Missing Oregon City Girls
TV ClubHouse: archives: Missing Oregon City Girls
Ratlady | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 12:54 am     I didn't see this in any thread, so I thought I would post. The FBI has found a second body today in the back of Weavers' house, under that concrete slap (gee who would have guessed!). I am so upset about this. A part of me knew that they had found Marandas' remains yesterday but I guess I really didn't want to admit it until it was confirmed today. I guess I am so distrought (sp) because it was so close to where I live. Ok not THAT close, but close enough! I have 2 young girls of my own and I am so afraid for them that I am really considering putting my youngest doughter in my oldest daughters room at night and putting one dog outside and one dog in their room, whole the other dog roams the house at night! I really hope they make the B*stard fry!! How could someone do that to such innocent children! They were so young! They never even got to experience life yet. This story just makes me so sad. What are the rest of you thinking? I just can not even comprehend what this thing (I can't even think of him as a human being) was thinking!! I know, they have not proven him guilty yet. But, in my mind, he is guilty, guilty, GUILTY!!! |
Hillbilly | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 05:00 am     ..ratlady..i's understand...i's got a puppy last year fer ma two gals...they's live with their ma ...it was a little sheltie...i jest wanted a dog that would bark if somethin was up to wake em up and hopefully make someone think twice afore acomin in the house......after hearin how these gals is bein taken from their own home and nobody woke up er heard anything, i highly recommend folks gets an 'inside the house' dog...even if its one of them little chihuaha dogs...alls ya needs is something to make alot of noise... also...i don't know how common it is fer folks to go to sleep with winders open or not lockin their doors...but even here where I live...we's lock up tight when we go to bed at night .... |
Max | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 08:11 am     Hillbilly, Usually I think your writing style is mildly humorous, but I have to say, that I think it would have been nice in this kind of topic if you had been more serious. Just my opinion, maybe because this topic IS so close to home (I live in the Portland metro area). Anyway, these girls were not taken from their homes. One was last seen walking down the hill heading to school. The other was last seen getting ready for school and was probably accosted as she walked out of the apartment complex past Weaver's home. I suspect they were lured into Weaver's house, since they did have a relationship with him. Both these girls knew Weaver and spent time with him. Ashley had made some allegations that he had acted inappropriately with her sexually. The two girls were friends and had both been through some abuse in their lives before (not involving Weaver). Weaver has a 13-year-old daughter himself and many of her friends, including Ashley and Miranda, seemed to consider him something of a father figure. Today's paper quotes one of those girls as saying that she spent time at the Weaver's home whenever she could because she felt safe. I was so sad when the worst was verified, but as Ratlady said, it wasn't completely unexpected. It's one of those things where you were hoping they'd find something and hoping they wouldn't all at the same time. I really hadn't thought the girls would be found alive, but you never want to REALLY believe that. At least now the families have some closure, however painful. Weaver fits the FBI's profile pretty much to a T. They had predicted the abductor would be a white male about his age. They had said he probably liked the limelight. Weaver had been telling the press for several weeks that he was the chief suspect, acting like their suspicions were totally unfounded and bordered on harrassment. He even gave the press a tour of his home at one point. He even got national coverage. It wasn't until his son called police to report that his father had raped his girlfriend that things started to break open. Once they had Weaver in jail for the rape charge, they were able to pursue legal avenues that allowed them to search the home and property more thoroughly. The paper is saying that Weaver actually gave his permission for them to do the search, saying he wanted to give the families closure. This is a guy who was convicted in the mid-80s of hitting a baby sitter with a chunk of concrete, along with a slew of other charges in his past. He had a history of having a violent temper. His father is serving time for rape and murder in California. Weaver was a tragedy waiting to happen. Ashley had spent a LOT of time with Weaver, to the point that her family considered it abnormal. They say he was trying to control her. A year ago that changed when she accused him of molesting her, but she still had contact with him and I don't think any charges were brought against him at that time, at least none were prosecuted. I won't be surprised if the pieces get put together and it comes out something like this (this is my rendition based on the current information available, not fact): Ashley left for school on January 9th, salking down the hill from the apartments to the bus stop. As she went past Weaver's home (it's unavoidable as you leave the apartment complex), Weaver called to her and asked her to come talk or look at something or help him with something. When she went into his home, something happened that got him angry. Maybe he made advances and she fought back. Maybe he tried to convince her that