Archive through October 18, 2002
MoveCloseDeleteAdmin

TV ClubHouse: Archive: USA 2002: General Discussion: Quick Vote ... Did Roddy influence the vote?: Archive through October 18, 2002

Joyful

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 07:26 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I didn't find Roddy all that manipulating. I found him pompous immature and a bit spoiled. I truly think the only person he did sway to his way of voting was Josh who was so eager for his friendship he would have done anything for him. Is it just me or are people giving this man more power than he really had?

Ozarktracy

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 08:04 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I must be going crazy because I distinctly remember Amy saying in a live chat at her website, just a day or so after eviction, that she decided to not vote for Dani based on her being trashed by Dani as shown on videotapes she watched of the show. She said she saw ten episodes, but didn't say which ten. She also didn't say if it was a culmination of events or one in particular. (And does it really matter? LOL)

If anyone influenced Amy it was me. All her fans. Her family. Her friends. I left a message on Amy's web site before she walked out the second time, begging her to read some live feed updates instead of just relying on the edited tv shows, and that she really needed to cast a truly informed vote.

From what I recall about Amy's departure from the show and her unexpected live chat at her website, she was with one of her bestfriends immediately upon coming out of the house. Roddy might have sent her an email (if it was really him) but by then her friends and family, and fans, had told her over and over to watch the tapes, read the updates, to be informed about what was happening.

And thinking about it, what if all the other EHGs visited Amy's website, IMO the most well-known, FAN-created one of all the HGs, so why not check it out? What if they read all the messages urging Amy to open her eyes and see what was going on before casting her vote. What if they all went back and looked at the videotapes themselves and saw things that didn't bug them before but now really irritated them and gave them all axes to grind against Dani?

See, it could have been the fans that influenced the whole thing. LOL!!!

Crossfire

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 08:08 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yep. He is being credited with changing the mind of someone who was outside the house talking to friends and family as well as watching video of the same program we saw, while he was still locked on the inside. You have to admit, that is quite an impressive display.

It seems that even though some ex HG's let their voting intentions be known well in advance of the final vote, it still took some viewers by surprise.

Zachsmom

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 08:13 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
"He is being credited with changing the mind of someone who was outside the house talking to friends and family as well as watching video of the same program we saw, while he was still locked on the inside. You have to admit, that is quite an impressive display. "

Yeah..too bad he didn't channel that energy into the HGs who were still inside the house to let him stay!!!

Mlt

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 09:16 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I've been thinking a lot about Gerry's vote - because that one completely floored me. But I see Gerry as a very strong individual (at least when outside the house) and don't see him easily influenced by Roddy. So I struggled with the question. And I have a theory. Now, I could be completely off base, but I thought I'd share it anyway.

I think Gerry's vote was (perhaps) based on male ego. Over and over in the house we heard Gerry talk about things such as 'Alpha males' and making comments that he and Roddy were the two 'strategic players' in the house. I think he really believed that this was a competition between him and Roddy.

And he believed he and Dani were allies. He was sort of her 'benefactor'. If he couldn't win, it was his intention to set her up so that she could win. That way his male ego (of being the powerforce that propelled the little woman to victory) would be appeased.

Then he gets out of the house and realizes that the two 'strategic players' in the house were actually Dani and Roddy. His contribution to the game ended when he nominated Eric and Lisa and then, following Dani's will, voted out Eric. And, in point of fact, Dani not only used him, but also regarded him as nothing more than a 'pawn' in this giant 'chess game'. Disposable.

Suddenly, his male ego is crushed. He voted for Lisa because she didn't challenge his 'manhood'. Just a thought. Like I said, I could be totally off base.

Ladytex

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 09:22 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I vote yes

Wendo

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 11:06 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yes, I think Roddy influenced *some* votes. I don't think Danielle would've won, but I don't think the final vote would've been so lopsided either.

I also agree with C1mag's thoughts about Roddy's influence. He's very good at it, though it's very subtle. (And, just because he didn't win BB doesn't mean he isn't a good manipulator.)

