Archive through September 16, 2002
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TV ClubHouse: Archives: Dani has NOT played the game well.: Archive through September 16, 2002

Draheid

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 07:55 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Ahem, unless a kind and thoughtful moderator comes along and deletes your last post, which would put *ME* as the 100th! :O
Eh, mods, can ya help me out here puleeezzzzzee!

Bcandscott

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 08:16 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Meggie said:

I completely understand people disliking Dani and voicing it. I just don't like it when her actions are misrepresented or twisted to seem bad. And I am not accusing a specific poster, just talking about a trend. Things she says are twisted sometimes so as to be unrecognizable!

Dislike her, voice it, just dont fabricate things.


BC says: This is precisely the reason I find Dani so disgusting. She took things that Gerry did and misrepresented them, blew them WAY out of proportion, and lied about the man. She fabricated stories about Amy out of imagination and innuendo and has repeated those false stories OVER and OVER. Amy's behavior was mimicked by Dani and exaggerated and FALISIFIED. While I agree people shouldn't take things Dani says or does out of context and make her seem worse than she really is, I'm just at a loss as to how she could appear any worse than she already does to me. If she lied simply in playing the game, that's one thing, but she went on a personal tirade and I don't respect her choice to play the game this way. I KNOW I will probably be disappointed, and she will probably end up winning some money in the finals, but if it were MY vote that made the decision, she'd go home without a penny and an earful.

C1mag

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 08:22 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Dang it, Dang it I missed it! Well I think I probably made a 100 posts today so maybe I'll have to settle for that :)

Puck1021

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 08:48 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
In my opinion, the only reason that Dani is now giving compliments is that she is finally playing the end game and trying to sway the jury to her side. It sure was not much of a compliment to imitate Amy lying all over the place, thrusting her hips out, making fun of her when she has had too much to drink. I will not disagree that Dani has played a good game to make it this far, but where she lost the end game was the constant bashing with Marc of the evicted. She should have let Marc do the bashing and kept quiet. They were evicted and had no part in the game she was playing with those in the house, but they will have a huge impact on the end game. Dani lost focus about the end game, she was only playing to stay, not to win and that is what will cost her in the end. I would even wager that if the final two were Amy and Dani, Amy would win, because Dani has been merciless in her bashing of the evicted. She went in with a good plan and she made a great alliance with Jason, but she lost sight of the end game and that is her downfall. IMHO

Hawaiiandew

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 08:55 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
This is just a nastalgic conversation between two women and a bottle of wine. I for one thing they both have had very insightful, entertaining thoughts.
As far as Dani not playing the game well.....
Well she played it well enough to be in the final 3..... could you do better???

Allietex

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 09:59 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
So...let me get this right.

If Dani bashes the evicted houseguests, she is the wicked witch for bashing?

If she complements the evicted houseguests, she is the wicked witch for sucking up?

I just wondered if you people who think Dani can't do anything right it is possible that she sees two side to a person. I do all the time.

I try (operative word here is try) not to verbally bash people but I do see their bad sides. Then I can also see their good sides. It is not mutually exclusive to think good and bad thoughts about the same person.

I have thought good and bad thoughts about Dani.

I believe she is a warm, loving, and caring person who loves her family. She has shown concern for various people in the house at different times. She is funny and vivacious. She has been loyal to her partner Jason, and I think she stayed loyal to others as long as the game allowed. It is virtully impossible to get through this game without lying and breaking promises. The game is set up to encourage this. THEY HAVE ALL DONE IT! To bash Dani for doing what everyone has to do to win is unfair.

The side of Dani I do not like is her love of gossip. I think she really enjoys bashing people. I suspect in real life she is like most of us. When we gossip, we do it in such a setting that we will never get called to account for it. To do it on national tv where your "victims" will eventually hear about it is not only hurtful, it is stupid. What can she be thinking.

In fairness to Dani, however, again we can not single her out. Others have done the same thing, some just as bad and some worse. She could not hold a candle to Marc, and what Lisa said about Gerry is much more serious and harmful that anything Dani said. Maybe you have to be in a vunerable profession to really understand just how serious.

And to people who claim THEY never bash people, I say poppycock. In my lifetime I can count on the fingers of one hand and have some fingers left over the number of people of whom I can truly say, "She (or he) never says anything bad about anyone."

I know the people who dislike Dani will not hear anything I say. Their minds are made up nothing will change it. To the ones who like Dani, I am preaching to the choir.

Crossfire

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 10:10 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Why is it Dani supporters seem to have missed all the threads giving the other HG's as much if not quite often more grief than Dani is getting now? Why is it now unjust to voice disapproval?