he had never molested her and she argued. In any case, he got mad and he got violent and he killed her. He had to get rid of her body, so he put her in the barrel and decided to pour the concrete slab for a hot tub. Perfect spot to hide a body under. It works. Everyone is looking for Ashley, but no one seems to suspect him. He expresses concern for her, too, but postulates to anyone who will listen that she probably ran away. He even buys a tciket to a dance tribute held as a reward fund raiser for Ashley. Now he's feeling confident. He's also escalated his violence to a new level. This is now feeling...interesting to him. After a while, though, the rush fades. No one pays attention to him or asks him for his opinions about Ashley's disappearance anymore, although Ashley's mom (whom he has never liked) still gets media attention. He's becoming restless. Two months after Ashley's disappearance (exactly to the day), Miranda leaves the apartments to head for the school bus stop. She was friends with Ashley and also knew Weaver. Weaver calls out to her and somehow gets her to come inside. It's not inconceivable to me that he might even have said he heard from Ashley and asked her to come read a message or listed to something on an answering machine. She goes into the house and a similar scenario plays out. Something makes him mad. Perhaps when she finds out there is no message, she reminds him of the molestation incident. Perhaps he tries to molest her and she fights back. Heck, at this point, maybe he doesn't even need a trigger. This guy is sick. I'm just so grateful that they caught him as quickly as they did. He wouldn't have stopped. If the attention had faded from him, he would have needed to get that rush again and another young girl would have disappeared. Sorry this is so long. It's such a sad situation.  |
Hillbilly | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 08:36 am     Max...i's respects yourn opinion and its yourn right to state it. I's realize THESE gals weren't taken from their home...but there's others that was. Please feel free to ignore ma posts ifn they's don't meet yourn standards... yu's have a good un... |
Rissa | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 09:51 am     Ratlady/Max, terrifying to put yourselves in the parents shoes, isn't it? I have three girls and my heart breaks thinking about what they are going through. It's hard to find a solution though. My daughters have all taken self-defensive and awareness classes as part of their karate training (I have a THING about teaching girls to do things they cannot reasonably continue as adults like ballet or gymanstics but that's another thread). I watch them get on the school bus in the morning and get off in the afternoon. My oldest (13) can now take her two younger sisters to a movie on their own but I make sure it's not a crowded theatre, I drop them off.. watch them walk in and am parked in front of the doors when they exit. Besides reasonable precautions, I take my chances. Sounds flippant when you are talking about children's lives but that's what it is. I can't keep my kids in a cage or follow them around 24/7. I want them to grow into independant, self-confidant adults who are not afraid of shadows. {sigh} The solution is out of our hands as parents... we need the court system to keep these people in prison once there. Study after study has shown that child molestors are the one group above all others who cannot be rehabilitated. So why consider parole at all? We need our prisons to get out of the confinement business and into the rehabilitation business for other types of criminals. What good does it do to put a petty thief in prison and then let him out an armed robber 5 years later? What good does it do to put an assulter (brand new word. {G}) in prison and have him come out with even more anger management issues? They had a study about a decade back about a 2 year rehab program (I think in Washington) where they had a 95% success rate with rapists(on adults not children) after 5 years. But the program was stopped because it cost too much. Ask their next victim if the cost was too high. We need to protect our children and stop the abuse that often leads them to become these type of adults. I think this man should be put someplace where he never sees a child again.. whether that be a dark cell or a grave is not my decision to make. |
Hillbilly | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 10:12 am     Rissa I's agree 100% with what's yu's jest said. I's dismayed that this feller who took that little Samantha had been tried for molestin two other gals but was acquitted. I's don't understand why's they chose ta not believe the two gals who said he's molested them. I realize our justice system is based on 'innocent until proven guilty...but i's jest thinks there's got to be somethin that can be done ta stop these people. I's one who believes that onct a sexual predator/molester is release...the community has a right ta know that these folks is livin there. These people forfeit their right ta privacy as far as I'm concerned. I's got two gals myself and I's wants ta know ifn my gals is in jeopardy so's I can remove them ifn I's thinks its best or take more precautions. I would most likely move em far away. I's think the public has the right ta know! I can't state that strong enough... |