The major signs to me that clued me to his manipulations: How he treated Chiara overall, just despicable; and how he treated Amy over the PoV, very cruel.

BUT, the ultimate was when he manipulated Marcellas at the hot tub. Stripping down to his skivies and, basically, *seducing* the gay guy, whom he knew had the hots for him. (I imagine he's gotten some ribbing from his buddies for this.) It was just icky.

Shortnsweet

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 11:32 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Well, it looks like you can't get a QUICK vote out of this group!

Cmore

Wednesday, October 16, 2002 - 11:35 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
No, I don't think Roddy influenced the vote. I think these 10 people made a choice of their own.

My reasoning? Well imagine for a second if all of the houseguests (both evicted and the final 2) were able to recieve votes for the big money. Who do you think most likely would have won?

My answer would be Jason, because of all the houseguests he was probably the most liked by all of the other houseguests, did the least trash talking and earned the respect of all, except maybe Marcellas . Some of you may disagree, but I think most would agree.

Its no secret and was even shown in the final episode that Jason did his VERY best to influence the other houseguests to vote for Dani. There is no way that Roddy was personally more popular with the other house guests than Jason, yet Jason didn't swing a single vote to Dani and we KNOW he DID lobby for Dani-votes.

Guessing that Roddy tried to influence the votes and KNOWING that Jason DID only tells me one of two things. Either Roddy has some magical hypnotic power that we are unaware of, or these people voted how they wanted to in spite of what anyone said in the jury.

I believe the jury was influenced by Dani herself more than any other thing and her total lack of any attempt to plea her case of "just a game" or an apology to any of those she may have hurt on the jury. When she was asked "if you could have changed anything in the game, what would it be?" Instead of saying "not letting go of the Key" and saying "to have been less hurtful of the other houseguests" would have went a long way to maybe getting her a few more votes.

Risa

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 01:35 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I can go both ways on this one. I think Dani was mean enough to garner the 9/1 vote with no help from anyone. At the same time I know the hg's spent those last weeks socializing with each other before the vote. Roddy had a very strange effect on those people. I always remember Julie's final questions when she asked Dani and Lisa to discribe Roddy and they both got kind of a glazed look in their eyes and said"a wonderful person" Ok, so I'm being a little dramatic but it did creep me out just like both Roddy and Dani did.

Joyful

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 04:31 am EditMoveDeleteIP
MLT!!!!!!! That summation was dead on. I think you must be a closet psychologist! lol

Sonia

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 06:37 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Mlt, you make interesting points. Of course, I understand as yourself it's simply an opinion, and I like the fact you say you're conscient of it, but I agree with you about the fact than Gerry exprimated sometimes in the house than he considered himself and Roddy were the best players of the house. Also, he said in a post-eviction interview than he has never took Lisa seriously. So, his vote for Lisa was more an "anti-vote" for Dani than a real vote "for" Lisa, as many others hgs by the way. JMO, as we all always say. :)

Bastable

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 09:10 am EditMoveDeleteIP
MLT, you raise an interesting scenario. Extend that a little bit to Roddy -- his male ego needs massaging -- and you have a solid motive for him to orchestrate votes against Danielle. What's more, you have a solid motive for him to do it quietly, so that the other HGs are barely aware he's doing it... it wouldn't do much good to proclaim to the world that your manhood has been impugned, would it?

Sonia

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 09:42 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Cmore, you also make very interesting points about Jason. He was probably one of the most respected hgs, by all others, except Marc. (But did Marc really respect any hg by the way, even himself?) If each hg had the possibility to vote for one of the 12 hg as the winner, Jason would have excellent chance. But about Jason's influence on other hgs, I don't think it was his stronger side. I had would like to ear him more exprimate his opinions during the game. Hgs liked and respected him as the "good guy", but influenced by his opinions, not sure. Jason was definitly not a manipulator as Roddy and he rarely (even almost never) really try to influence any hgs about anything during the entire game. I think it was not his style anyway to try to make people think as him and do what he want. He's too respectuous (or/and maybe too reserved) for that.

