Archive through October 16, 2002
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TV ClubHouse: Archive: Beltway Sniper (formerly 5 Shootings...): Archive through October 16, 2002

Jo_5329

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 08:36 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Holy Smokes Goddess!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wonder if it just random or the shooter knew?

Mack

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 08:40 am EditMoveDeleteIP
There are thousands of us Federal civil servants in the greater DC area. To know that a particular person works for the FBI or any other agency is fairly hard unless you knew them personally.

Goddessatlaw

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 08:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
That I don't know, Jo - I didn't see anything to indicate a feeling that it was NOT random, but the sniper's got a whole new bag of ugly on his hands now. Not just killing a FBI employee - one of their women. I'm thinking he's going to be rounded up fairly quickly now.

Jo_5329

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 10:03 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Yup Goddess, cops get really mad when the citizens are hurt -- but hurt one of their own and that is a whole another ball of wax. Not that they are not going to work any harder becaues of the victim being one of their own now, but the blood flows a lot hotter and faster now -- and the anger is hotter too.

Whowhere

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 10:31 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I just heard on my radio "police are confident that they will be making an arrest for the sniper killings very soon" due to eye witness accounts regarding the license plate number.

I'm hoping and praying that the next annoucement will be that they caught him/her/them/it.

Fluff

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 10:39 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Yep.

I think it's soon too. They said that the guy actually got out of his car to shoot the lady, so I'm sure they have facial descriptions. But they did say that the descriptions that were given were all conflicting, except the Chevy Astro van reports.

Fanny

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 11:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think the police/FBI are already working this case as hard as they can. I doubt that the fact the latest victim is an FBI employee is going to have any bearing on how quickly the sniper is caught. If they're able to catch him quickly from this point, the deciding factors will be the partial plate number and witness identifying information, which they may not have had earlier. They are not working harder to solve the case simply because "one of their own" is a victim.

Silksmoke

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 12:12 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Somewhere in the back of my mind I recall a report about a woman dropping off a man in a wooded area. The man was carrying a long black bag/case, and I seem to remember them saying he was wearing blue pants, blue shirt/sweater and a ball cap. This was the day of the shooting of the 13 year old child.

There are some witnesses to last nights shooting who said they saw a guy in a "blue" sweater get out of a white van and shoulder a rifle at the time of the shooting. Does anyone else remember this, or am I just terribly confused on this issue?

Jo_5329

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:12 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
The shooter, IMHO, screwed up major this time ... seems there were a lot of witnesses, and the tag will help.

crossing fingers and toes

Sia

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:35 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I'm confused as to the description of the getaway vehicle. Pictures of a panel-truck have been shown in the media, yet the truck is described as a Chevy Astro, which is a passenger van. I've wondered if the guy is using a panel-truck if he could be riding a bike, taking his shot, then zipping to the truck silently, loading up and taking off. Now it sounds as if he has an accomplice for sure, someone to drive the vehicle. This is awful; I pray that the sumb!tch is caught immediately.

Rissa

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:44 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Sia, I am in Canada so haven't paid much attention when it came to describing the vehicle but this is what I have heard:

Yesterday: They showed a picture of a white truck... the same size and general shape as a catering truck.

Today: They gave a verbal description of two seperate vehicles they are looking for. I believe one was a white van and one a cream van and they specified that they were different makes (as opposed to one-van-but-not-sure-which-colour). I wasn't really listening and didn't catch either of the model names.

I don't know a lot about car makes/models but I agree with you that what I have heard and what I have seen don't match.

Yankee_In_Ca

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:44 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Silksmoke - I'm pretty sure the description of someone with a long black bag was the day after the shooting of the schoolboy, but was also around a school. The police scoured the area immediately and all day, and found nothing.

Excerpted from a Washington Post article http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3593-2002Oct9.html:

"Ten minutes later, a 911 caller reported a man with a long black bag in the woods near Friendly High School in Fort Washington.

Police went to the site, secured the area and started searching the woods and the neighborhood. A car was pulled over and later let go. Police soon learned that surveyors were working in the area and carrying their equipment in long black bags."

Sia -- Chief Moose said today that they have released computer images of three possible vans-- a panel truck, a Chevy and a Ford -- because most witnesses don't have photographic memory and they want to put all possible images out there so that it might jog someone's memory. Moose also said he wasn't speculating, but it would also be reasonable for someone to switch vehicles (between panel truck & passenger van).

Yankee_In_Ca

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:47 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Sia and Rissa--
Just found a news article articulating Moose's statements about why the vans are different -- it's at http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/South/10/15/sniper.shootings/index.html:

Excerpted:

"The police agency coordinating the manhunt released new composite graphics Monday of vehicles spotted at the scene of last Friday's fatal gas station shooting near Fredericksburg -- a Ford Econoline van and white Chevrolet Astro, both with roof ladder racks. (Suspect vehicles)

"These are graphics. These are not exact photos," said Montgomery County, Maryland, Police Chief Charles Moose, who is spearheading the investigation. "We want to use this to jog people's memory."

Authorities urged citizens who know about such vehicles to call the investigation's 800 number. Also, those people who drive such vehicles and were near the scene in Spotsylvania County last week also are asked to contact authorities.

