Archive through August 23, 2003
TV ClubHouse: ARCHIVES: Big Brother USA 2003 General Discussions Part 1:
Jun - Victim of Our Cultural Brainwashing?:
Archive through August 23, 2003
Whit4you | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 07:48 am     Well I totally agree with the orignal post in this thread, I think alot of posters here don't realize they are putting down me and alot of other posters, lurkers here when they put down Jun's looks. And as I've said - them using the excuse that she bashes others as their excuse to put down all of us who are her size really makes no sense to me. My momma taught me very young that two wrongs don't make a right. Guess some either didn't learn that lesson or don't agree with it. But I can say this, for 20 years I was 'too skinny' - and everyone who's not 'too skinny' think it's perfectly ok to say that "You're too skinny' "You need to eat more" and on and on and on. I kid you not I heard on average 20 times a day comments like those. I always wondered how someone who was 5 lbs overweight would feel being told 20 times a day 'your too fat' - since those of us 5 lbs underweight had to hear 'your too skinny' non-stop. So for those putting down all of us Jun's size - maybe someday you'll be our size and realize it's not fun to hear, regardless of the exuse those doing it are using. And for everyone who's not 'too skinny' - maybe you can realize the person you plan to say that too - has already heard it 500 times this week no need to tell them AGAIN. Not that it excuses Jun's behavior but I have no doubt she's been being teased and made fun of all her life over her weight and is now dishing it back. Doesn't make it right - just helps to understand why she's like that. My nephew got made fun of daily - even in his OWN home - he grew up with some animosity inside. Hugs too all. |
Rainwoman | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 07:56 am     Uh, Jun looks gross in a bikini, because she is, plain and simple. If you have the body to wear one, then you should, but nobody should be FORCED to see what you have hanging out of it. It just looks nasty. There are sizes for a reason. She just grew out of hers, and she needs a bigger size. |
Whit4you | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:06 am     Rain, I know tons of women who wear thong bikini's - letting it *all* hang out, at least her's isnt a thong. I wouldn't even be comfortable wearing a bikini like that by myself at home - but think it's awesome that she seems to not care or is not aware of what others think. You say she's outgrown her bikini - but all those who wear thongs well those things don't cover anything regardless of their 'size' |
Rainwoman | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:14 am     If Jun wore a thong bikini, it would be much worse, but we're talking about a bikini. I think it's wrong for ANYONE who is overweight to wear skimpy clothing. I think Jun is a smart player, and it has nothing to do with who Jun is. Alison is getting a little thick herself lately. lol |
Bastable | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:21 am     I'm not so sure that the producers are mocking Jun because she's larger and therefore unattractive. I don't think that's true, and I don't think that's their message. But I do think her weight gain says a lot about how she has handled the stress of being in the house. Every hamster handles it in a different way. But I really don't sense a stigma (at least from the TV show) that would indicate her weight makes her ugly. Jack has his comments to make about her, but even they didn't say that she was ugly--merely that she was bigger. Just as I don't think that being overweight is a topic we as a society have to ignore completely, I don't think that when a person mentions weight issues, they are not necessarily being negative. You have to listen to the words being said in each instance. I don't know about the boards (I haven't been reading much), but on the show, I don't sense Jun being described as less of a person for being more of one. |
Surreal_Badger | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:23 am     yes, i think these vitriolic comments about jun really do reflect our culture's obsession with thinness. and folks who try to deflect this by saying that she's mean and therefore deserves to be criticized seem to be forgetting that in this game, everyone is mean, everyone is backbiting, and everyone seems to have a pretty high estimation of themselves (hence their desire to be on a show like BB) and on a slightly different track -- how can we blame jun for her dress when BB is providing and mandating certain clothes? i don't think the bikini is optional for any of the women. and an OT comment -- several people have lamented that the contestants on this year's show are rather monochomatic -- same age, etc. but it seems that the expectations for youth and beauty (and thinness) dictate who BB selects, as well as who fans like. certainly BB seems to prefer older men than older women as contestants, probably for these same requirements. after all, how can "we" expect a 60+ year old woman to wear a bikini? (no offense to 60+ year old women -- but our culture does seem to think older men are sexy, but older women are sexless) GO JUN!!!!! |
