Frostbite
MoveCloseDeleteAdmin

TV ClubHouse: Archive: Frostbite
 SubtopicMsgs  Last Updated
Archive through September 24, 2003 26   09/24 09:46pm
Archive through September 25, 2003 25   09/25 07:09am
Archive through September 25, 2003 25   09/25 09:06am

Earthmother

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:31 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Puzzled they have edited voting that way for every eviction for the last 2 years. I guess they think we still don't get it....lol

Gina8642

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:38 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I never saw BB1 and deliberately left it out of my comments.

But in BB2 I saw the exact same treatment aimed toward Nicole I saw aimed toward Jun and Ali last night. In BB3 I saw it aimed at Danielle. The moral condemnation of the evicted HGs just comes off as rediculous to me. I guess that just my opinion and you all are entitled you yours.

Gina8642

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Puzzled - you are right - that editing was SOOOO obvious to anyone who's watched this before. When I saw that, I thought to myself Maybe Jun will win 7-0. LOL, my best guess before the show was 5-2. Close, but no cigar.

Spunky

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:50 am EditMoveDeleteIP
You've noticed how Ali took the brunt and not Jun in last night's show, BB knew Jun was the winner and was careful in not showing any bad stuff Jun said in the DR.
Also, it seemed to me that the vote was changed (we can never be sure of that) after they've seen the DR entries. Right after the Q&A session there seemed to be more votes for Ali, even from Erika it looked to be for Ali.
Robert knew and mentioned how Ali and Jun referred to his daughter and this makes me think he did get outside information.
The questions were first asked Ali and then Jun, this was an advantage to Jun who saw how Ali replied and give an extra kick in her own campaigning against Ali.
You could tell Ali was annoyed at Jun's campaigning, she clearly felt Jun didn't need to say anything against Ali to convince the Jury.
I wonder if their last week there was unbearable for both of them, no matter how much they said they were best friends, these two were not.
Notice that Jun said she'd like keep in touch with Jack..and not Ali, while Ali said she'd keept in touch with Jun.... yeah for now.
Anyway, I think they all deserved the cold shoulder, even the losers.

Tmleafs4life

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:50 am EditMoveDeleteIP
What I don't get, is that the houseguests justified their personal/racial attacks on other houseguests as being part of their strategy in the game. If I'm not mistaken, most of those comments were either made when they were alone (especially in Erika's case w/regards to Jee) or in the diary room. The diary room entries can't be seen as strategic moves, because they don't affect the outcome of the game!

Steveh

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:55 am EditMoveDeleteIP
David heard Erika's comment. He reacted benignly to it.

Emdanzma

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:57 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I feel it was a very lame ending...no one wanted either girl to win. No excitement...not even from the winners. Maybe they should have showed the hg's the entire season after tonight's show and then brought them back to bicker at one another. That was the best part in my opinion...the discussion of what people said and did. I like, really couldn't, like stand to hear like what Michelle had to, like, say. She was like TRAUMatized. Oh my God. I can't believe she was that upset about David! Big deal, he ahd sex and wasn't truthful about it while in the house. It was no one's business in the game.

I also notice the editing. They always have this need to try and pull one over on us, shock us, surprise us, whatever. And sadly, I fall for it everytime! I was actually thinking...hmmm Ali might win this! But then I look back and realized that's what they WANT us to think right up until the votes are revealed! I'm so gullible!

Charvie

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:00 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Erika's comment, though bad, was a one time comment. She didn't drag it out or discuss it at every turn. Jee wasn't exactly a golden boy when he attatcked and decided to hate on Erika because she told him his hair was in her basket in the bathroom. Or when he nominated her the second time. Dana was unmerciful when she talked about Erika. Remember the late night bash session in the HOH with the other houseguests, or the long talks with Jun about Erika in the most disgusting, nitpicking way? Had these two hadn't been as vicious and underhanded in their attacks on Erika, than I would have sympathy for them. But they weren't. If anything they were far worse and with out justification other than what Robert "claimed: to have known about her. And don't get me started on Robert. lol

Emdanzma

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:06 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree about Erika having the one time comment. I don't recall many times where she said something that bad about someone else. It was also in the very beginning when they were anti- ex's and hadn't she just been nominated by Jee when she said that? It was clearly anger in that moment and she didn't keep saying throughout the game about Jee.