Moose said witnesses do not usually have photographic memories and often see things differently. But he did not rule out that more than one vehicle was involved.

"We don't want to speculate, but certainly it's not beyond any reality that the person or persons involved in this would have numerous vehicles that they could be using," Moose said."

Rissa

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:48 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Just checked cnn.com, they say:

>>>The police agency coordinating the manhunt released new composite graphics Monday of vehicles spotted at the scene of last Friday's fatal gas station shooting near Fredericksburg -- a Ford Econoline van and white Chevrolet Astro, both with roof ladder racks. >>

You can see the photos HERE

Goddessatlaw

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 03:57 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I'm a bit confused by this latest shooting, Jo. I kind of wonder whether he'd driven around trying to find an obscured shot and, failing that, got frustrated and took a chance. This one was very undisciplined compared to all of his last, although the day he did five he clearly had the ability to move more freely because no one really knew what was going on. Last night was odd, but I'm hoping it provides the needed clues to get him before another life is lost. I will be interested to learn his motivation behind all this - what could he possibly glean from killing strangers at a distance? I understand the theory that there's been a psychotic break, etc. If his satisfaction is through causing the police to scramble and watching his own publicity on television, he's certainly getting that. Most of the 24-hour news channels have covered nothing else in recent days. I wish they'd tone it down. But this doesn't really jibe with his taking a huge risk last night - the national publicity was already huge, and the police were scrambling. He seems more interested in the actual murders to me, but because he's required to run off immediately following the shot, he's not able to stand there and absorb the death he's just caused. Confusing case.

Hermione69

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 04:11 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
There is a term that is used to describe the period when a serial killer starts to unravel a bit. I thought it was called "decompressing," but I was unable to confirm that is the right term so I am not sure. It's how serial killers sometimes wind up getting caught. They get sloppied and hurried and start making mistakes. There is maybe a little bit of that is going on here. I hope so, anyway. I work at a high school off of I-95 in Virginia and one of my students was a basket case today. I listened to her pour her heart out to me about how scared she was and I thought, "This is not what a high school senior should be worrying about. She should be worrying about colleges or grades or boys, not about the possibility that she could lose her life to a sniper's bullet." This whole thing makes my heart ache.

Silksmoke

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 05:12 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yankee, thanks for clearing that up for me, I had not heard the explanation that there were surveyors in the area, and confused the day of the incident.

This case is so perplexing and frustrating, I vacillate between thinking it's some sociopath on a rampage to foreign terrorist acts. My heart stops every time there's a "Breaking News" announcement on Fox.

Many times I worry for the people broadcasting live from outdoor locations in the area. Wouldn't it be a coup for this psychopath to commit such a horrendous act on live TV to shock the viewing audience? I just wish everyone would stay inside, or at least wear bullet-proof vests and helmets.

Hermione, I can only imagine the terror everyone, but especially the kids, in the area must be experiencing. So tragic for someone that young to be living in such fear. My heart goes out to everyone who lives in such circumstances. I hope to God they catch this maniac soon.

Jo_5329

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 05:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yes, decompressing is what it's called ... I hope he decompresses into a sink hole

Twiggyish

Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 06:48 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Silk, I wonder about that with news broadcasters, too.

Mack

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 05:14 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Sia - Just for general information Chevy Astro vans also come in a general utility model without the side windows. Drove to work behind a gray one this morning. I think the point is that one utility van pretty much looks like the other and unless you're really into trucks it's probably an easy "mistake" to pick the wrong make and model. What is consistent is that it is some sort of white to cream colored van with ladder racks on the top. Of course, I saw at less 6 vehicles this morning that met that general description, not particularly rare in the DC area. We did notice the police today though....police cars just parked along side the road spaced every 3-4 miles and it didn't look like they were speed trapping. Encouraging to see them out there but makes you a bit nervous because you don't know from minute to minute what is happening.

Sia

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 05:38 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Now it's being reported that the scumbag(s) may have access to an entire fleet of vehicles! There are so many aggravating things about the way things are handled in this country: anyone can get a driver's license, anyone can own a vehicle, anyone can just enter and leave unnoticed, and people can just disappear without a trace.

Mack

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 06:17 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Unfortunately, at least in this case, that's part of our country and its freedoms. Hard case to decide just where you draw the line between personal freedoms and a "police state". Tracking 220 million people is no easy task.

Marysafan

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 06:34 am EditMoveDeleteIP
That was my thought...because of so many different vehicle descriptions, and the shootings happening on the weekdays but not on weekends. He is using work vehicles and he has access to more than one.

I bet they are looking into construction companys, plumbing and heating companys, air conditioning services, roofing contractors, electricians, and things of that nature. I bet there are a ton of them in the DC area!

Whowhere

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 06:59 am EditMoveDeleteIP
What do you all think about the possible Middle Eastern or Hispanic description? I don't know why, but I'm hoping this isn't one of our own.

Goddessatlaw

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 07:20 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Truthfully, Whowhere, I'd rather this be the work of one of our homegrown nut-jobs than part of a larger terrorist plot - that would make this sniper an interchangeable part rather than an isolated psycho case, and these incidents will continue regardless of whether this particular sniper is rounded up.