Archive through March 24, 2003
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TV ClubHouse: Archives: 2003 March: 75th Anniversary of the Oscars: Archive through March 24, 2003

Squaredsc

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 12:51 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
hey, michael douglas used to be sexy, lol. to die for was a great movie.

Crazydog

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 12:55 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Michael Moore's speech was just embarrassing. What an egomaniac. What a tasteless stunt. I would have cut off the microphone as soon as he said started talking about living in fictitious times.

I was very happy Zeta-Jones won, she deserved it.

Ginger1218

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 02:05 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Crazydog, she was absolutely incredible. I also think Renee Zellweger should have won. She totally owned that movie, unlike Nicole Kidman, who put on a big nose and was only in the movie for 1/3 of the movie. The Academy is so messed up.

Scorpiomoon

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 02:17 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I know I'm opening myself up for a ton of criticism, but I completely disagree with you guys about the Roman Polanski win.

(Maris compared him to O.J Simpson. In an odd twist of fate, the same two LAPD officers who worked on the Roman Polanski case also were part of the O.J Simpson case as well.)

I am a huge fan of Roman Polanski. I admire him deeply. That man has been to hell and back. First him and his family were taken to concentration camps where most of them died. His father helped him escape, but Polanski was left to fend for himself at a young age. He becomes a film maker and had great success. He meets and marries Sharon Tate only to experience the murder of her and their unborn child by the Manson family.

After all of that, is it really a surprise the man would make some bad choices?

I have seen/read several interviews with the woman who was a teenager when she had the relationship with Polanski (or he had with her). She has said countless times that her life wasn't damaged by the relationship, that it was a consentual relationship and that he has been treated unfairly. If she doesn't think of herself as a victim then why should we and therefore continue to treat him as a criminal?

Yes, of course laws are created and upheld to protect children who aren't willing participants. This is a very serious issue. But how can you paint every single situation with the same brush?

Roman Polanski is now 70 years old. This incident happened in the late 70's--over 20 years ago. Even people who serve jail time and are released after 20 years, are (supposedly) given the chance to start anew.

Why can't you guys cut him some slack?

Twiggyish

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 02:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Agreed Maris about Polanski. The man is should be in jail. I would not have applauded him, either.

Ophiliasgrandma

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 02:27 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
To me a 'bad choice' is maybe the iffy fish over the filet mignon, not giving drugs to a 13 year old child.

Twiggyish

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 02:44 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I think Steve Martin did a good job. He had a tough situation, but he kept it going. His humor was just right.

Brenda1966

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 03:22 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I hear you Scorpio. Comparing Polanski to OJ is so far off the mark.

I don't know the details of the case against Polanski, but my first thoughts are: hasn't the statue of limitations for his crime run out yet? This was statutory rape, based on her age, correct? It wasn't like he randomly grabbed her off the street and held a knife to her throat in a back alley. I wouldn't have a problem with him returning to the US.

That said, if I were a member of the Academy I wouldn't have voted for him simply because we knew he would not be able to attend and accept the award. I think it's disappointing when the people don't show up. I wanted Scorcese to win for his body of work.

OVerall a good show. I enjoyed Steve Martin as host. I was THRILLED when Spirited Away won for best animated feature.

Maris

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 03:28 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/polanskia1.html


Read the transcript the victim gave to a grand jury. Comparing a pedophile to a murderer is not so off the mark to me. There was no consent. I think it is a sad state of affairs that people can so readily accept a man who raped a child and skipped the country. He should not be given any awards or any work. He should come and serve his sentence.

Is the man who kidnapped Elizabeth Smart not worth of comparing to OJ????

How is what Roman Polanski did not such a bad thing???

Texannie

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 03:44 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Maybe some of you posting "what's the big deal?" aren't parents, but as a mother, I guarantee you that if ANYONE molested my child and then FLED jurisdiction, I would hunt them down no matter how talented they were in their field. If he isn't guilty, then why not come back??
There is no excuse for molestation of a child. Aren't you the same people asking for the preists' heads all these years later? Why prosecute those cases??

Maris

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 03:47 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
He pleaded guilty to unlawful sexual intercourse -- that translates to rape. He was ordered to undergo psychiatric testing before the judge passed sentence. That is when he skipped the country. I am appalled that there isnt more outrage in Hollywood, in the press or anywhere else about this.

Brenda1966

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 03:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I am a mother. I read the snippet of testimony. It's lacking details about how they met and what kind of knowledge he had about her age.

As a mother, if anyone came near my child I'd do great damage to them. But, as someone who's young enough to remember how wild and out of control a 13 year old can behave, I don't see this particular case as 100% guilt vs 100% innocent. This so-called "child" used drugs, drank, posed nude, and had sex. She wasn't a 5 year old who was lured away from home. Sounds like she was trying to live in the adult world. I don't excuse Polanski's behavior, I just don't see any point in pursuing him 25 years later when the victim feels the way she does.

Maris

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 04:00 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
You didnt read the transcript. Start at the beginning and then tell me that the child "used drugs, drank, posed nude and had sex". That is so inaccurate. That isnt what happend. Read it. I think it is so sad that people are making excuses for a pedophile and a rapist.

