Archive through September 18, 2003
TV ClubHouse: Archive: Ali's Parents' Interview:
Archive through September 18, 2003
Crazydog | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:42 am     I can understand how you feel that way C1mag, it does seem like that tone does exist sometimes. Personally I think they are both the type of people that I would not trust. I didn't condone Will's behavior, but once Monica was evicted I rooted for him just because I didn't like Hardy and Nicole. I do think there is a slight difference, though between how Will and Nicole played. Will picked one team from the beginning, and one by one Chilltown was eliminated. He never made any efforts to join another team. He was just an outsider. The remaining houseguests always discounted him because they thought he was irrelevant and disliked and easy to beat in the finals. And I believe he did tell everyone in the beginning that he was not to be trusted and that he was going to lie. I don't think Alison ever said that in the beginning. In fact, on the CBS site she says her strategy to win is to not lie, not cheat, and not talk behind others backs. I think her biggest flaw is that she has made others feel that she was on their team when she really wasn't. She hopped from side to side depending on which way the wind blew. Will never did that. To me, he was always the underdog - little ole him against everyone else. Alison's tactics are more of a strongarming type. I think that's why I would find her more offensive than Will. |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:45 am     Lance, I can't remember exactly, but I swear I recall Will's final speech and he talked about how stupid everyone was for believing him when in the beginning he had told them not to trust him. I remember hearing that speech and wondering why he was doing that, because he was antagonizing them. I thought that he might have lost because of that speech. |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:46 am     the comments about Roberts daughter were wrong as were Roberts comments about women in general. Give her and Jun a chance to appologize for them and I'm sure they'd do the same as Robert. They would be embarrassed and wish they had never said it. As for this years tone of the house it's unfortunate that it went to trashville but it did. The majority just couldn't survive in this game without pelting each other with comments behind each others back. Sweet little Michelle was saying she hated Erika and wanted her out on week two. The so called DreamTeam was constantly just trahsing and bashing the other side of the house late into the night. This was not the best year for this show. Hopefully they have learned and the diversity in age and social skills will only improve for next season. |
Sweetpea1994 | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:48 am     I understand that lying and manipulation are part of the game. But for me the way Ali (Jun & Robert) constantly ran down the other HG's was way over the line. All the name calling wasn't necessary to win the game. |
Monalisahi | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:50 am     I don't think the Alpha male/Alpha female rule applies with Ali and Jun, or at least it doesn't in my opinion. Had Ali and Jun lied, manipulated, deceived, backstabbed, bashed, etc. just for gameplay......I'd say good game. But, they've done it 24/7 and on matters that had nothing to do with the game. Jun said last night....America does know us, they've been watching us 24/7. Yep, they are not in "gameplay" mode at all times and I think those are the times that shows us a bit of insight into their personality. <No, I'm not a psychologist, I just think that's common sense.> And to correct what Justin said.....he told Jee and Robert that he could tell when Ali was lying to him. So obviously she wasn't always honest with him. I will give Ali credit for being a great competitor in the competitions and getting Nate to use the POV, but I think that is all she did well. Had the other hg's trusted her, then I'd say she pulled off the lying and manipulation well, but that wasn't the case. Everybody in the house knew that Jun and Ali were "floaters" so, IMO, they weren't that successful at it. |
Demsome | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:54 am     I am curious if anyone knows how old Ali's mom is. She looks very old, at least 70 but no way could she be that old. I have a daughter older than Ali.Anyone know? |
Sisalou | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:57 am     I agree with everything that Earthmother and Lancecrossfire said in their last posts. I just don't see why its necessary for ANY contestant in any of the BB's to spout constant name calling/character assasination, etc. I especially have a problem when Gerry/Jack were referred to as child molesters and Roberts daughter was called names. I'm also amazed that some folks were referred to as "self righteous child worshippers". IMHO that is the silliest thing I have ever heard. |
Carrie92 | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 09:58 am     crazy, you are right. Will told everyone all the way thru the game that he was a liar. That's why he won - he was upfront about his lying - they realized their own mistakes in believing him. With Ali it's different, she wants everyone to see her as all-American-girl-next-door-apple-pie-pageant-queen. She knows that's not what she is, they know that, and I think she is starting to realize that - and boy is she pissed now. I think Justin burst her bubble a little bit last night - that was the best part of the show! |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:02 am     Lance I still disagree about her comments not being a part of the game. This game doesn't end when a person leaves. They probably try to rationalize why they booted them. If jun thought ( and she did) that the man was a perv you'd get support from jun by saying the man was a perv. You do see how that works don't you? Dani from last year was very good at this. Don't forget that she heard