Trinity63 | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:04 am     My thoughts -- Jun I think was humiliated and humbled. And perhaps rightly so. However, I think she may have learned a great big lesson. Ali on the other hand. No I don't think so. I think I actually heard her apologizing to her Dad for not winning? How lame is that? What did you all think? I don't think I am going to watch next year. I know I know -- I say that now. |
Sweetpea1994 | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:08 am     I don't think either of them believe they did anything wrong. Their feelings may have been hurt about being snubbed but they both think that is because the other HG's are just mad about them winning, not because they did anything wrong. |
Chippy | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:11 am     Time will tell. Someone who saw or heard Jun's interview this morning didn't think she learned much. I haven't seen her answers to make any determination. I honestly doubt either will learn much and will rather see it as "it was a game" and "everybody did stuff". I hope not. |
Blazehockey | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:11 am     ooooops...wrong thread....sorry |
Misslibra | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:12 am     No not yet. |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:15 am     I think Jun is intelligent enough to realize the consequences of her actions and will learn and grow from the experience. I think Alison is clueless as evidenced from her reaction to the Donny letter. She said last night to Julie that everyone will be hurt from the experience of Big Brother. Instead of realizing what she did, she just turns it around in classic Alison fashion. I suppose if everyone gets hurt, it makes it OK. |
Earthmother | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:17 am     hahahahaha...the directions to the closest mall maybe. |
Kalekona | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 08:32 am     At least Jun understood why they reseved the reaction they got, she listened to what the HG were saying and she got it. Now does this mean she hould have changed things, who knows. Ali on the other hand was still blaming the others for her own actions. "they lost consentration during the game and fail to realize it was just playing the game" Sorry but i wanted to slap her...the things she said had nothing to do with playing the game. But she thinks she did nothing wrong it was everyone else who was just to sensitive. |
Denecee | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:13 am     I don't know if they learned anything but they will learn very soon that the real big brother will be taking 40% or more of their winnings. So let's see for Ali that will be a take home of approx. $30K which is great milk money. Jun lives in NY city? After taxes, she'll have about $300K which doesn't go far in the big city. These two sold themselves way too cheap. |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:17 am     I'd say $300,000 for three months of work is a pretty good salary. Even in New York. Jun is very savvy, and I think she could certainly turn her BB appearance into more opportunities if she really wanted to. |
Katlady53 | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:18 am     I'd like to think that Jun actually learned something from the experience due to her age, life experience and maturity level. Alternatively, she might just blow it all off since she got what she wanted in the end: money and Bob. I highly doubt that Ali learned anything at all. |
Csnog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:27 am     Did Dr. Will learn anything? Did Eddie learn anything? Did Lisa learn anything? Did we learn anything? |
Chippy | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:30 am     Yeah, we did. I think there's even a thread about that. LOL!! |
Spyder | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:40 am     Great topic! I realized last night that Jun winning was a much more satisfying ending for me for this very reason. Jun was capable of feeling some regret for her actions, and it was a bittersweet victory for her. Had Ali won the $500K she would have gloated and felt triumphant and rubbed it in everybody's face. Jun is not a very humble person, and it is likely she will forget the lessons she learned in the next few months, but she at least had a moment of self-reflection. Ali is incorrigible. And to respond to Csnog-- did Dr. Will learn anything? Heck yeah! I was amazed as I watched him on the Bravo special. He was articulate, observant and funny. The "Olive Garden line" was more insightful than any 20 thoughts Ali had combined this season. |
Csnog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 09:49 am     Then give both Ali and Jun a year or two also. They haven't had time to even see the shows nor read the internet. |
Monalisahi | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 10:20 am     I think they are both clueless |
Spunky | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 10:43 am     Give them time to see the tapes and then they'll understand why they got the cold shoulder. However, they'll say that they ALL, the losers too, said nasty things about them, and they'll call it even... with the difference that they have some more money than the others. |
Wendo | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:01 am     I don't know if the girls learned anything yet. They've only been out of the house less than 24 hours. I'm willing to give them each some time to read how their behavior was viewed by the interne audience at large. (Not good.) Based on Jun's interview on The Early Show, it doesn't appear so...yet. Until people are given the opportunity to be made aware of their actions, it's difficult to turn it into a learning experience. So, ask me in a couple of weeks. LOL! I think we'll have a better idea then. |
Steveh | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:07 am     Excellent observation Wendo - "Until people are given the opportunity to be made aware of their actions, it's difficult to turn it into a learning experience." No LOL, no sarcasm. You've explained perfectly to me why Ali--IMO--has never learned a thing throughout her entire life. She's squandered every opportunity to do so and this one will be no different. Now she's "sequestered" w/ her family, playing Point the Finger and other such familiar and familial games. In the past 25 years I've worked with a significant number of Ali-like students. I think Jun had some instant learning last night though. I can't imagine a sadder, emptier look on a person who just learned she'd won 500 K. |
