (FOX):
How does this article make you feel.:
Archive through May 20, 2003
Sadiesmom | Saturday, May 17, 2003 - 11:52 pm     Makes me feel disgusted. Admitting what people suspected all along. ‘Idol’ Worship Here are the pertinenet parts Simon’s never been much for chitchat, but he’s particularly on edge now because of something strange occurring onstage. Kimberley Locke, who most everyone believes is a long shot to make it to the finals, is singing the pants off Ruben Studdard. Clay Aiken isn’t at his best, but Studdard is really off. His rendition of Peabo Bryson’s “If Ever I’m in Your Arms Again” is so obviously uninspired that the judges are clearly worried. They even tell him to take off his distracting hat and sing again, even though the judges almost never comment on performers before the show. “We have a problem,” Cowell is overheard carping outside the soundstage later. “I want Ruben to be in the final two, and Kimberley just had a great rehearsal.” and He’s not moved at all by the hysterics inside. “If there’s tears,” he says, “it’s tears of relief.” Cowell is feeling relieved himself. While Ruben was clearly better on camera than he was during rehearsal, Kimberley still outsang him. Yet Cowell muzzled his praise for her and spared Ruben his trademark venom. “When there’s only three left, you are going to be slightly tactical,” Cowell admits. “What you’re trying to do, if you can, is to tell the audience who you want to be in the final. You’re not getting accurate judging. You’re not.” Let that be a lesson, America: stop listening to what Simon says. Of course, it’s already too late for that. ----------------------------------------------------------- OH Yeah and don't for get this little tidbit, Clay fans . Despite all those papers in the bowls, there were only four songs per contestant, all carefully chosen to suit the singers’ vocal style and range. “There wasn’t ‘The Macarena’ in there or anything,” says Lythgoe. “It wasn’t going to be stupid.” |
Crossfire | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 12:18 am     Feeling fine. Thanks for the article. |
Wcv63 | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 12:54 am     Well it really only confirmed what most believed to be true. Simon and Co have been pushing Ruben in the media and it's not only obvious, it's egregious. |
Muse | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 01:28 am     I'm surprised that Simon would actually admit it, but I already believed that Simon was being very selective with his comments (even if it meant not being honest) to try to produce certain results. I'm really not a fan of that (mainly because Simon hasn't been upfront about it -- for example, I think it was fine for him to say he thought the competition wouldn't be the same without Ruben in the final two last week, but he shouldn't have said that Ruben did a fantastic job with his individual songs if he didn't actually believe it), and think it's unfair to the contestants who put a lot of faith into his comments and advice, but...what can you do? Try to keep an open mind, and make your own decisions based on what *you* think. And remember that the judges are biased and might have ulterior motives at times. |
Hotlantan | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 05:51 am     Actually, the fact that Simon and 'em were so "worried" suggests to me that the vote tallys really are the will of the people. If a viewer is gullible enough to change a voting decision based on non-talent related manipulation, then that is nothing new. Let's face facts: Joshua Gracin's vocal talent in the body of a non-Marine would have not made it past Glendale, much less into the final four! |
Spygirl | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 07:45 am     Wow....I'm kinda surprised at that article. I can't believe Simon admitted to that, either. If that were to get around quickly this week, it could really hurt Ruben's chances of winning as Clay fans would vote to counteract Simon. |
Sadiesmom | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 07:54 am     Maybe I should have posted this in news and views. I do think people have too much trust in the media. Rather than take the time to think independently, people believe so called experts. If you watch television, how many times have you seen people from such and such association telling us things, like second hand smoke is not bad, yet people don't investigate enough to find out that institute is backed by the tobacco company. The people for fair taxes is backed by an extreme right wing grouop that has as it's goal, the discontinuance of social security and medicare. The Cato institute is funded mainly by extremists like John Mellon Scaife (no, not Camp). How many people still think that Whitewater was a crime, when it cleared everyone, exceptone person, who infact, ripped off the Clintons (remember they lost 50,000+) on that deal. No back deals, nothing, cleared after a 60 million dollar investigation. But it is never covered that way in the press, you had to buy the book of the report and trudge through reading it to get that information out of there. But the 'experts' on TV knew and translated it for every one. Well here you have people listening to Simon, a record industy 'expert', judging performances. People are trained to listen to 'experts'. I do believe he has an influence and I say /b{'21'}. Prosecute and get those people out from their extremely binding contracts. OKAY, so my managed news frustration is showing here. This is another sample of how pervasive and disgusting it has become. You should listen to the clips on the site, too. Simon saying these people (Clay, Ruben, Kim) would be nothing with out him, may be true for some, not neccessarily for others. We should have let him have Carmen and let the others have a normal life. |