Marcellus call Roddy "the devil" but later it became Danis mantra. If you hear someone saying they dislike someone in the game and you say to yourself... hmmm.. they don't like that person. Feed on it, bring it out in them and there is your reason for booting that person so that it won't be held against you and you use the person who is complaining about the person you want booted. Ali wasn't the only one saying she hated someone. Many were either indirectly saying it or directly saying it. It's a breakdown in the game. Find anything about another person that is negative so you can get rid of them. The goal was to get to the end and when you feel the tempo of the house you realize what it takes. Dana ripped that house appart on week 3 with a lot of emotion. The guantlet was laid down. Ali played them all based on how they felt about the other. Jun and Alis only mistake was the comment about Robs daughter. Stuff like that happens. It's not the worst thing ever said in the scope of life. Some get so wraped up in this GAME that all of a sudden they forget it's a game because they invested some type of daily emotion in it when they watch it on the feeds. Ali played based on the tempo of the house. She made it to the end. She made comments that she will appologize for however, she made it to the end. |
Carrie92 | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:02 am     Agree 100% with Monalisahi. |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:07 am     I clearly recall that Justin said to Ali that she had never lied to him. Was he lying when he said that to her? I have never gotten the impression that Ali wants them all to think she is some all american sweet as sugar thing. Another over analyzation on that issue. Ali and Jun weren't successful at this game? Uh they made it to the end. No other comment needed. They beat them all! I could go point by point how well Ali played this game when it counted. The ability to know how the vote was going was excellent. The remaining dreamteam players were told ... DON'T TRUST HER and yet in the end they still did. She was that good at it. BRILLIANT! |
Sisalou | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:07 am     C1 - Don't you think its possible to overplay? I mean if you have most of the jury if not all of them mad at you how is that good game playing? I think the person that has angered the least people is going to win this one. What do you think? ( I do like your commentaries on BB) |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:10 am     C1mag, I don't know if that's how she acted to the other houseguests, but that is definitely how I see what she thinks America thinks of her. In the diary room I definitely got the impression that Alison thinks she is the Cutest! Thing! Ever! and that she is America's sweetheart. Sometimes she has those bedroom eyes, that "I'm trying to be so cute and sweet" voice, etc. Didn't work on me. |
Carrie92 | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:11 am     C1, I disagree with your last statement. Much as I hate to admit it, I think Alison WAS the tempo of the house. I also think the show realized that early on. I'm not saying the show was rigged. But as far as what we know/saw and what actually made it to TV - well, let's just say I think the producers will be laughing all the way to the bank with our love-hate relationship with Alison. |
Lancecrossfire | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:15 am     If you play it as a game, you don't have to rationalize evicting someone. Certainly not to the extent of calling them the devil, a pervert a child molester, or anything else not game related. You don't tackle someone on the football field and make an excuse they are a pervert to make yourself feel it's ok to knock the crap out of them. You knock the crap out of them because they are carrying the board toward the endzone, and the game is to stop that from happening. If they are really playing BB as a game, you don't need an excuse for evict someone--you do it because they stand between you and the 500K. Ali apologizing at the end? maybe, maybe not. Jun apologizing? maybe, maybe not. We've seen that Ali can turn on the tears on command. At this point, if either do apologize, how would we know it was an honest apology?? And I'll go back to my original premise--if they played the game as a game, and not made all the extra comments/judgments, no apologies would be needed. Carson Daly had Reggie Miller on his show one night--they talked about trash talking--Reggie stated that even the worst of the trash talkers knew the line--to keep it within the context of the game. No family stuff, no personal stuff. They know it's a game. |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:15 am     Sure you can overplay thats how Dana lost this puppy. Ask the angered Jury members what they are really mad at. Are they mad because you didn't help them get the money? If so tell them to look up the rules and remind them you were there to play for yourself. Are they mad that you said something "naughty" about them? Ask them if they had ever said anything "naughty" about you or anyone else in the house. I'm still fifty fifty on this particular group and how they will vote based on emotion. Danas anger at Ali may actually get Ali the money. I don't think that Jack will vote based on anger and neither will Erika along with Nate. Robert might Dana definitely and Jee as well. Justin will not and I think he is gonna surprise a lot of people and vote for Ali. Besides what could he be mad at her for? |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:20 am     Lance perhaps this would be your approach in the game but the tempo in this house didn't not suggest that. You needed to villify and keep it up. Everyone is so busy trying to decide what type of human being that each player is they are forgetting that this game will turn you inside out and if the tempos to villify then thats how it will be. Last year it was the same thing. I think Marcellus talked about how that happened each week and then after that. It just happens. Perhaps if you were in the house you could control the tempo and keep it clean. This year if you dared to play it clean there was a target on ya. You went with the flow. Perhaps this is why the trash talking was allowed. Just let it happen. To stand against it could put a target on you. I don't think those playing the game are asking our approval but I get why it's done. Would it be my approach? I think I'd baite someone to do it for my benefit and leave it at that but watching it I get it. |
