StateV: Fat Women are More Unforgiving
TV ClubHouse: archives: StateV: Fat Women are More Unforgiving
Mygetaway | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 01:26 am     Did anyone see StateV last night on ABC? The defending attorney decicded to veto a juror because she was female and fat. He said a study showed that fat females tend to be more unforgiving as jurists. Less likely to feel sorry for the defendant. I kind of took offense to that remark, but then I started wondering if it was true. What do you guys think? (PS.. I'll try not to "hit and run" but I haven't been venturing out of BB land much these last few days.. this statement got me thinking, and I wanted to see how everyone else felt about it, if they saw it.) |
Max | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 08:05 am     I saw it and found it offensive. This is, however, what trial attorneys do. They try to profile potential jurors and pick ones that will be more likely to see things their way. There are consultants who make a living collecting data about how people view different issues and providing this profiling informaiton to lawyers. If this was openly done in a business environment, say to help a hiring manager try and gauge how someone will fit into the office culture, lawsuits for discrimination would abound. But it's common practice in courtrooms across the land. Is the sentiment true? (That overweight women are less forgiving.) Beats me. I don't think there is a single generalization you can make about overweight people, women or men, except that they have problems fitting into Southwest Airlines' tiny seats.  |
Rissa | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 08:10 am     I dropped my jaw for a moment too but then took the same attitude as you Max. The legal community spends millions hiring people to profile juries and if this is a fact in a case like this, then it wasn't meant to be insulting. I didn't see it as a blanket statement though.. fat woman are unforgiving PERIOD. I took it as, in a case of a young girl claiming rape by an older man, overweight woman can be less forgiving. BTW, how did it end? I missed the last ten minutes trying to get my 5 year old in the shower. LOL |
Whoami | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 08:26 am     I'm sitting here trying to figure out how I could be unforgiving of a young girl claiming rape by an older man. Maybe I'm supposed to be jealous of the girl because she's young, pretty, and able to attract the attention of a rapist? UGH! Rolling my eyes in disgust here. I'm am SO sick of people assuming something about me because I'm fat. I hope they didn't spend much money getting this generalized profile, cause it stinks of someone having an issue with fat people. Running off now before I start saying mean and nasty things about people who catagorize and generalize other people just by thier looks...... |
Faerygdds | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 08:36 am     OK... I'm female... I'm fat... would that make me more or less forgiving in this case... well.. let's look at it... Some overweight women became overweight as a way to hide themselves - protect themelves - from men hurting them because of traumatic expeiriences that happened to them. I'm one of those women... so doe that make me less forgiving??? Ummm... no.... does it make me less understnading... ummm... no... but I wouldn't have ben kicked off for being fat.. I would have been dismessed as a prior victim of rape.. I gues my point is that I know a LOT of women who WERE young and sexy (I was a hottie), but due to the emotional and psychological fallout of rape became large. It's early... and I somehow think that made better sense in my head than it does on screen... am I even making sense at ALL??? |
Max | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 09:13 am     Rissa, It ended with a guilty verdict for 2nd degree murder. She got the maximum sentence - 22 years. |
Aria | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 09:49 am     OK, I recently quit smoking and took up eating instead so now I have become "fat". Does this mean that I have also become unforgiving? Does this mean that 3 months ago when I was still thin I would have been more forgiving? What about when I finally lose the weight will I be more forgiving again? I agree with Max it was a generalization. At least I hope it was - I must now step back and do some self evaluation.  |
Rissa | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 10:13 am     The last thing I want to do is defend lawyers or to support generalizations about any group of people. But I think the point is that these survey groups put on mock trials with tens of thousands of people and legal firms pay big money to find out the results. If the generalizations exists, it's because the people in those survey groups reacted in a certain way. It's in the defense attorney's best interest to play the odds and not try to individualize each potentional juror. Let's not forget that the proscecutor was saying the exact same thing but using it to his sides advantage. Just as offensive. Personally I thought she was guilty from minute one and it was cemented when they showed the victims autopsy photo. That cut on his neck was NOT a stab wound, it was a slice just like she told her friend she would want to try. I also thought it was ludicrous that she had been *joking* about wanting to slash someone's neck.. who the heck, in sound mind, jokes about THAT? None of my reasons have anything to do with my being overweight however. LOL Thanks Max. Wasn't she up for 1st degree? Why did it go to 2nd? I would think that if they believed the rape story then they would have bumped it down to manslaughter at least, if not self-defense and if they didn't believe the rape attempt happened at all then the premiditation and 1st degree would have stood. Dang shower. LOL |
Faerygdds | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 10:13 am     Oh.. I'm not saying the generalization is correct.. I was just (albeit half asleep) trying to give and explanation of where that staistic may have come from... that's all... (I need to quit posting in my sleep - read as before my morning caffeine fix) |
Max | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 11:20 am     Rissa, There was one woman on the jury who REFUSED to even CONSIDER 1st degree murder. Fortunately, the way it was set up, they could choose to find her guilty of the lesser charge. The defense attorney was trying to get the lightest sentence (10 years), but the judge imposed the harshest instead. I agree that the prosecution did their job of proving the case. I probably would have gone for 1st degree myself, but I'm glad the jurors decided to agree on 2nd degree rather than end up as a hung jury. I'm not sure if manslaughter was an option and I can't remember exactly why the one gal couldn't see fit to vote guilty on 1st degree (I was multitasking on the computer and only paying partial attention). |
Dahli | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 11:25 am     I love this series, fascinating stuff - and that remark resonated with me too, wondered what qualifies as overweight, heavier than size 8 or really big...? Even though I too have put on some pounds in the last year, and don't fit into my Calvins very well anymore, I would have hung that jury so fast your head would spin. Absolutely unbelievable to me that they convicted her. As a woman who has been assaulted like that, I know the panic and frantic behaviour she must have experienced. The wounds were not analyzed to my satisfaction but the fact that if plan was to do this and 'take his stuff' and NOTHING was taken - her story was completely plausible. My heart broke for her and the pig of a judge to give her the max made me wonder if he's involved in similar rendezvous of his own, women and children really do get shafted all over the world |
Mygetaway | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 12:55 pm     Thanks for the comments everybody! I'm glad to know that it seemed bothersome to others, but like the consensus, I'm sure there is a ring of truth to the statement. I feel like I myself would give someone the benefit of the doubt no matter what my size was at the time, but who knows. Dahli.... I see what you're saying, but I think she went overboard. She didn't need 60 stabs to get away. She didn't have a prior history with THIS man. To take out her past on him was not right, and unfortunately, it was murder. Twenty years, might have been a little stiff, but was within the law. Hopefully she will get all the help she needs in prison, and still have an attempt at a good life when she gets out. (I know this doesn't happen often, but it does in some cases.) |
Dahli | Thursday, July 18, 2002 - 02:56 pm     I know what you mean My but I'm saying that nobody counts (okay one and a two that should do it) when they are terrified or in a true state of panic. Depicted in many of our movies and TV you will see people fight and fight and fight even though nothing is attacking perhaps in a dream or some other altered state, when they believe they are in danger, I know cuz I've done it. Unfortunately people who have not had the benefit of healthy family etc make poor choices and do not have the skills to step back and say ...hmmm is this necessary/a good idea/ dumb etc and results such as this where they are judged NOT by their peers but people with families homes jobs and relationships, with no clue about this type of life. Her breakdown when her mother was brought up was heartbreaking to me and twenty two years is obscene OK rant over;-) |
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