Cricket | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:27 am     Regarding Jun's beauty, she has a very photogenic face. When they show her in different poses on the show, there is a natural beauty there. I too hope she gets some new clothes that will fit her better. When they had that comp where the girls had to wear a one piece bathing suit, Jun looked great in hers; I think she had a black one. Too bad the other girls didn't tell how great she looked. I'm not saying she is overweight. I'd just like to see her in clothes that are more appropriate to her age and shape, so she can look and feel her best. |
Queenfish | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:30 am     several weeks ago Jun called herself "jiggly wiggly". Her exact words ,while talking about the other girls physical imperfections in the DR ,was "I'm more of a jiggly wiggly type gal, myself". So, that term she placed on herself. I don't care if she gains a hundred pounds or looses 50 while in that house, I don't wanna see her stuff hanging out all over the place. I do think it's gross and I for one don't wanna see it.It has nothing to do with being mean to her , It has to do with taste. There is a time and place for everything. Running around like that all of the time while on national tv and international internet feeds is not tastful.As far as people calling her names, she put herself out there and she has to know, as do all of the other house guest, that there will be a measure of judgement from people. It is impossible for people not to form an opinion, good or bad, when others put themselves on these type of shows. So, yes I think she should cover up her gut and but. DoI dislike her because of her nakedness? No, her actions do speak louder than her lack of clothing. |
Puzzled | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:33 am     It certainly is cultural. In many other countries people feel perfectly comfortable with whatever shape they've got and all shapes and sizes of people wear skinny bikinis, or less. I don't like Jun, but I give her points for not being ashamed of letting it all hang out--and, after all, she really isn't overweight, just not skinny. |
Whit4you | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:38 am     Well her stuff hanging out like it does is because she's lost alot of weight. My sister lost around 80 lbs and she had the same problem, amazingly her insurance company paid for surgery that took away all the loose skin. Jun probably has not been able to afford that surgery. It's really a medical handicap that ya'all are suggesting is revolting, to me it's like saying something about someone who's been burned, and not wanting to have to look at their burned skin etc. That's just how I feel about it. I don't know how long she was overweight but if it started as a child then it's not really her fault that she was overweight, it's not her fault that she now has alot of excess skin - it's to me a physical handicap and I don't think she should have to be ashamed and cover it up because others are shallow and don't understand any of this. Too many people want everyone to look a certain way which is why we have thousands of young girls dying every year from anorexia, but hey at least they are pretty to look at and we know that's all that really matters. This convo makes me want to go get a string bikini and start wearing it... |
Eeyoreslament | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:38 am     OK, time for my two cents. Well, maybe five cents. I think that at first, we thought the thin figure was ideal, because of the mass media, and our being socialized to be thin. However, now, as a previous poster pointed out, being even moderately overweight leads to many scientifically proven health problems like diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, hypertension, etc. I live in Canada, where medical care for these people sucks up tax dollars. Personally, I think every person should be forced to live a healthy, ACTIVE lifestyle, before my being billed for their medical problems due to their weight. I think if someone can't HELP but be large, due to thyroid issues, or physically limiting disabilities on their level of activiy, then they are exempt from my criticism. But anyone who is compulsively eating, and moving very little under the ruse of "ab class" does not deserve any kudos from me. People who are more physically active than moving from the 'couch to the bed to the office' are generally healthier people. The mass media should not take all the blame for our thin ideals, as science and medical research has proven that fat is not the way to live. On the flipside, I think that people should not feel BAD about whatever weight they are at. I too was underweight for the first 25 years of my life, and I can attest to how bad it feels for people to say "gain some weight" or "you're too skinny". No one should be told that their looks are unacceptable, however people DO need to be counseled as to how to live a healthier lifestyle, complete with a balanced diet and enough physical exercise. (On a personal note, the Atkins diet is horrible for you, but not enough media coverage goes to that fact. While you SEE results, it is a result of your body going into a state of ketosis, and your liver is FREAKING OUT!! It's not healthy at all, and not at all how your body was meant to be fed. Be kind to your body people!) OK, that's all from me. Hopefully no one is offended. HUGS!! |