C1mag | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:26 am     The tempo of hatred and trash talking was created by Jun. She was in Danas ear on that 3rd week and filled her full of all kinds of crapola. From that moment on Jun worked very hard to stir it up and keep things divided and she saw who the most vulnerable were to play the hatred game with her. Everyone wants to let off steam in the house and Jun offered and ear for those that wanted to rip on someone else. She would start if off and the other one would chime right in. It was like a persons own private therapist and she loved every second of it. Crazy you made me laugh so thanks! I guess I just see in Ali a very confident young lady. So Jaded about herself but I've never allowed any of them to bother me to the point where I don't see past the flaws when it comes to the game. Robert was by far my most entertaining of the group. I could have messed with that dude all along if I was in there and had a ball. LOL |
Lancecrossfire | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:32 am     C1--I think it happens because the game is played by folks for the most part who aren't higher level competitors. If they were, they wold more likely be practiced at not having to vilify someone in order to feel ok about evicting them. That, in part, was the contradiction for me about Ali--she is a competitor in both ice skating and in beauty pageants. Justin is as well, and very rarely made it about hating someone or thinking anyone was some kind of monster. I am sure if I were playing, I wouldn't be able to control the tempo of the house in that respect. I would remind people it's ok to evict someone and still like them. Would it put a target on my back? I'm sure it would. I'd be evicting someone for 1 of 3 reasons--because their behaviors were so opposite of mine that I was feeling very stressed in the house, they were the strongest competition in my view, or they went back and forth. The last of the three would be the one I'd be most likely to use. I don't mind going against someone strong who is coming at me face to face. For me, that is a good battle and worthy of my efforts. That is why I would have gotten rid of Jun and Ali first if I had been Jack or Erika or J3--I'd want to go against the other alliance head on, and may the best person win. That would put a target on my back as well. It's also why I would never be picked for BB--I wouldn't cause all the crap they like to have happen. I'd be a lot like Jack, although I hope I would do a little better on the competitions. |
Steveh | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 10:54 am     Am I the only one who makes snap judgments about people I see on TV all the time? I don't think that's necessarily a good thing or bad thing, just part of human normalcy. I thought boards like this were designed so that I could share my judgments with others and they could tell me what they think about them. I think Ali and Ali's parents have given me plenty to extrapolate accurately from. BB may be just a game, but it's a game played by HUMAN beings, exhibiting HUMAN qualities, often times while in fairly "normal" situations (group meals, group discussions, etc.). Finally, I believe Ali--winner of multiple beauty pageants and now one of the winners of BB--surely perceives herself as America's sweetheart. We'll find out soon enough. |
Monalisahi | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 11:03 am     C1mag...when I said they weren't successful, I meant at being "floaters." Not at the game. That was one thing I said about last night when Jun said all the men underestimated them...that simply wasn't true. They think it is, but it isn't, so they had as little knowledge as Robert did when it came to what was going on in the house. Thinking back, didn't they mainly just switch sides and vote with the majority? Yes, they were successful at getting to the end of a game which gets rid of the strongest players, so I think asking "who's the strongest player" at the end is kind of silly. That's one thing I don't like about this game or Survivor....the best players are voted out because they are threats. Just once, I want to actually see it come down to the 2 strongest players. We don't like seeing comps thrown, yet that advances you in the game because everybody thinks you are weak. In this respect, I have no problem with Ali being in the finals, she was strong in the comps....well, except for the final HOH comp. The majority of the evictions boil down to this.....you are a better player than me, so you have to go. |
Missapril | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 11:22 am     omission of 'facts' if known by an officer of the court is a crime. and yuo really know attorney's who practice this 'tactic'? amateurs... every single second of every single day in the house they are on 'game playing' mode - the cameras don't stop and teh game doesn't either. not a psychologist? no kidding! LOL! |
Puzzled | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 11:41 am     You don't tackle someone on the football field and make an excuse they are a pervert to make yourself feel it's ok to knock the crap out of them. LOL--great point. |
Monalisahi | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 11:54 am     Since when is the omission of facts by an officer of the court a crime. I don't recall Shapiro jumping up and saying "OJ did it!!!!" |
Badabing | Thursday, September 18, 2003 - 12:00 pm     LMAO ! Good one Mona... |
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