About the question "Did Roddy influence the vote?"
I would say 50% yes, and 50% no.

Yes, because Roddy was a master manipulator in the house, he frequently do it subtily and just at the good moment. We all saw many examples of it during the game. I must admit he's very smart and interesting at this point, and he put a lot of actions in the house. I maintain he was one of the most interesting hg. But we cannot deny how manipulative he was. It's very possible his manipulations continuated out of the house. We know how he didn't get how Dani always called him "devil", he may wanted a revenge on her. Dani was also his bigger rival. He was never able to manipulate her as he did with almost everybody in the house. I'm not sure if he accepted it. It's not garantie, of course, I don't accuse him, but I just think it's very possible than he tried to influence everybody to don't vote Dani.

No, because with or without the Roddy/Dani rivalry, Dani gave everybody reasons to don't give her their vote, with all her DR comments. I understand how the hgs could be chocked by it, specially considering how her comments in the DR contredict her attitude directly in front of them in the house. I think Dani more hurt herself about the final vote than a possible Roddy's influence.

My conclusion:

Q.: Did Dani hurted herself with all her DR comments about others hgs?

A.: Not only maybe, but yes, definitly.

Q. : Did Roddy tried to influence other hgs out of the house to don't vote Dani?

A.: Maybe.

And he was probably not the only one who tried to influence other about it. As somebody said so well here, many evicted hg have seen each other after their eviction and discussed about the game. Many of them very probably talked about the final vote. I don't think Roddy was the only one who tried to influence, if he did.

Espen

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 10:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
After thinking about this for a while, I think Roddy, by simply doing what he does best, might have made certain houseguests more likely to vote against Dani.. The ones I am thinking of are Tonya, Chiara and Josh. I think Lori had her own good reasons not to vote for Dani after her little "run-in" the first week, while Eric was an obvious vote for Lisa all along. As some others have mentioned, I just don't see Gerry being swayed by anyone but himself, which is to his credit. In the case of Marcellus and Amy, I think both of them were probably self-conscious enough to take what Danielle did personally, and thus not consider voting for her.

So of the remaining three, who did Roddy influence and how? As discussed earlier, Josh may have wanted to "make up" with Roddy, and might as a result be responsive to things Roddy might say.. As a result he might have been a slight victim of "group-think" by hanging out with Eric and Roddy, though it might be as much due to the two being pro-Lisa as anti-Dani.. Roddy might have given Josh some insights in Dani's behaviour, but that is probably unaviodable.

In the case of Tonya, it is harder to say. She probably didn't like either of the finalists very much, so it probably wouldn't have taken much for her to lean one way or the other. Roddy was interviewed in Las Vegas, so he probably did meet her, and that might have been an opportunity to "influence" her slightly...

Finally Chiara.. Ironically, even though she would probably have been the easiest to influence, she seemed so dead set on "impressing" Roddy that she probably voted the way she thought he wanted, rather than how he told her to vote. She all but admitted during the Q&A that she was mad at Dani just because she had called Roddy the devil..

So where does all this rambling lead us? Although I too was initially convinced that Roddy had influenced the vote, I am now thinking he might have influenced one (Tonya), could have influenced another (Josh), indirectly influenced a third (Chiara) but probably didn't influence the other 5 (Marcellus, Amy, Lori, Gerry & Eric). Either way, Lisa would still have won (and imho deservedly so, even though Dani played a good game according to the "Richard Hatch model"

Joyful

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 10:57 am EditMoveDeleteIP
< sigh > I still don't see why all think Roddy is a master manipulator. I don't think he is that intelligent. I think he thinks he is. With the exception of Josh I think all were capable of making up their own minds and I think they probably did.

Trulyscrumtious

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 11:31 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Why would Tonya of all people need to be influenced? Dani said some of the worst stuff about her. I never once thought that Tonya would *ever* vote for Dani. Who, in their right mind, would hand over a half million dollars to someone who called them an unfit mother over and over again, live, over the internet?

