The "devil" bed time story...is it going too far??
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TV ClubHouse: Archive: ARCHIVE TWO: The "devil" bed time story...is it going too far??
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Archive through September 10, 2002 25   09/10 12:24pm

Essence

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 11:36 am EditMoveDeleteIP
To answer the question 'Is it going too far?'...I don't think so. Can you say vivid imagination...boredom...nothing but time on your hands...an idle mind...etc. I took it for what it was, a bedtime story. I guess her devil references don't bother me as much as they do others. But, can you really go so far as to say her infatuation with Roddy being the devil (and biblical references to that point) is an influence of her upbringing? Who knows. There is a lot of speculation floating around here, but none of us know for sure.

Betty

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 11:50 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Just a story.

Silklily

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 11:52 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Come on, people! They are bored. Haven't you ever been bored out of your mind? She is trying to keep her sanity by telling a stupid story. She is just telling a "tall tale" to pass the time. Plus, she gets to make fun of the evited HGs in a new, silly way. And she gets to make Amy feel loved by using words like "golden angel" and talk about her friendships helping to "mend her broken wings".
I relate to Danielle. I am not crazy and I can see myself taking the role of group entertainer and telling a story such as that one.
Give 'em a break.

Goddess146

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 11:53 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I heard the story live. It was funny as told live. All three of the girls were giggling. The cold transcript makes it sound much worse.

I am repulsed by Dani's vile gossip and other actions but this bed time story is not one of her major offenses. It was done in fun. Sick fun, yes, but fun.

It is no where as bad an an offense as when Dani told Amy that if she had anything to say about Amy, she would say it to her face.

Auntie

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 11:59 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Dani comes from a background filled with biblical imagery, so why should it be surprising that she uses that imagery in her own storytelling? Perhaps people are reacting to the imagery as if it were unique to her? Sad--biblical imagery is an important motif in English/American literature. Milton delineated Satan so attractively in Paradise Lost that some critics think Satan is the hero. Hester was demonized with that Scarlet Letter. Ahab obsessed over the whale Moby Dick as the manifestation of evil incarnate. Perhaps if Dani had based her imagery on Star Wars and called Roddy the Darth Vader of the house, some people would understand that her imagery is not unique to her. Note: the Jedi was noted as the "religion" of choice by numerous Australians on a recent census. LOL

Wiseolowl

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:12 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
My goodness .. daring to post when you haven't even read the story. I'm one of those people - in my post though I implied that it was done because she's done this devil schtick enough that what else is there to say but :Is that all there is"?

So , defiantly , proudly and without apology I can say that I scrolled down again -not once but twice - when it was reprinted here not once but twice.

And proudly and defiantly and in ignorance I say again : Been there.. Been there.. Been there ... Done that.. Done that..Done that.

And if I'm ignorant enough to post on the board about something I know little about I'm surprized that people are amazed since it's not an infrequent occurence around here and not only on my part. I overlook it when others do it and I would hope for the same curtesy - especially when it's simply done gratuitously.

Wendo

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:13 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
How many of you posting commentary on the scene actually heard it? I've read that maybe 3 or 4 did?

I was up and heard it in its entirety. They were all joking around and Dani was telling them that Roddy was going to probably hate her for the devil comments. They were ALL laughing about it. (Jason was asleep in the bed next to Dani.)

Then they were talking about ghost stories and bedtime stories and Lisa said she wasn't tired. Dani said she would tell a bedtime/funny story to her grandchildren some day about her stay in the house.

It was set up to be comical, it was over embelished, and was nothing more than joking around by three bored women who've been stuck in a house for over 65 days. Throughout the story, Amy interjected additional comments, as well as Lisa. Lisa and Amy laughed throughout and clapped when Dani was done.

I'm utterly amazed that people are taking this story seriously in any way. Dani's life has been brought up with religion, therefore, it doesn't surprise me that her stories would contain religous imagery.

It was no different than when you would go camping as a kid and told the story of the one arm axe murderer.

Perhaps we all need to take our humor pills this year with BB.

Cameramanbob

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:24 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
"Satire - A manner of writing that mixes a critical attitude with wit and humor in an effort to improve mankind and human institutions.

Ridicule, irony, exaggeration, and several other techniques are almost always present. The satirist may insert serious statements of value or desired behavior, but most often he relies on an implicit moral code, understood by his audience and paid lip service by them.

The satirist's goal is to point out the hypocrisy of his target in the hope that either the target or the audience will return to a real following of the code.

Many of the techniques of satire are devices of comparison, to show the similarity or contrast between two things. A list of incongruous items, an oxymoron, metaphors, and so forth are examples."