Brotherman | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:38 am     Two separate issues: 1) Jun is well on her way to gaining all of her 70+ lbs. back if she doesn't stop shoving food down her throat every five minutes. I think she should put on the breaks, that's all. 2) Jun has the right to wear whatever she wants. Many thin women look awful in clothes that show off too much of their arms and legs (Lara Flynn Boyle and Calista Flockhart come to mind), and they seem to escape criticism. |
Kearie | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:48 am     Whit...I'm with you on this. People hear way too often "you're too skinny" or "you're too fat". I'm sure most people tell themselves those exact same things over and over again in their minds. People don't need to hear it from others. Jun is very pretty. She has gained a few extra pounds in the house because she is an emotional eater. So what? Her clothes no longer fit her and she can't get new ones that will. What's a girl to do? And... BB does dictate what swimwear they will wear for the most part. Society does play a huge role in what we find as physically attractive, which is sad. Our sense of a beautiful body is often distorted. I see Erika and at times I think she has the perfect female figure. Then at other times I see her collar bones stick out and I think that's gross. Whitney, you saw me last fall at my heaviest weight ever. In my opinion I was gross and fat. Now 25 pounds lighter...the reflection in the mirror that looks back at me, still shows the same body. Gross and fat. I've heard that I was gross to hug because I was to skinny. I've heard that I'm getting to fat and my butt is too big. Jun is not fat. To be honest, Jun is thinner than the average American female. Give her a break. Her wieght has nothing to do with how she plays the game and what she is like in real life. |
Kearie | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 08:53 am     Just want to make one comment. Thin doesn't mean good eating habits nor does it mean healthy. |
Brotherman | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:02 am     Eeyore, the Atkins diet is as safe as any other popular diet and there are NO studies showing it causes liver problems in healthy people. If you know of any credible study that shows otherwise, please let me know. Thanks. |
Dragracer | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:06 am     Face it, June needs to cover up! |
Beruthiel | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:08 am     I'm taller than average, and was also very skinny until I started having my kids. I've also been bugged to 'put some weight on', and overheard a nasty comment from a colleague when I was heavier, so it seems to me as if we're d*amned if we do and d*mned if we don't. I've always 'eaten like a bird' all my life. Food has always just been fuel to me. I look at the clock to see if I should eat, as I rarely feel hungry, yet I could be overweight from those charts they put out about what we should be. I don't care anymore what anyone thinks. It's my business, not anyone else's. And it's Jun's business what she does with her own body. She's okay, and she doesn't have replacements for the clothes that are now too small, so let her be! |
Rainwoman | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:09 am     I don't care how big Jun gets. She can walk out looking like a sumo wrestler for all I care. I just don't want to see that in a bikini. Yikes, I can hear Jenny Jones dialing the phone, ew, hurry click! |
Redhalo | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:24 am     You forget that when Jun cam in the house she was thinner and wore clothes, including her bikini that fit her then........THEN she gained weight.....do you all think she brought "fat" clothes with her? What choice does she have right now on the clothes that she wears......all she has is what she came into the house with. Personally, I am a so called "big" girl too. AND Jun I am sure weighs less then me. I don't feel and in fact am not unhealthy. I am 50...do not have diabetes or high blood pressure or a heart problem. Because....regardless of my weight (I am not obese but maybe 30 lbs. more then some of y'all think Ishould be).....I take care of myself. My extra poundage does not bother my beautiful man (who by the way is 15 years younger then me)....in fact he likes my big butt. Jun is a beautiful woman. I have seen pictures of her laughing and find her striking. Yep, she could use a little toning up.....but so could most of us......it doesn't make any one of us less attractive. Erika....I think she is very attractive but my boyfriend thinks her legs are like sticks with no shape and he said that her hips would probably pierce a man when they were having.......well....you get the picture. Stop ragging on Jun's weight. I don't think she eats for the right reasons like hunger.......but her appearance....ease off. |