Short of Roddy & Marcellas, I can't think of another contestant who was more of a sure thing to vote anti Dani, no matter WHO was sitting in that other chair.

Now I'm not putting this out there as the Gospel truth, and have absolutely zero facts to back up anything I've said. It's just an opinion, not one that will ever be changed mind you, but just an opinion none-the-less. :)

Espen

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 12:12 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Truly, you are probably right that even Tonya didn't need to be convinced, though she seemed to recall Lisa saying mean things about her too..

I think a lot of this is based on how Roddy clearly influenced Marc, Amy, Chiara, Eric, Josh and even Jason while he was in the house.. So, if these people were thinking of voting against Lisa, he could theoretically have been able to do the same on the outside. However, since noone of these really had a reason to vote against Lisa (except Jason, but Roddy would have had no time or opportunity to sway his vote) this whole discussion might be moot..

Meggieprice

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 02:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I vote yes

Tweepee

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 02:35 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
i vote yes too

Misslibra

Thursday, October 17, 2002 - 08:50 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Is there a name for the brain washing technique where you repeat something over and over and over again until you convince the people around you to think and believe what your saying to be true? Or is it just called brain washing??

I don't recall Roddy doing that, but I do recall another HG's doing it. And it worked quite well I must say. When you talk about how Roddy influence the HG's that came to mind, just wanted to throw that out there.

BTW someone on this board said they e-mailed Roddy and got a response from him. Could someone please send Roddy another e-mail and tell him about this thread so he can see all the credit and power that is being given to him. He will probably find it quite amusing. :)

Bigbrotherbelle

Friday, October 18, 2002 - 02:53 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I vote no, for the reasons stated by other posters, especially Zachsmom.

Romans8_1

Friday, October 18, 2002 - 06:02 am EditMoveDeleteIP
It's gotten a little harder, but I think the vote is as follows ...

yes 30
no 23
undecided 1

I count not count these votes because I could not determine their vote (and did not want to guess). Could you guys give a quick Y/N/U to help me out.
Espen
Sonia

What555456

Friday, October 18, 2002 - 07:27 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Well of course he did.

I expect in their little get togethers before the vote everyone had a say. Roddy is simply a very smooth talker and had his say along with everyone else. He put selective facts together and made them sound like the total story. He had every right to do so, although everything I have read about and from Roddy since the end of the show makes him sound like a very immature, bitter human being.

The problem is that none of these other people are particularly deep thinkers (one wonders if some of them think at all!) and cannot rebut what seems to be a logical argument -- especially if it is made with selective facts as most people trying to pursuade others do all the time.

These people are not exactly mental giants you know -- take a look at the types and levels of discussions held in the house. Is it Roddy's fault that none of them know how to think? They only know how to feel and react? Or is it his fault that those who may have some semblance of ability to think are more interested in how they look on TV, because of future opportunities, or are motivated primarily being liked and accepted by the group they are with at the moment?

Yes, Danielle gave Roddy the selective facts he needed and Lisa, by doing nothing in the game but looking sweet and saying corny "Hallmark Card" comments gave him another set of selective facts to compare with.

The way the final vote would come down was decided when all of these people reached a consensus that the criteria for their vote would have little to do with strategy and skill and everything to do with who hurt their feelings and who made them feel like the world is made up of wonderful people.

What scares me is that these people cannot only vote for the winner of Big Brother, but they can vote for our nation's leaders. But then, I guess that's how we get people like Dubya.

What I think would be interesting is to hear what all these people -- especially those like Roddy who have now vowed a lifetime fealty to some of the other HG's -- say about each of the HG's to their close friends outside of the BB experience. I would bet that what Danielle said about them is nice compared to what they say about each other to those who were not involved.

Bastable

Friday, October 18, 2002 - 09:36 am EditMoveDeleteIP
So true, What! ('Specially about Shrub!) And in the end, isn't denying someone who has two young children $500,000 a whole lot meaner than semi-seriously calling someone The Devil in the throes of a game?