Archive through October 18, 2003
TV ClubHouse: Archive: Any Baseball Fans:
Archive through October 18, 2003
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 10:58 am     i am a cub's fan. just not a fan of the cub's fans! |
Aus10 | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 11:35 am     "Miami certainly doesn't. Just until one month ago, the Marlins were drawing less than 15000 fans per game. Yet now that they're in the playoffs, the fickle Miami fans pack the stadium to the tune of 60000 plus." Amen, and this really isn't a slam of Miami fans, but when my son got down there, he got tickets to a Marlins game immediately. He was amazed at the seats he was able to get one night in advance. We normally have to order tickets for cubs games in February in order to get something not in the "nosebleed" section. Although there's really not a bad seat in Wrigley. When ask why he said, because Miami is a football town, plain and simple. Hurricanes or Dolphins. Aus *proud to be a card-carrying Die hard Cubs fan*.......... |
Crazydog | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 11:49 am     Tabby, you may say you are a Cub fan and you may indeed be a Cub fan. But if you were a diehard Cub fan and not a bandwagon Cub fan, you would know who Leon Durham was, and you would know why the diehard fans are so hurt by everything that happened, in particular the Steve Bartman incident. The most ironic thing is that Bartman claims that he is a lifelong diehard Cub fan, and now he has become a piece of Cub history. Someone told me that on one of the radio shows, a college friend of Bartman's called into the show yesterday morning (before the unfortunate game 7) and said that Bartman is enjoying all the attention. That makes me feel even more contempt for him. I think it's funny that on the news they report that he is "in seclusion" in a northern suburb, when the papers identified that suburb and his address is easily searchable on the internet. |
Aus10 | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 12:04 pm     I don't even feel contempt for him. Do I blame him...somewhat, however not in total. But the key here is every team has good and bad fans. Case in point, I am also a huge University of Kentucky basketball fan. Being a part of the Big Blue Nation I'll be the first to admit, we've got some jerky fans. The more fans you got, the more potential for jerks. You also have more potential for knowledeable, true die hard fans. |
Emeraldfire | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 12:38 pm     Crazydog, I think you are being a little hard on Tabbyking. I'm a major Saints fan so I have felt more than my fair share of disappointment. However, Tabby's right. The Cubs are a professional team. It's understandable that they would be more than angry about the fan catching the ball, but their loss cannot be blamed on that one particular act. A team loses through choking, careless errors or just being out-played by the other team. As heartbreaking as it might be, the blame of their defeat cannot be placed at the feet of one fan. |
Sia | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 12:38 pm     I haven't read this entire thread because I'm not a rabid baseball fan, but I just wanted to ask if anyone else feels the poor Cubs fan who interfered with the ball was just incredibly unlucky. He's being threatened and harassed by so many people, but no one seems to acknowledge that there were at least a half-dozen guys with their hands/arms outstretched, trying to catch the same baseball. On the news I saw a clip that showed the Cubs' player's hand from the viewpoint of the fans in the stands. You couldn't really tell that the hand belonged to a baseball player, and the people were looking UP at the ball, anyway. How much to blame is the poor young man who had the misfortune of catching the ball? I would really hate to be in his position; on the news I saw a clip of a so-called baseball fan threatening the guy bodily harm if he could find him. What a shame. |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 12:49 pm     i truly doubt the fan is enjoying the death threats, the police guard, the tv crews camped outside his place of employment so that he had to stay home from his job...it is hearsay. the only comment publicized from the fan himself was the apology; he did not intend to hurt anyone or anything by trying to catch a ball in foul territory, as fans have done in every ballpark in the nation in every game played; as, indeed, a half dozen other fans were trying at the exact same time as this fan. i think it was a genuine apology, because so many fans were blaming him and he needed to let them know he felt bad about it happening. but he did nothing 'wrong'. it was pure happenstance and yes, i feel the fan was incredibly unlucky. |
Bbfanatic | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 12:50 pm     i am a diehard st louis blues hockey fan. so i know what losing is. i get so sick of hearing all of the teams excuses each year for not winning. last year they had the flu. the year before, it was the injuries. i always hear about the blues curse. i wish they would suck it up and say they played like sh*t. if a team gets up by 3-1 or whatever and the other team comes back to win the series there is a problem. it isnt anyones fault but the teams. i am a football and hockey fan only, but i have been watching the baseball playoffs this year and was wanting the cubs to win until they decided to blame someone other than themselves for their problems. yeah, i was just doing it for fun so it doesnt matter but all i have to say is Congrats Marlins!!! i think i am just frustrated with the overpaid players in general. i have always thought the blues are where they are because of their loser attitude. |