Demsome | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:27 am     I too am about sick of comments on Juns weight. I would like to see how firm anyone elses skin is after loosing 70 pounds. Yes it will be a bit flabby for quite awhile. |
Lori | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:35 am     Actually Jun looked fine in her bathing suit at the beginning of BB. Her weight gain during the course of the show was the problem with her clothes not fitting properly. If BB makes these women wear skimpy suits...that's ridiculous. I feel sorry for Jun if they are making her wear her bikini that no longer fits. Let's face it, wearing clothes too small for you (no matter your size) is just plain uncomfortable! |
Puzzled | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:53 am     Kearie - Good point. Being underweight has as many hazards as overweight. So what do we do now? Pick on everyone who doesn't weigh exactly what some "experts" think is the Right Weight? BTW--my MIL was 5'3" and around 200 lbs. She lived to be 100 and had no health problems until she was 95. This is a matter between a woman and her doctor, whether she needs to gain or lose weight. |
Earthmother | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 09:59 am     Speaking as a big woman...If you choose to wear skimpy clothes (especially on national tv) that ultimately show off your worst features believe me someone will talk about it. Don't tell me that you haven't been walking in the mall and seen a woman wearing clothes that enhance her bulges and made the comment "what was she thinkin?" or my favorite "Obviously she doesn't have a full length mirror at home!!" I know I do and I have unsightly bulges too, but they are kept under wraps. As for the Atkins diet..it has worked for me (that doesn't mean it's for everyone)..I've lost 70 pounds of ugly fat, but guess what? My lab results (including my liver) are better than they have been in 15 years. I still have bulges and would never think to wear clothing that shows them off. I also believe that if Jun had not made such unkind comments about the appearance of the other hgs the posters might have been a bit more kind when talking about her. |
Kearie | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 10:17 am     Speaking of clothes not fitting well or not becoming.... Thank gawd Jun doesn't wear spandex. (It was a joke for all those people who talk about her not wearing flattering clothes) Have some of you not heard...JUN DIDN"T BRING HER BIG CLOTHES INTO THE HOUSE. SHE HAS NO CHOICE BUT TO WEAR TOO TIGHT OF CLOTHES RIGHT NOW. Sorry for yelling. My bad. |
Chy | Saturday, August 23, 2003 - 10:20 am     Hi, Azreil! How's the weather around you? I've heard about the big Typhoon coming. I'm from Taipei, almost took a job in Singapore years ago. Living in the States, not too close to any big cities which sometimes has 10+ hrs. daily program in multiple dialects of Chinese, I only get 1/2 hr. news from Taiwan and 1/2 hr. news(more like propaganda) from China, on the International Channel on Cable. So I know the feeling of frustration you're having to do without regular American TV shows(do they still have Bill Crosby speaking Chinese? Although I know Singapore does consider Eng. one of the country's official languages). I recall catching CNN Live in the mornings the last time I was home though. I usually don't even go near discussions of this kind, but I'm glad you bought it up so I could read different views. You see, I'm one of those Chinese female "with big bones"(my in laws words), I've even sometimes feel like I have to apologize for not being a typically slim-lookig Chinese women. My two teenage girls are even taller and therefore bigger than I am "since" they have 1/4 Italian blood. I've tried to build good eating habits and encourage activities but the 17 yr. old is already complaining that she has mother to thank for her not-so-perfect looks. She's been on many assorted diets and constantly criticizes myself and her sister. Well, it's just one me -and some of my friends- against my huge in-law-family plus the rest of the Madison Ave.-backed-society.... But, as posters above me have said, (1) Jun did call herself "Jiggly wiggly" and CBS/BB aired it with a slow-motion wet Jun in a tight bikini shaking her top in a silly way. (2) She's the one talking in a show-off way earlier regarding her weight-lose. I think that's why posters here started making her size/shape a subject. Don't really think they mean to bash Jun so much though, I just walk around them. Something else will happen in the BB House for people to shift their attention soon enough. |
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