Max | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 11:08 am     The news just reported that the owner of a local real estate investment firm has offered to buy homes for both Miranda's and Ashley's families. He said he cannot imagine the pain of having to drive past the Weaver home every day to go to their apartments (his house is right next to the entrance to the complex). He said he would pay to relocate them. He also said he will pay for 1 year's worth of psychological counseling for the families. Now THAT's a generous offer. The day they started searching the premises, they put up a big chain-link fence all around the property. That's now a HUGE memorial site, with flowers, candles, stuffed animals, notes and signs all over it. There are people there 24/7 right now, including tons of media. I cannot imagine being one of those moms and having to go past that scene every time I wanted to leave my apartment. |
Max | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 11:16 am     I don't have kids and it's hard for me to imagine how scary it must be to raise them these days. Finding the balance between protecting them and smothering them has got to be a real challenge. Here's a summary page of the local coverage of the investigation all the way back to Ashley's disappearance. |
Reader234 | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 11:33 am     I so agree, my heart is breaking. Every time I hear about this, I get so angry. I have had experience and know that pediphiles do NOT rehab!! (a psych. even told my extended family this! and yep I'm one that thought castration was a proper alternative! but even then the psych said it would do little to curb the pediphile - he would still have his obsession,addiction, and would carry it out) But in your post you talked about rapists, and the expense of rehab, but I wonder if there was a difference between a rapist (a violent crime) and a pediphile. I also got upset when they are debating how and when to use the Amber alert, afraid that if they use it too often people will tune it off!! 'excuse me???!!! I know that there has been a debate on the fact that the caucasian cases get more nat'l coverage in the media than others, well, change it!! Bring it out in the public! I often hear the song the Carpenters recorded , Bless the Beast and the Children, for in this world they have no voice, they have no choice. |
Rose_City | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 11:38 am     Hi All, I, too, live in the Portland suburbs and have been in the dumps, feeling heartsick for the family and friends of those girls. What's making me insane, though, is the constant media coverage, to the point where it's exploitive. Sure people are emotionally invested in these two sweet souls and want to know what's happening, but the news is reiterating every unconfirmed detail ad nauseum. If I were a friend of the family, I'd be terribly distraught if every time I turned on the tube of radio, I heard all these gruesome details over and over. I think the families should be given privacy and respect, though I know it's a public case. I know, too, this isn't abnormal. Whether news is national or local, if it captures interest, every ounce of story is squeezed dry. The whole thing is so sad. I've been going nuts lately, in the wake of all these kidnappings, going to major department stores and seeing tiny kids running up and down the aisles alone! What are the parents thinking? Hillbilly: I agree: People need to take every precaution possible to stay safe. Thanks all for reading and being there. Love to you and yours. |
Alegria | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 03:28 pm     Max your post was very helpful in putting what happened to the girls in context. It really is too much to absorb. When I read about the son's girlfriend and details about Weaver's ex-wives I was shocked. Some time ago I read that child abuse plays out for at least three generations and it depressed me. This summer there have been quite a few nationally reported cases where young girls have disappeared. How sad. Parents have to find the balance between teaching their children to be careful and also to trust while remaining ever vigilant. I really think that young people have to feel that they are inheriting a wonderful world, one with many problems and potential crises looming, but a place to contribute to and joyfully explore. What a challenge. |
Aria | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 03:44 pm     OMG I just realized that I saw this guy being interviewed on some morning show quite some time ago. At the time I thought his theory sounded odd but felt that giving him the benefit of the doubt seemed reasonable. This is just the most horrible thing. I cannot imagine the turmoil the son must have felt turning his own father in. I am happy to hear about the offer for the families to move. This story seems very similar to one that happened in Vancouver that is on trial right now where the neighbor killed the little girl. He too was interviewed on TV during the search and helped with the search. So creepy and sad. |
Jewels | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 04:03 pm     I am here in the Portland area too and this case really saddens me. At least he is sitting in jail right now on the rape charge, so nothing has to be rushed through. They announced today that they are seeking an indictment and will convene a grand jury in the "future". When you look back at the actions of Ward Weaver it is sickening. From him saying that he would like Miranda to come home because she was a nice girl, but Ashley can stay where ever she is to the fact that he allowed the media into his home and they show him sitting on the back step smoking a cigarette next to the concrete slab that he poured for his "hot tub", it is disgusting. Some of you in the area may not know that his father is on death row at San Quentin for murdering a man and woman. He had buried the woman in his yard, I believe, under cement. He was also turned in by a son. I hope the investigators leave no stone unturned. There are so many questions to be asked, we many never know the answers to them all. I just keep telling myself, it is not about me knowing....it is about the police/FBI doing their job, collecting facts and prosecuting the correct person. Also, it is about the families of these two girls, they have been through so much in the last 8 months. I hadn't heard, Max, about the real estate firm offering to move the families and provide counseling. That is awesome. |