I don't think you will find many people who will argue the 'they all did it' issue. Dani just happens to stand out only giving up ground on the matter to Marc.

Wcv63

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 10:14 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Who says it is unjust? Voice your disapproval. I will defend my position while you defend yours. Nobody is telling anyone that can or can not post.

Since the majority of the threads on the board right now are anti-Dani threads our options are rather limited as far as game discussion is concerned.

Onlyhuman

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 11:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Since it's the topic of this thread, I'd like to say that, IMHO, Danielle has not played the game very well.

This is a game played with human beings and I think Danielle has been very good at relating to people on a human level. The problem is, she forgot that when you relate to people on a human level and then turn around and say "It's just business" people are shocked and dismayed. Her plan was to bond with each HGs on a certain level, and it certainly worked. But when those bonds are broken, people feel hurt and that works against you when voting time approaches.

I've said again and again that Will won not because he was funny and entertaining (which he was, at least to me!) but because, ultimately, the wounds he inflicted were less hurtful than the ones Nicole gave. The people he bonded with he never betrayed and those he badmouthed never cared for him in the first place.

Danielle, while doing a wonderful job of keeping her alliance under wraps, betrayed people she was in implied alliances with and badmouthed those she professed to "love". She had justifications for it all, but the other HGs won't care.

I can sit here and say, "It's just a game" but I didn't sit with Danielle at a table while she talked about the two of us being two black people in the finals. Nor did I sit there while she told me she had my back before she plotted against me. She can say all she wants about never giving her word, but she implied many things to many people. Tonight she said something to Lisa about their being alone in the house possibly being a preview of the future. The implication was that this was something she would want. If Lisa believes that implication and is then evicted by Danielle, how will she feel after?

Leaving a bitter taste in the mouths of those who will ultimately decide your face is NEVER a good strategy!

Wrat1010

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 11:30 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree Onlyhuman. I think back to the first Survivor finale when Sue's speech shocked Kelly -- well Danielle's burned a lot more bridges than Kelly -- and attempting to justify her behavior has only made it worse.

But I think Danielle did play a great game in the first part of Big Brother, before Amy returned to the game. I'd give her MVP for setting up some great plays during that first month. But I don't need to bring them up in this thread -- just listen to her brag about them to Lisa on the live feeds :)

Jaysgal

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 11:34 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Oh my! That was soooooooooo eloquently stated, Only Human. That is in essence my position on the subject of Danielle's practices in this game. As human beings, we liken our present experiences to our past. I certainly agree with you.

What is coming to haunt Danielle is that the very system of reasoning she used to attract people to her is the same reasoning that will be used against her. When you personalise relationships as part of your tactics, then when one feels betrayed, one would naturally respond in an emotional way. That is in essence what Marcellas did. And one must be willing to accept the emotional response.

I don't think most of the earlier houseguests (i.e., the first set of evicted houseguests, except Amy) feel this way [strongly] as do the last set who were around during Amy's return. Those are the people with whom she personalised relationships.

Kae

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 11:41 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I too think Dani has played very well except for her harsh comments to the evicted guests. I still think that's going to come back to bite her in the a$$.

HOWEVER, the way Dani had all those "spider alliances" was genious! GENIOUS! I swear she was going to be in the final three with everyone in the house! :)

If Dani wasn't saying the harsh comments, then I think she would give Jason a run for the money. I don't dislike Dani. I just think the comments that she has made aren't going to help her in the end.

Hawaiiandew

Sunday, September 15, 2002 - 11:43 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I hope the evicted houseguests can see past their own pride and see that Dani has been the best player in this game!

Onlyhuman

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 12:01 am EditMoveDeleteIP
hawaiiandew & kae...

I don't agree that Danielle has been the best player in the game, because she played the wrong game. She played the "let me cover all my bases, make semi-alliances with people but never give my word" game. But that isn't the Big Brother game.

The Big Brother game is NOT how many alliances you can make, how many people you can play, how entertaining you are or even how nice you are.

The Big Brother game is simple:
1)Make sure everyone else get evicted before you and
2)that those that get evicted want to vote for you in the end.

Danielle has done a good job at the first (so far) but she has failed (from what I have read) at the second.

The best player is the one who makes it to the end and wins the money. That is it.

Hawaiiandew

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 12:17 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I don't agree Only Human,

I think it is all about playing the best con game.
If I was a contestant who got played by someone else, I would definately give them my vote...I would say----more power to ya buddy you were better than me at the game.
Any houseguest (ie. GAMEplayer) that sees it otherwise is a victim of pride.
What I don't like is people who ride on coattails like Lisa....
I would definately say that Dani is a better player than both Amy and Lisa, possibly Jason

Go Dani!