(Seriously, I just needed a reminder for myself.)CMB

Flyonthwall

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:24 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Wendo, thanks for your comments. I value what you have to say on this issue because I am familiar with your LFP reporting and accuracty to details and interpertaions.

You cleared up a lot in the way I veiwed this also since I didn't personally hear the exchanges.

I'm sure I would have viewed it as you did since we seems be always be on the same page! LOL

thanks for posting, I think your take on this is dead on.

YOU ROCK!! teeheeee
FLy

Foodbunny

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:29 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Maybe I don't see it as funy because I've been called the devil (and the devil's daughter and devil spawn) all for the terrible offense of not being Christian. Danielle's claim that lying to Roddy is ok because he's not Christian and that he's not trustworthy because he's not Christian is tangled up with her vicious repetition of "he's the devil" in my mind and there's no explination that's going to seperate them for me.

Having been persecuted (and beaten, and driven out of my high school) all for being atheist I an a wee bit touchy about others being harassed for it.

Ark

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:29 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I've told humorus stories to friends about my kids. At times, I've referred to my kids as monsters, boogers, little sh$ts, peanuts or dumplings. At no time, when I was telling one of those stories, did I truely believe that any of my kids were monsters, boogers, little shi$ts, peanuts or dumplings. Those were just descriptive words that I used to enhance the story. Our family often sits around a campfire with friends. One of use will start a story and everyone will add to it. Someone may name one of the characters in the story the same name as someone that is present. We may then go on to say that that person had one big snaggly tooth, warts, claws for hands, etc. We know that the person named in the story doesn't really have all of those things going on. We are telling a story to entertain. We are using our imagination to make the story more vivid for the listeners. I really wish the HG would use their imaginations to make up MORE stories for each other. It would be way more interesting to listen to than their movie talk.

Gincap

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 12:33 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
You know it never occurred to me that Dani might actually REALLY believe that Roddy was the devil, I thought that she was just meaning that he was sly. The thought probably entered her head because she was raised religious, and knows that he is an atheist. I was raised Baptist and remember sermons talking about how the devil does not have red horns and a forked tail and he doesn't carry a pitchfork. I've got to admit that he is charismatic even from this distance, can you imagine if you met him in person how it would be? Maybe she even got some evil vibes from him or something. Who knows, but if she is for real and not just joking, I don't mess with stuff like that! If she is just joking, she really does owe him an apology though.

Grooch

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 01:02 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
After reading Gincap's post, I'm going with Twiggy's theory that Dani is sexually attracted to Roddy.

Rabbit

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 01:14 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Roddy is not the devil, I know this because I have seen the true face of the devil.

By the way, I wonder if Will's TV show will be a hit? I wonder if he and Shannon will ever marry?

Wendo

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 01:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Gincap, I think she's just joking, I don't think she REALLY believes Roddy is the devil. Were she not raised with religion she would've probably found another moniker for Roddy.

And, she will probably apologize to Roddy.

Whether he accepts or not, is up to him. And, he has every right NOT to accept it.

Fly, thanks. Yes, it was just a humorous tale. Really, while I listened, I detected no malicousness behind it. I don't think Amy or Lisa would've laughed and clapped like they did if it had. JMO.

(And, I think Dani is well aware that her gossiping and dissing of former HG's will not help her in the end. She knows it.)

Lola

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 01:36 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Native Americans usually refer to the white man as "The Devil"

Perhaps Danielle is secretly militant?

Gincap

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 02:10 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
LOL, I'm purely speculating on what is going on in the mind of Dani. I didn't even see the live feed, I just read it here. If she was just trying to entertain the girls and they were laughing about it, I'm sure it was a joke, not so nice, but a joke the same.

Crossfire

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 02:23 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I get the feeling that the tale was not humorous, but perhaps its presentation was.

The seeds of that tale are the same as all the other negative bashing and name calling that goes on in the house. Reading it was not amusing at all.

Efilon

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 02:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Crossfire: I agree with you. The presentation may have been humorous but the theme behind it was not. She was just bashing and acting hateful in a new way. Dani crosses the line way too far for me to have any respect for her.

I wonder, when she tells her grandchildren this little tale, if they will ask why she didn't just leave the house and get away from satan and all his minions.

Keiffer

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 02:56 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I find two things ineteresting in Danny's continuing with the devil talk with regards to Roddy.

1: If just about any other HG was being called a negative name too many times to count for weeks on end that person would be the most unpopular person in BB history. That includes Will the first 5 weeks last year, or Josh this year. Because she bashes an unpopular person on this board (in general) she gets a pretty fast pass for her bashing.

2: If I were Roddy I would get very tired of running into one of the 5-8 million people who have watched Danny on TV calling me the devil numerous times an episode for multiple episodes, and asking me about it... or worse thinking that they should be wary of me because they remimber hearing negative things about me once. Just saying that Roddy may be unpopular for his strategy in playing the game, or the people he created alliances with, but IMO I just don't see how he deserves this.