Eliz87 | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:11 am     I thought Jun was foolish for feeling that way. For heaven's sake she just won $500K!!!!! I hate to sound heartless, but that's a lot of money. Of course she should have been happy about it. UGH. My husband (who doesn't pay attention to the show NEARLY as much as I do) commented that it seemed that all of the HG's had such big egos that they would have been upset with ANYONE winning if it wasn't themselves, so Jun shouldn't have let them get to her. EDITED TO ADD: I'm sure if anyone else had won, they wouldn't let anything that JUN thought or said get to them. They would be relishing the moment, as she should have been. |
Kalekona | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:12 am     <I think Jun had some instant learning last night though. I can't imagine a sadder, emptier look on a person who just learned she'd won 500 K. > So true... And isn't that what most of us wanted, for them to NOT be rewarded for the beahvior.. for Ali to leave that house not thinking that anything goes and she can get away with it.. While they got the money Jun at least did not get to enjoy the moment and Ali lost.. both consquenses of their actions. |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:19 am     I agree Eliz with your husband. I think they are all just pissed that they themselves didn't win. And what was up with Dana telling Jun that she had some apologizing to do to her? All I can recall is that Jun said in the DR that Dana is not her friend and that she was just using her to get ahead in the game. What was wrong with that? The thing is, Dana didn't even look pleased with Jun even before they saw the tapes. I would have thought that she would have been one of Jun's biggest supporters. She just was pissed awwwfff. |
Spyder | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:20 am     I agree with Steveh about Ali and Jun. I observed Jun's reaction, and it made me like her better-- she showed some humanity! The jury was hostile to her and she listened to them-- she cared. Contrast that with Ali! I started liking Jun better when she broke down toward the end of the show. I thought it revealed some sensitivity. The impact of her behavior was hitting her, and she reacted. Ali, on the other hand, was blithely indifferent, even gleeful. |
Bomom | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:24 am     'Until people are given the opportunity to be made aware of their actions, it's difficult to turn it into a learning experience.' I find his statement odd when applied to adult behavior. I guess it explains alot...by the time we reach our late 20's, aren't we supposed to BE aware of our actions? For two people who are as "smart" as Jun and Alison proclaim to be, I find it interesting that you would feel like they still need to be MADE AWARE of their actions. Do you really think they didn't know what they were doing? Are they so dense that they need someone to shake a finger at them and explain that if you trash people it will have a negative affect on the way they perceive you? Sounds like the stuff of kindergarden...I guess we can't give these girls adult status for some reason. |
Charvie | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:29 am     Bomom- I so agree. The girls discussed that they know they behaved badly and laughed it off and felt it was in the name of the "game". They are aware, they figured the hgs were upset, that didn't stop them or change their behavior. So why viewing the tapes would suddenly make them more self-aware. Also, I understand Will told everyone that he would lie. That everything he said would be a lie. |
Grooch | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:36 am     Crazydog, I think that Dana was upset with Jun as because Dana actually thought Jun was an actual friend in the house. So Jun's opinion actually mattered to her. And what did Jun do? She admitted she used Dana, wasn't her friend at at all and trashed her repeatedly. I am sure when the other hg's were sequestered with her, they had some stories to tell her what Jun had said. So she already knew. That's what Jun needs to apologize to Dana for. Now Dana never cared for Ali, so whatever Ali said, wouldn't nearly bother her as much as what Jun said and did to her. |
Earthmother | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 11:52 am     I must have missed it..when did Jun show regret? |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:00 pm     Earthmother, immediately after she won she interviewed with Julie and Julie talked about the utter silence and lack of congratulations. Jun said something about how it really took away from the moment that nobody seemed happy, and that she was more listening to what the voters were saying than the actual vote. That to me showed that she was reflecting on her behavior and that she was remorseful. |
Kalekona | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:07 pm     As well as the fact that she LOOKED remorseful while Ali continued to smile and laugh. |
Efilon | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:16 pm     Jun might have shown regret but I certainly didn't hear an apology. I think she had the chance this a.m. on the Early Show. Even then she and Julie seemed to think it was just sour grapes because the others didn't win. And to think, these people didn't even see or hear what we did this past week. The vitriol spewed by the two winners this past week when they already had the game won was ridiculous and I think some of it should have been shown. Instead we got Robert's remarks, David and Amanda's actions, Erika's words, Jack's "buzzard crotch" statement. And from Ali and Jun? Not much. "Evil bi**hes win." Said of themselves. Not that I'm giving the others a pass, just didn't feel they were quite so mean. I'm sure anyone watching the show and not seeing the live feeds or reading updates thought these two were much better than the others. Sad that Arnie and Julie and CBS felt they had to make note of the others but pretty much leave Jun and Alison alone. JMO--YMMV |
Crazydog | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:24 pm     I didn't think they truly think of themselves as "evil bizatches". I always thought they were commenting on Robert's term for them. |
Spunky | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:26 pm     Efilon, they were not merciful towards Ali, she got the brunt while Jun came out smelling like a rose on the show. |
Spear | Thursday, September 25, 2003 - 12:38 pm     I agree Efilon. I think Jun looked unhappy because she didn't want to hear the remarks from the jury, not because she was starting to feel sorry. She feels the remarks were made because the jury members are sore losers. She has yet to indicate that she feels sorry for her behavior (with the possible exception of her manipulation of Jee as she said in her Early Show interview). It's hard to tell if Ali learned anything. Maybe their online chats next week will reveal something. |
Chippy | Friday, September 26, 2003 - 08:35 am     Pretty obvious from the post show interviews that neither feels any remorse, wouldn't do anything different, and would do it all again. Yeehaw. |