Twinkie | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 08:26 am     The article doesn't bother me at all. It all boils down to who the people vote for. It doesn't have a thing to do with what Simon or anyone else says. And for all that Simon has supposedly said about wanting Ruben to win, at the very end of that article he says that he thinks Clay will win by a whisker. And I'm glad to hear that they put a block on calls so that nobody can call in 300 or 400 votes for one person. It makes me feel like the few times I do get thru for who I want to win really matters. Last week in the 2 hour time slot I only managed to get in 28 calls for "my" Idol. So if anyone tells me they voted 100 times for their pick I simply don't believe them. I'm pretty fast with the phone: on, redial, off, on, redial, off, etc. |
Marymc | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 09:01 am     interesting input sadiesmom. i guess because i know singing better than say, politics, i trust my own opinion on what i know and trust the "experts" with things i know less about. having studied voice and music in general for over 6 years, i know what i hear, and i know ruben's been off or "pitchy" as the judges like to say to everyone BUT ruben. it's similar to what happened on "america's most talented kid"...they went for the marketable, beautiful, skinny white girl who sang off key than the less marketable asian pianist who was brilliant. but...who's buying piano cd's these days? wish they wouldn't call them talent contests. |
Puttergirl | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 09:19 am     Here, here, Marymc. The end of America's Most Talented Kid was very disappointing. The winner couldn't sing worth a darn!!!!! I'm rooting for Ruben because he's adorable and I just like him a whole lot better than Clay. I admit Clay sings better, but I personally would pay to see Ruben before Clay. I know that doesn't seem fair, but we all see things in performers that attract us more than other performers. So... if Ruben wins, I hope its because alot of us out here just plain appreciate his total package more than Clay, rather than because Simon misled us. No matter who're rooting for, its been easy to see through Simon's comments and know that he is biased. |
Jimmer | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 12:42 pm     Thoroughly unappealing, but regrettably not very surprising. The judges seem to be doing what a lot of fans have done - make their minds up about who they like and then support them regardless of the actual performance on a given night. Is it unreasonable of us to expect them to make an unbiased assessment of the performers based solely on each individual performance? Maybe, or maybe not. The problem with these kinds of reality competitions is that the rules are never really defined, so the expectations of the producers may differ from the fans. Simon isn't misleading anyone - he simply seems to like Ruben better and is willing to support him even when he has an off night. Of course as fans, that doesn't mean we have to like what he's doing. |
Hobobabe | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 12:57 pm     After reading that snippet from the article, my feelings have not changed. I'm okay with it. Simon has always had favorites, and it's always been clear to me his responses "favor" his "favorite." I don't think the public cares who Simon thinks should win, or be in the final two. I think Clay and Ruben are indeed America's favorites. And, remember last year? Tamyra was Simon's favorite and she finished fourth! |
Hobobabe | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 01:14 pm     Wow! I posted earlier before I went to the link to read the article. I'm still okay with it, but what surprises me, is that Kimberley (the most versatile of the group, in my opinion) is also okay with it: ...Minutes after the show, Aiken is in the famous “Red Room,” crying. He can barely speak to a reporter...Studdard is as close to becoming 350 pounds of emotional Jell-O as you’ll ever want to see. Locke is actually the most composed; she’s expected this all along. “The judges play to who they want to win,” she told NEWSWEEK the night before. “I believe they want Ruben. Simon says that every opportunity he gets.”.... |
Seamonkey | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 03:43 pm     I suspect she's astute enough to realize that throwing a tantrum isn't likely to help her get a contract I'm not surprised, just sad, but not surprised. I've said all along that they'd rather have a guy win this time just as Survivor really wanted a female winner this year. |
Idolworship | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 06:41 pm     That article is also posted on Clay's site, and on Idolonfox (Bolt.com), so it's getting around Puttergirl: You'd really pay to see Ruben, even if he just stood there, and croaked out a song, like last Tuesday? Well, ok....I guess I'd even pay to see Clay "forget" lyrics...so we're even. May the best singer win! |
Iscreamer1 | Sunday, May 18, 2003 - 08:59 pm     The thing that scares me is how do we know that the voting isn't rigged? I'm mean if Simon wants Ruben that badly how do we what goes on behind the scenes? I'm still going to vote for Clay but this is the first time I'm beginning to think that our votes may not really matter. |
Prisonerno6 | Monday, May 19, 2003 - 04:24 am     "The thing that scares me is how do we know that the voting isn't rigged?" Because, as Nigel Lythgoe said after the Ruben in the bottom two week, it isn't worth it. The votes are tallied by an outside company, so there are many more people than just the AI producers who know the results. This would make it very easy for them to be caught should they decide to dink with the results, and that would cost them the franchise, which includes the #1 TV show, #1 album, and #1 single, which equals a heck of a lot of money. Besides, why would they want anyone other than the top vote getter to win? That's the one who is most likely to sell the most albums, I would think, so that's who they want to produce. |