Spear

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 12:46 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Would you give the money to someone who calls you a pedophile? Would you give the money to someone who calls you a Nazi? Would you give the money to someone who makes up stories about you flashing your privates? Would you give the money to someone who calls you evil? There's a line beyond which trashing is not part of playing the game. It's clear that people have differing opinions on where to draw that line and whether Dani (or Josh, or Lisa, or anyone else) has crossed it.

Secretsmile

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 08:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
OK...nobody asked me but I'm going to offer my 2 Cents. Please note that this is just my opinion.

IMO Dani has played a good game, her strategy has been solid so far. That said, I believe the character assination may have gone over the top. She watches reality tv, but didn't take in to consideration that on BB, her comments are heard by so many over the internet. Other shows only tape certain segements, this tatic wouldn't have been an issue on The Amazing Race for example, because no audience would have heard it.

As far as how this effects the end game, we will have to consider that evictees have friends and family that were privy to alot of what she put out there, and they can't help but consider that in their final vote, it's only human.

I hope this isn't considered bashing, because I don't intend for it to be.

Maryk

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 08:53 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Onlyhuman, I couldn't agree more with your comments.
Besides the bashings by Dani of people outside the context of the game, the other thing I dislike about her is her hypocrisy, she badmouths people who lie in the context of the game, yet she herself has lied many times. Of course she wants to get off on a technicality, by saying I never gave them explicitly my word. She berates the strategy used by other people, yet she condones her own strategy by just saying its business.
Well, its also just business then when the jury comes back and not give her their vote.

Jan

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 09:44 am EditMoveDeleteIP
secretsmile no I don't think it is bashing and I am a Danie fan.

What you said is true. I have noticed, however, that NONE of the HG's seem to think that there will be any repercussion for anything they have said except for in the DR.

For instance, they all think Marc will be very popular and he was the worst offender for backbiting and bad statements.

Lisa and Dani talk about Dani's DR statements as if they are the only things standing in the way of her getting more votes.

They always hope that Gerry's family didn't see any of the bad DR stuff said about him.

I guess they really do keep forgetting that everything is on camera.

Redgirl30

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 11:10 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree MARYK it will be just "business" when the jury doesn't give her a vote....Personal attacks on evicted HGs isn't good for a winning strategy, however it must give Dani a feeling of superiority over the HGs, because she continually talks bad about all the evicted HGs....too bad there is no one around to remind her on a daily basis, that those people will be the ones on the jury, and those people will NOT be voting for her!

Dani did not play the game well! Otherwise the evicted HGs (the Jury) wouldn't be leaving the house with such a sour taste in their mouths (all thanks to Dani)

Seanflynn

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 11:22 am EditMoveDeleteIP
At the very least, Danielle has played a good game since she will at a minimum made it to the final four.
She is an odds on favorite to make the final two.
Anyone who says at this point that she is not a good play by definition implies that those who exited before her are worse players.

Rozmatoz

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 01:14 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I don't think she played the best game. I think Lisa or Jason deserve to win. They have gotten just as far without going to the level that Danielle did. She overplayed.

Redgirl30

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 02:01 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
SEANFLYNN Just because Dani is in the final four, doesn't make her a good player for that, after all Amy is also in the final four....Sometimes it's not about being the best or worst player, sometimes you just gotta have Lady Luck on your side! So just because a HG was evicted before Dani doesn't make them a worse player, maybe just not a lucky one!! (ie: They didn't win HOH when they should have! Or as in the case of Chiara, she wasn't eligible to win HOH when Amy returned to the house....Chiara couldn't have predicted that turn of events, and that is why Chiara is gone! Not necessarily because she wasn't as good a player as you think Dani is...just bad luck)

Wendo

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 02:24 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Had Chiara been nicer to Amy when Amy was in the house Chiara would not have gone. That's why Chiara's not in there anymore. As Lisa said in her DR about that whole thing, sometimes karma has a way of coming back and biting ya.

Dani hasn't just played by luck, Redgirl. During the first couple of weeks, she went out and made an effort to get to know ALL the HG's, not just a select few. That enabled her to not be an immediate target. Additionally, she had a good disposition in the house and that kept her from being a target. (ie: Mar the first week.)

I wouldn't say it's all been luck at all. Dani has worked hard from DAY ONE in that house to get where she is. Harder than the other 11 HG'S IMO.

However, I do agree that her gossipy habits in the house will likely hurt her in the end.

Crossfire

Monday, September 16, 2002 - 02:32 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yep, there's a Wendo post I'm willing to sign.