Beachcomber88 | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 03:49 pm     I don't think Crazydog is being hard at all. He and I are obviously both diehard Cub fans. As we both have said, any diehard Cub fan would know who Leon Durham is. We obviously know that this series was not lost entirely because of Steve Bartman. Josh Beckett was phenomenal in game 5. And they got outplayed last night in game 7. Did they lose game 6 solely because of Steve Bartman? Of course not. But did he play at least some significant part in that turning point 8th inning? Diehard fans will say yes, while the Tabbykings of this world will say no. The discussion here is not whether or not Steve Bartman lost the series for the Cubs. We know he did not. The discussion is whether he will be remembered in history for his unfortunate lack of judgment. It does not matter that he feels terrible and that he apologized. I'm sure that he is the most miserable Cub fan in this entire world right now, as he should be. But it won't change what happened. It won't change that fateful eighth inning. For all the debate and discussion that has ensued since then, one thing is for certain - Steve Bartman became part of Cub history that night. No one will ever argue otherwise. |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 04:24 pm     the tabbykings of the world? give me a break. |
Maris | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 04:37 pm     Steve Bartman will be remembered in the same way Bill Buckner is remembered. Twenty years from now people will say he "did a Steve Bartman" |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 05:03 pm     i think only die hard cub fans will say that. |
Ketchuplover | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 07:57 pm     I hope the Cubs can get Richie Sexson from the Brewers |
Ladytex | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 08:22 pm     Dang, us Cub fans can't even come in here to mourn in peace .... sheesh ... |
Mak1 | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 08:51 pm     The Red Sox game is so stressful right now. Bottom of the 10th, tied at 5. I wish I had stayed asleep when I dozed off and then woke up when it was all over. |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 09:05 pm     ladytex, this isn't a 'cubs mourning' thread. you can start one, though. this is a generic baseball fans thread. |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 09:13 pm     yankees win! |
Mak1 | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 09:15 pm      |
Tabbyking | Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 09:20 pm     well, i will definitely root for them rather than the marlins, because i prefer the american league and i lived in oakland, then the bronx, then boston...but i would have loved to see the red sox make it this year!! |
Bronxie | Friday, October 17, 2003 - 04:19 am     Well,I was born in Miami and grew up in the Bronx, ....just "take me out to that ballgame." |
Wendo | Saturday, October 18, 2003 - 03:42 am     Bbfanatic, just to clarify one thing. The Cubs team, management, players and the like have not blamed their loss on the Game 6 fan. Please don't think less of the Cubs as a team because there are fans who are continuing to blame this fella. I believe Moisus Alou even came out and said something in defense of the guy as well. The Cubs weren't even expected to make the play offs this year; they lost 95 games last year. That they made it to the NLCS by beating the Braves is something to be proud of. And, I think it's unfortunate that this 2003 season and what was accomplished is likely going to be remembered for the FAN FROM GAME SIX. It's just so ridiculous. This year was a foundation and building year. And, it's obvious that Dusty Baker succeded in doing that because of how far they did go. IMO, one area where the Cubs need to strengthen is the bullpen. Yes, they have Prior. And yes, they have Wood (who still needs to work on his control issues.) Zambrono and Clement are young and likely to improve. However, where the Cubs are weak is with relief pitching. I think if they could acquire two more relief pitchers and another strong closer they'd be on their way again next year too. It will be interesting to see who will stay and who will go; especially those acquired from Pittsburgh. And, who will they bring in? Anyway, I do sympathize with the life long, diehard Cubs fans. Being only five outs away from clinching is so close. And, I do agree that the fan incident did change the momentum of the game FOR THE CUBS PLAYERS. Alou was obviously upset and I'm sure others were. It was a possible out. Then, Rodriguez bobbles and Priors pitching pretty much tanked. If anything, the Marlins beat the Cubs because they were psychologically stronger. Instead of wallowing in lost opportunities they made new ones to capitalize on. Kudos to them for coming back when they were down 3-1. And, I do agree with Tabbyking in that I find it absurd that Cubs fans want to blame the loss on one fan who tried to catch a foul ball. Additionally, I find it reprehensible that some "fans" (are they fans?) want to physically harm this man. My goodness, where are people's priorities. It's just ludicrous. To blame the NLCS loss on ONE MAN is nothing more than someone not wanting to put the so called blame where it belongs; on the players. Frankly, I don't look at it as blame anyway. They lost. Only one team can win and it was the Marlins. On another note, my sympathies to the Red Sox fans out there. A real tough one to lose. In the 11th on a home run. Truly amazing. I say, let's keep rooting for our teams and hope for a match up next year. I truly believe a Red Sox vs Cubs World Series would be very exciting. Bronxie, I appreciate your comments. Sometimes I wish I could have more of an influence on Cubs fans who've lost perspective. Unfortunately, I don't. LOL! Funny thing is, I'm sure the die hard, lived their whole life in Chicago fans wouldn't give me the time of day since I moved here ten years ago. I've been a Cubs fan ever since. Before that, well, I watched baseball and enjoyed it. But never had a team I dug. But, when I went to Wrigley Field for the first time to watch a game well, there's just something about it. The energy of it, the history, the fans, the neighborhood that surrounds it; it just draws you in. You can't help but become a Cubs fan. One last thing. As far as curses and jinxes...don't believe them one wit. As I said above, only one team can win and that's the team that wants it more and plays the best. This year, it was the Yankees and Marlins. Who of those two want it the most? We'll see... Well, I've gone on long enough. I hope the fan thing fades from memory and goes away. (Though, some one on the radio equated it to Mrs. O'Learys cow! *rolls eyes*) I hope it does. Because I don't think it's a good or positive thing for Chicago, the Cubs, and the fans. Just my three cents. |