Reader234 | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 10:18 pm     {{{hugs}}} Jewels, thanks for the update,so hard! |
Max | Monday, August 26, 2002 - 11:11 pm     And tonight, the sadness deepened as the investigators announced that the remains found in the barrel beneath the concrete slab are indeed those of Ashley Pond. At least the families have "closure", but that is of little comfort. Aria, unfortunately, people who do this sort of thing have a similar pattern. That pattern includes making themselves as much a part of the ensuing investigation as they can. These people are truly sick and twisted. And, yes, you saw Ward Weaver on Good Morning America. He was getting a lot of media attention at that time because he had been asked some questions by the police and given a lie detector test. After that questioning, he went to the media and said he was the chief suspect. He did whatever he could to get attention while denying that he had any involvement in the case. It's only now that he's saying he doesn't want to talk to the media. Probably because his lawyer advised it. I don't think it's unreasonable that we gave him the benefit of the doubt at that point. I'd rather do that than jump to a wrong conclusion. It's the job of the police to figure out what's what, and they did that. I hope that this was the first time Ward Weaver had gone this far. Unfortunately, these kinds of folks tend to keep going once they've escalated to killing. Hopefully he's been caught before he can hurt anyone else. I also hope that the girl in Lake Oswego who staged a scene to make it look like she had been abducted "gets it" now. (She ran off to Seattle with her older boyfriend, leaving behind her car with the family dogs inside, keys on the ground, and a broken bracelet, making it look like something bad had happened.) She's facing several different charges around that little stunt and I hope it's sinking into her head how serious it was to have done such a stupid thing. The memorial wall that has been created in the chain link fence surrounding the property grew all day. |
Ratlady | Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 09:29 am     Max, I can't agree with you more about the Lake Oswego girl! How cruel can you be? I really hope she gets the book thrown at her and not just some type of comunity service. People like her need to realize that things like that are NOT something to take lightly! I hope that now, Miranda and Ashleys' families can find closer and try to move forward. I can't even begin to imagine what it would be like to have your child ripped away from you like that. Knowing that you will never see them again. All I could think about was how that could be one of my girls. Just thinking about someone doing anything to my girls puts tears in my eyes. Personally, I can't understand what Ashleys mom was thinking! When Ashley went home and told her mom that Weaver had molested her, she did NOTHING about it! No charges were filed, she didn't even bother to take her to see a doctor!! How could you not do anything when your child comes to you and tells you that someone has hurt them?? That completely bolws my mind! I know, that if one of my daughters came to me with something like that, I would do anything and everything in my power to make sure that justice was served. In my eyes, if my child comes home and accuses someone of touching them in a way they shouldn't, then that person is guilty until proven innocent! Ok, I think I'm done ranting for now. RIP Ashley and Miranda |
Max | Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 11:03 am     Yeah, I don't understand why nothing was done when Ashley said Weaver was molesting her, either. Today's paper has some more info about that. SHe reported it to a teacher, too, and the teacher contacted the state child welfare folks. The caseworker the teacher contacted said she would pass it along to the "regular" caseworker (Ashley had a caseworker already because of an abuse incident with her birth father, who was prosecuted and plead no contest), but apparently never did. When Ashley went missing, the teacher called investigators and described the report and the investigator said there was no record of it. She called again when Miranda went missing because she never heardback, but no one ever contacted her. Weaver had told media that he had learned of the allegations from a prosecutor and said he had been told that the credibility of the story was questionnable. It appears, although it's hard to really know, that this is another case of too many agencies passing the information along and no one really picking up the ball and running with it. Most likely this was exacerbated because the allegations came at the same time that Ashley was abused by her birth father and also made allegations about other men molesting her. It's a tragedy all the way around. If they had pursued Weaver on the molestation charges, both girls might be alive. If they had followed up on those accusations after Ashley disappeared, Miranda might still be alive. However, it is always easier for us to use 20-20 hindsight in these situations than to recognize the problems as they are occuring.