Earthmother

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:06 am EditMoveDeleteIP
None of the hgs were happy with each other. I don't believe the icy reception was just against the two finalists..

Charvi, I don't think most of the ugly stuff said about Jack or Erika were ever broadcast. They really didn't get a chance to see the things Dana said or the way Jun and Ali fabricated a story and tried to get Jee to believe Jack was behaving inappropriatley towards them.

Sweetpea1994

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:06 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree with Charvie. Erika made the comment after Jee nominated her for eviction saying she couldn't be trusted. There is no excuse but it was a "heat of the moment" comment. She also did not continue to use it, because she obviously knew it was wrong.

Chippy

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Spunky, I think BB asked all the evicted hg "why do either Ali or Jun deserve to win" (separately) and then aired the reasons Ali should win. LOL... they must have had more reasons for her NOT to win. They do always try to mislead- which is not expected and therefore, I was more convinced that Jun won every second they were making it to look like Ali had it in the bag.

Speaking of bags... how's your funbags, Wood? And, where's Onlyhuman? :) :) :)

Kalekona

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Gina they were not condeming Ali and Jun for lying, that's part of the game. But rather their actions, and comments that crossed the line.

Yes they all said things but the venom and vileness with which Jun and Ali spoke was not even on the same level as the other HG.

It clearly wasn't sour grapes at loosing, as each had given the other two credit for playing a good game.

I knew it was going to be a bumpy ride when erika walked in the house and didn't embrace either ali or jun.. and the parade marched on. Robert didn't even try and pretend he walked passed them head down and went right to the couch.

The sad thing was ali still doesn't get it.. her response about the reaction of the others was "some of them lost their focus in the game and fail to see it is game play" HUH? No ali it was vile not game play and it was you, take some responsibility..

All in all since none of the viewers were very excited about who the winner was i found it appropriate that when the moment came and Jun was the winner there was no excitment for her either.

No this years ending came nowhere near the past three, in thepast they at least pretended to have a bond, they may have called Dani out but they didn't shun her.

Emdanzma

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Wonder if any of the hg's will come here to read the old live feeds. It'd take forever, but there was stuff going on that never aired.

Sweetpea1994

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:09 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I just wanted to add that I feel like Erika and Robert and to an extent Jack got a bad rap for their comments. I read the live feeds daily and the other HG's said nasty things also (not to the extent that Jun & Ali did, with the exception of Robert maybe) but most of that was not shown on the show.

Watching2

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:10 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Actually, it appeared to me that Dave was laughing at Erika's comment. I'll have to watch the tape again to make sure, but I recall a huge grin on his face or something to that effect.

Monalisahi

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:10 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I don't remember Erika saying the racial remarks were strategy. Unless you consider Man-troll to be racial.

Spunky, I can't speak for Erika, but had Ali told me I was riding on her coattails, I'd change my vote.....real quick. Besides, it was all edited. We didn't get to see everything.

Kalekona

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:14 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Monalisahi - your right i forgot about the coattail remark..

And yes Dave was laughing at Erikas comments about Jee.

Charvie

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:20 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think the problem the HGs had with Erika(and Jack) is that they expected her to be better than them and not stoop to their level of name calling and bashing. WHy. I have no clue. She is human, has feelings and obviously has a temper. She for the most part tried to play it fair, but I believe she had her breaking points. And remember they treated Erika like an outsider all the time. Even when she tried to be friends with them, they figured she was being fake or phony.

Gina8642

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:23 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think Alison said that Erika said that Erika was riding on Alison's coattails. Alison agreed with her. So I think Erika took it as less a jab than one might think, since she voiced the notion herself. Still a jab.

Gina8642

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:29 am EditMoveDeleteIP
The reason Erika IMO comes accross as a hypocrite is the fact that she freqeuntly judged people for not being nice and kind when she was guilty of the exact same. If she hadn't been judgemental she would have come off as much better, because it's true, she did less of the vile stuff than Jun & Ali. However, she was far from innocent. Judge not lest ye be judged? It's the whole casting stones thing, and she was slinging a lot of stones. LOL

Murph

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:33 am EditMoveDeleteIP
"Sorry Erika - I don't believe you that is was strategy, you were just a mean spirited and cruel as Jun & Ali. "

I have to disagree, as horrible as Erika's remarks were about Jee that happened the second week. To my knowledge, from watching the live feeds, reading the updates on various boards, I never heard another racist remark nor a homophobic remark from Erika. Jun and Ali never stopped making there remarks right up to the last, and they were given a free pass on their remarks. CBS never aired their remarks or asked them to explain.