Reader234 | Saturday, October 18, 2003 - 05:20 am     Wow Wendo!! Thank you so very much. As a member of the fanatic team, I can tell you my dreams started as a child! Ah those '69 Cubbies. My relatives being in Texas, and we made the sojourn yearly, allowed us to attend a Cub away game. Talk about a child's dream. I always wondered how my father knew Joe Pepitone's girlfriend... but that cute usherette took the baseballs my brother and I had and took them in the dugout... What a thrill. After the game we stood close, screaming yelling thank you thank you all decked out in Cubbie blue. So much fun to have dad take us to the games. Loss after loss. Sometime later I matured and wondered why I should support a franchise that seems bent on losing. Not the players mind you, I grew cynical. Then Dusty Baker, brought is child to a game, almost harmed the kid, but it made national headlines, and I thought, hmmmm, back to the kids... and THE CUBS GOT HIM... I thought, maybe, maybe this year... and I was really hooked again. (Mind you its hard not to LOL listening to Ron Santo give commentary to losing games, just a wonderful spirit that man brings to the game!!) I even played along 3 years ago when WGN radio played the bubala game. Instead of total wins and losses for the Cubs, they broke it down into small sections so we could go to a happy room and celebrate groups of wins known as 'bubalas" with the hope if they won X amount of bubalas they could make it to the playoffs... no such luck... This year, I'm with you Wendo. From 67 wins to this year, I'll take it! AND I'll wonder what phrase Ernie Banks will give us for next year, 2004. Wendo, as I see it you are a true Cub fan!! Love the time you spent on your post!! But, can you answer this? I have no idea myself, it was something discussed on that talk radio show... are you a "Cub Fan" or a "Cubs Fan"... that may keep you up at night, the majority ruled (sportswriters, well known personalities, explayers etc...) that you are a "Cub Fan"... I had no idea!! Have you ever heard the two debated? |
Bronxie | Saturday, October 18, 2003 - 10:15 am     Good Luck and Bad Luck...two players who are on every team, and who are independent of direction from the managers or fans...they play by their own rules....... And that's not a curse ... that's for real. I don't think for a moment that the Marlins are better than the Cubs, or the Yankees better than the Red Sox. Pure luck. |
Wendo | Saturday, October 18, 2003 - 11:33 am     Wow, Reader, that's awesome the experiences you had as a child going to the Cub games. Just think of all the great former Cub players you've seen play at the field. Lucky you! (Btw, one thing I should've added about how I became a Cubs fan. It was also the players too. They just all seem to have such spirit about the game. Win or lose.) Now, as far as the Cub vs Cubs fan...I have no idea. LOL! I suppose I look at it as plural because I'm not only a Cub fan but I'm a Cubs fan which in my mind means the team, the field, the fans, etc. Never heard it debated though. But now you have me intrigued so I plan to do a little research on the net about it. LOL! Thank you for your post. You have such wonderful memories. Oh, and btw, I agree with you about Dusty Baker and bringing his kid to the game. It gives one a nice feeling. *warm and fuzzy* LOL! Bronxie, I do agree that luck plays a role in baseball games. How a ball rolls, bounces, whether it would be a homerun in one park and not another, and the like. And, to a large extent I agree that neither the Marlins or Yankees are any "better" than the Cubs or Red Sox. However, during game seven of the Cubs vs Marlins I would say the Marlins were better. One, as I already said, they played better psychologically. And two, I think the Marlins played better short ball; by that I mean, not always going for the hit out of the park. With Pierre and Castillo they have a one two punch. When they're able to get on base, the Marlins kick butt. Plus, Pudge Rodriguez has been outstanding. (I would argue that if the Marlins do win the World Series and Pudge plays as well as he has been, he'll be the MVP of the series. And he'd deserve it.) So yes, luck does play a part. But decisions made throughout the game do as well. (For instance, again during the final Marlin vs Cub game, I wouldn't have left Wood in as long. He was just too wild that night. Four runs scored were those who were walked on base.) I think I said a few days ago that we would know if the Cubs would win during the first inning based on how Wood was pitching. When I saw how wild his pitching was, I knew they wouldn't win. (He was no where close to how accurate he was with the Braves.) Anyway, gotta say this, it's been one of the best post seasons we've had in years. And that's good for baseball. |
Ginger1218 | Saturday, October 18, 2003 - 12:40 pm     I am quite happy. I was rooting for the Marlins to beat the Cubs and they did. And of course my TEAM THE YANKEES!!!! Best team in Baseball. GOOO YANKEES!!!!!! |
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