Ashley Miranda |
Reader234 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 06:18 am     Max, It just gets worse doesnt it? Last night the repeat of Judging Amy was on the dcf caseworker dropping the ball, and the caseworker, and Amy's mom both were important for the general public to see. I'm a teacher, so of course my heart goes out to the teacher who is suffering, how can she not? (of course in this case there is many places for our hearts to break over! I couldnt help remembering how we, the public, value the actors, sports figures, and yet we ignore such a large part of our society!! I realize its not a 'fair' assesmment, but if we show value with things we pay for, why is it that our service people are always regulated to the back seat? Would it have helped Ashley and Miranda if social workers were paid more? Only if there were more "dedicated" social workers! Too many children need our help, and yet out of sight ou t of mind. Also, I just want to add while watching news clips from Oregon, they always showcase the fence. It is overwhelming how the people of Oregon are trying to honor the lives of 2 children. I get goosebumps every time I see a newscast, its tremendous! No one has mentioned the real estate mans offer. I imagine from the outpouring of love from Oregan that there are a lot of people that will support him!! Is there any info on the man who owns the property? I cant imagine how he must feel also! When John Wayne Gacy's horrors were uncovered in his house, and crawlspace etc, well the house was razed, and I think its more of a park/empty place.(I just recall its not a house anymore, but it was in a subdivision, with lots of modest homes on either side, I think!) |
Max | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 11:28 am     The property owner was on the news last night. He gave one channel a walk-thru of the house. I didn't watch it, but the clips advertising it were unavoidable. He's not sure what to do with the property. Some have suggested making it a park, but it's on a busy road, pretty much across the street from a chicken processing plant -- not the best place for a park. The house sits on a one-acre parcel. If they could get the zoning changed, maybe they could sell it for commercial use or something. I would imagine that the resale value is pretty small right now. And, could you imagine renting it after all this? Probably not many takers there, either, unless it was dirt cheap. Today's paper says there are allegations of Weaver molesting another girl, a young relative of his son's girlfriend (the one he got arrested for raping). There is also news that an investigation into the disappearance of a 16-year-old girl in Eureka, CA back in 1997 has been reopened. Apparently, that's where Weaver used to live. Yes, the memorial fence is touching. I wonder, though, what happens to all that stuff when the fence comes down (which should be any day now? Flowers and balloons will be gone. Written notes will, I'm sure, be kept by the families. Maybe the stuffed animals and figurines will go to a children's charity or something. One thing is for sure, that fence is part of the grieving and healing process for the community. I just wish that all that outpouring of support would translate into some sort of action. Imagine what kinds of community service could be performed if all the effort that's going into that memorial was put towards working with children in the foster care system or being court advocates through the CASA program or reclaiming an empty lot and turning it into a community garden or... the list of possibilities is endless. |
Jewels | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 01:12 pm     I saw a little bit of the interview with the landlord. They toured the house and showed how the investigators basically gutted it. They took the carpet, tore some sheetrock and insulation off the walls, marked on the walls where things were, but basically took everything out of it. The landlord said he didn't know what he was going to do with it, but said he wanted to get rid of it. He also said he wants to keep the memorial wall up as long as possible. I can't find a link to the article, but I caught the tail end of a story that KOIN did last night about the real estate investor who has offered to buy the houses and pay for counseling. Apparently, he either is or has been investigated regarding some past loans he has set up for people that were shady. They talked to some former employees and they said they would not do business with him and would be skeptical. I really hope this guys heart is in the right place. |
|