Brenda1966

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 04:06 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I beg to differ! She states she had "Intercourse" two or three times prior to Polanski. She also states that she had taken drugs one time prior (at age 10 or 11) and had drank prior (more than once), but had not taken drugs and drank at the same time prior to that.

I did read the transcript. I noticed that it cuts off at the end. We can see 30-some pages, but no more than that. I'm not excusing his behavior. I'm also not excusing her behavior. That is the difference.

Brenda1966

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 04:09 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Where'd you go Scorpio?! Look what you got me into? :)

Maris, I'm shocked that they voted for Polanski. Completely shocked. But I'm not appalled.

Have to run...

Grooch

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 04:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Why would anyone be shocked that they voted for Polanski. They all want to be in Woody Allen's movies.

Maris

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 05:25 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I disagree with the view that one must be a virgin and pure in order to qualify for being raped. The testimony clearly stated the girl said no, the girl was afraid and couldnt fight back. There was no consent.

In my view, a 13 year old girl who is afraid and is saying no, its rape. She doesnt need to excuse her behavior, being raped doesnt require apolgies.

Now I have to run.

Texannie

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 06:05 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I made some bad choices when I was younger..drugs, sex too young, but does that mean I "deserved" to be raped?

Melfie1222

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 06:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Wow. This makes me sad, and mad at the same time. According to RAINN, in 2000 only about 48% of rapes and sexual assaults were actually reported... I read somewhere else a more recent statistic (sorry, can't remember where) that the rate is still less than or close to the 50% mark. I guess the fact that this many women are reluctant to report they were raped or assaulted shouldn't surprise me much seeing some of the arguments made here.

I can only hope that anyone who finds themselves, or their daughter, sister, mother, friend... a victim of assault or rape doesn't have to hear someone tell them to give the guy a break... or have to hear someone saying well, it's not like he grabbed you off the street and held a knife to your throat.

Tabbyking

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 07:30 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
polanski also had something going with nastassja kinski when she was very young, but it was (allegedly) consentual. they stayed in france, so he wouldn't get in trouble. she was 16--maybe. a long time ago, but i remember because she isn't much younger than me, and i thought polanski was a dirty old man at the ripe old age of 40 or whatever he was at the time!
i remember john derek and bo bringing up the polanski/kinski relationship in my head several years later, because bo was so young, too.

Max

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 07:32 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Wow, I must have clicked on the wrong thread. I thought this was a discussion of the Oscars but it appears to be a debate about what constitutes rape, statutory or otherwise.

Buh bye.

Spygirl

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 07:37 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Sad, isn't it, Max? I enjoyed this thread until earlier today.

Tabbyking

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 07:45 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
max, it's probably because one of the oscar winners has a history...
but i posted yesterday (somewhere!) about liking-- or not liking--the works, not the personal lives of the contestants. if we had to like them personally, i'd never read, listen to, or watch anything! i have not seen the 'pianist'. i have not seen michael moore's movie. it is very hard for me not to 'go nuts' over michael moore's spewing last night, but i promised myself to consider only the talents, not what i think is not right!
roman polanski is a hard one for me, too, because his behavior was degenerate (in my opinion) and illegal (by law). because i was pretty sure someone would use the oscars as a way to say something very pro- or very anti-war, i chose not to watch it. having every news station show michael moore over and over was annoying, because i didn't watch the oscars, but got the stuff i was trying to avoid, anyway! go figure! i do appreciate (with my own personal difficulty) that the oscars are for talent only, not the personal crap, so why did michael moore have to 'personalize' it?!

Melfie1222

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 08:04 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I enjoyed this thread earlier too, last night I was watching the show and posting here, and following along with everyone else's posts, and it was fun... but I couldn't just sit here and say nothing about this, since it's been brought up.

Riviere

Monday, March 24, 2003 - 09:11 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I refused to suffer thru watching the Oscars this year, because though it's an annual tradition for me, I knew, as usual, anything happening in the world would incite some camera hog to use it as a forum for personal political opinion... Actors, put a camera on them and they're "on" whether it makes an arse of themselves or not, just to flap their tongues and give us unwanted info, is that about right? I always liked Mike Moore's witty work, but now he's just another lame opportunist, I'm glad he got hissed & booed seeing news clips of his childish rant.. As for Roman Polanski, I wouldn't know where to start there.. The little 13yo child being written about here, I know that case well, and it was champagne, not XTC by the way which wasn't invented yet.. Nobody seems to mention the girl's mother, she's the one who set it all up.. The girl did have sex and use drugs and drink before meeting Roman Polanski, sad as that is, she was passed off as being of age to him when they met, thank her mother, why don't you, for the later stuff that came off like any case of blackmail re statutory rape.. It was so great to see Steve Martin clips and the thanks speech of Adrien Brody, some class and showing support for our mostly 18-25 yo fellow Americans in Iraq and Afghanistan in these times, when they need our support.. That's my 2 cents, thanks...