How do we know that Erika did not further explain herself to Jee and Dana? I have watched the editing this year make the worst or best out of people. To me, right to the end, CBS was unfair in how people were portrayed.

IMO, I think Erika was the most upset at herself for the remarks and will regret them. I do not think that Jun or Ali will ever regret their remarks. To me that is a BIG difference.

Puzzled

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Right, Earthmother, they've done it so many times and think it still suspense--duh.

I didn't guess the numbers, either, Gina, but, duh, knew Jun won.

Charvie

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:51 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think IMO the problem most have with Erika is a perception problem. Not one based on a whole lot of facts. I don't ever remember her being judgemental, just that she didn't want to participate in the bashing of hgs. Didn't mean she didn't say a unkind word.
First, she told Jee after they evicted Michelle, before the HOH that she wasn't coming after him. She tried to save Dana, she felt that Dana could be dealt with after the exes were gone. She didn't like Jun but she didn't try and get rid of her either.
Erika didn't put out a whole lot of warm fuzzies. She was distant and kept things to herself. She wasn't doing it because she thought she was better, but because that is her personality. I never ever heard Erika go on a holier than thou tirade. Even the time she talked about Jun, she stopped herself and said that she doesn't want to trash talk like Jun does.
She even got tired of the Dana bashing and said why are we still talking about her.
She's not perfect and it is her standoffish not getting in the thick of things, that I respected and got irrated by. Because had she done what they were doing, she may have went further in the game right on into the final two.

Monalisahi

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:53 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Gina said: The reason Erika IMO comes accross as a hypocrite is the fact that she freqeuntly judged people for not being nice and kind when she was guilty of the exact same. If she hadn't been judgemental she would have come off as much better, because it's true, she did less of the vile stuff than Jun & Ali. However, she was far from innocent. Judge not lest ye be judged? It's the whole casting stones thing, and she was slinging a lot of stones. LOL


Gina, I can agree with that. That's pretty much the problem I had with Jee and Justin too.

Earthmother

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:57 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I can't remember Erika judging people for not being nice..maybe you could refresh my memory. I think she was angry with herself for losing control and making those comments, but I also feel she was adult enough not to call out other's behaviors and try to embarrass them like they did her. She and Jack did admit they were wrong and apologized..I didn't see Jee or Dana coughing up some of the crap they spewed that wasn't televised and apologizing for their behavior..so yes there was some hypocrisy.

Kalekona

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:59 am EditMoveDeleteIP
We didn't see the entire confrontation, just the highlights. I'm sure they all got called out on things and apologies were given.

Earthmother

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 10:03 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Kale, We should have seen everyone who was called out...why would they leave out the same people on the last show that they left out duing the season? hmmmmmmm can't imagine!!

Monalisahi

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 10:04 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Earth...correct....nothing from Jee saying he was sorry for saying "women shouldn't even be educated." Maybe that's on the editing room floor though. :)

Kalekona

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 10:11 am EditMoveDeleteIP
They only had an hour.
Robert had already been called out. So they used the issues that were the biggest watercooler/internet discussions.

Niceguy

Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:27 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I going to have to add this:

The game has rules. Homicide as a strategy to win the game is not allowable.

Granted, no one rose to the level of physical threat like Justin or Mega this year(Scott was more of a threat to himself than others)but the emotional and mental violence was numbing.

The show was great last night. The negativity those two emitted boomeranged back on them. Jun's won quite a bit of money but she understands that no one in the house is happy for her(and wait 'til she gets back home after a few weeks).

Keiffer:I just think that it was WAY unfair of the producers to set up Ali and Jun like that, and it spoiled what should have been a fun show for them.

Jun and Ali were reaping what they sowed. Its not supposed to be a fun show for them. Its supposed to be entertainment for the television audience.

It's a TV show.

I will say that I'm glad that Erika did not get into the final two. The whole JoshBB1/Belly connections thing really goes against the grain of what the show's creators intended. Erika is as phony as it gets.

But damn, she's a hot babe...as you can see I'm ambivalent about her.