Rissa | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 07:46 am     For some reason lately, my posts keeps disapearing after I hit 'post'. Probably leaving it on preview, then closing the page. LOLOL Anyway, Kim L. was on ET last week after being booted and very cheerfully talked to Paula about Simon wanting Reuben to win because he has no clue how to market Clay. Definately got the impression that the contestants had been discussing this and were more amused then anything. Add to that, the comments that Josh made the week before and it becomes obvious that this isn't news at all..... backstage, it's common knowledge that the judges have their favorites. I guess the real question is, who are Randy's and Paula's faves and why isn't the press spreading THOSE choices around as well? |
Bracken | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 08:02 am     Rissa, since all of the top finalists will be going on tour and possibly getting other offers, I guess I agree with their strategy which is to keep your mouth shut and just take what is offered at this point in time. This strategy certainly has been successful. It seems to be working well for Tamyra Gray. I think Randy and Paula (unless they have said something recently I'm not aware of) had their favorites. They chose them during the wildcard portion of the show. Paula picked Trenyce and Randy chose Kimberley Caldwell - both eliminated. Maybe they are now content to let us decide and can sit back and see how Simon figures out how to market Clay if he wins. |
Sadiesmom | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 08:20 am     I can tell you that CLay is Paula's favorite, although she will only say Ruben. You can tel lby looking at her and some of the things she says, but on TV interviews, it is only Ruben. Randy, who knows. This is really about pushing out the remarks to talking heads and entertainment writers, not the most investigative people. Sending large pictures of some people and smaller ones of others, which gets used? Since the beginning a lot of people got the short shrift in this by the media coverage, most recently, you would not have thought Kim was even inthe final three as her name was never mentioned in most articles, except on-line reviews, where the writers have vested interest (they watch and actually know what they are talking about)in the shows. There was a lot of talent in these shows and you would never know it by the coverage. I don't know, I look at the way these people are being treated, all of them and am totally disgusted with this company, no AI3 for me, can't stand to see this happen again to people, pushed beyond anything comprehensable to total physical and emotional exhaustion. Now, I see their little twisted plan going forward in it's cruel careless manner. |
Sadiesmom | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 08:24 am     Oh, hoiw can they rig the votes without 'cheating'. Someone had an article on line density. Aparently the density of the calls can be chosen, so that one area can accept more calls per line. So everyone can have the same number of lines, some lines can accept more calls, that is all. Their example was if one person was getting 93,000 votes per hour and another was getting 47,000, the line can be reduced to only accept 50,000, thyus bringing the vote total closer but allowing both to have equal chance. Do not remember where I saw it. |
Wcv63 | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 08:43 am     I read that article as well Sadiesmom. It would certainly explain a "closer vote total" than one would expect. |
Tabbyking | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 08:47 am     how would one know if they gave us the right 'tally' of votes? especially if they say it was a 'close one'? of course, it will be a close one. both guys are tremendous talents. but i don't think we would ever know if our votes really counted or they just wanted to keep us busy for 2 hours straight on a tuesday night to keep us off the streets! LOL |
Pantageas | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 09:02 am     Both of the guys are good singers, but the "Clay Nation" have sounded like conspiracy nuts for 5 or 6 weeks now...sheesh! |
Sadiesmom | Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 09:28 am     The vote count should be accurate, it is being tallied by an outside firm. Of course, there are, according to Simon, rules where votes may be discarded, such as calling in over 100 times. I don't know how they would have time to do that or what software they would use. The phone company used to keep very accurate records for each phone call, probably still do. SO if you really want to know, you can ask for a recount, LOL. The producers reserve the right to reject the vote and determine the Idol themselves. (Nikki fear?) Conspiracy theories are great fun bvecause people are always trying to manipulate us, in buying a car or toothpaste, so in buying an Idol should not be surprising. I don't believe in flying saucers (yet), so I do try and pose some logic on a situation. I beleive the producers are more into manipulation through dumb press tricks, rather than outright fraud, although those bowls with 4 songs in them certainly flirt with the line. I think I am more shocked at the callousness I knew was there, just not in such quantity. I always knew they were going to be financially tied up in knots, but it is playing with the emotions and physical well being that bothers me. See If Rubewn wins, I think they will wear him out and probably force him to get some internal surgery which might in the end ruin his voice. If Clay wins, they will probably have him get plastic surgery to look like everyone else and that will in turn ruin his voice. Actually, I would like it if they sign Ruben's brother, he looks like he can take care of himself and he is very funny. |
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