Heck Danny won... her devil is gone. Why not be a grown up and accept winning graceful, and not rubbing it in for a week? Sore winning sometimes is even worse than a sore loser.

Willsfan

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 03:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Tsk...tsk...Danielle should remember from her deeply rich religious background that money is the root of all evil and those that chase after it are not to be trusted! She really has a selective memory.

What I find hard to believe is Jason's demeandor when he sits and listens to D bash HGs day after day after day.

Twiggyish

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 03:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Grooch, yup, she's probably not accepting it, either.
How many times has she called Roddy the devil? Constantly during the last few weeks. I'm just saying she's got something for him. (Just my opinion)

Faerygdds

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 03:38 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
OK... I actually heard the story.. I was trying to go to sleep on the couch. Lisa Amy and Dani were all giggling in the lizard room. THey were discussing how crazy the summer had been and the past HGs... and I think it wa Amy said something about... it's a story you will tell your grandchilren some day...

So Dani starts creating this story. Her exaggerations increased as Lisa and Amy began to respond like two little girls to her tale. There was much giggling and laughing.. it was meant in FUN!!! No... maybe it wasn't the best judgement, but it was all meant in fun and was not nearly as dark as it reads on paper... heck ... even *I* was cracking up at her tale. then I actually got up and checked to see that someoe had covered it.. when I saw it had I went to sleep...

Like it or not... it wasn't bashing.. it was a story.. and a DARN FUNNY ONE TOO! lol

Keiffer

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 03:42 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Faerygdds.... was it "funny" because it had Roddy playing the part of the devil again... or would it have been funny had Gerry, Lori, or Eric had been the butt of the joke? How about if it was you, or your significant other, or your brother that was the devil in the story? Would you be getting tired of the devil thing in those cases?

Faerygdds

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 03:53 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Keiffer... it ws funny in the way it was told... irregardless of the players it was FUNNY!!! The tone of her voice... the exagerrations.. the reactions by the audience(Lisa and Amy) THAT is what made it so funny... so yes... it would have been funny regardless of the players IN the story...

And had it been about me I would have been ROLLING ont he floor laughing about it... and yes.. had it been about my husband I would have been laughing... it was just FUNNY!!!

Bohawkins

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 04:01 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
I am always amazed at how there can be a complete misunderstanding of the way other people can think and believe. You don't have to go to another country to experience cultural shock. There are belief systems, and styles of conduct, which are totally foreign to what you are accustomed to, right here in this country, which will not fit into what you know as logical and reasonable. It will shock and amaze you to experience the way many people believe and talk. Please know that to understand this about someone like Danielle, you must let your mind get away from the perceptions you have based on your own limited cultural experiences.

Yes, from the point of experiential reference of most middle class Americans (and Canadians), Danielle had to be just having fun. By all logic, it was just a silly story. But, you need to know that there are totally different sub-cultures, making up big segments of our population, which think and talk and believe exactly the way Danielle is representing that she does.

I have spent quite a bit of time with many, very primitive, Christian believers. I have had many people tell me that a certain individual was possessed. I have heard people say that they could sense the presence of the devil. I have had whole families meeting with me, who waited until a clerk or assistant had left the room, who then told me that they could sense that the person who just left was filled with Satan. I have had people lay their hands on me, and my briefcase, with heads bowed and eyes closed, and talking out loud, in their understanding speaking directly to God, asking that any presence of the "evil one" be lifted from me, prior to us going into a negotiating session of what I regarded as routine business. Danielle's parlance is totally in keeping with that particular part of the Christian religious culture, which almost sounds like what you would expect from a voodoo priest, or tribal Shaman, except it is all done as their brand of Christian practices. I have seen this level of belief in successful business men, who hold prayer sessions before every meeting. They pray over sales brochures being mailed out. They ask that the devil be cast out their path, and that very devil is often seen in the person of one of their competitors (exactly the way Danielle saw the Devil in Roddy).

This belief system says that Satan is everywhere, and especially in the form of anyone who does not believe exactly as they do. I have seen people spend all night with a son or daughter praying over them and laying hands on them, asking for Satan to leave them, after finding out that the teenager had smoked grass, or had sex, or had a drink of alcohol.

The pentecostal holiness culture is very much absorbed in the verbage and language style about Satan, and preoccupied with evil presences everywhere. Danielle's manner fits right in with what I have witnessed first hand, many, many times. What is most important to realize about this, is that these people are not kidding around. They aren't telling stories like Sesame Street, and Big Bird, and Bert and Ernie. These aren't tales told like campfires stories for kids, as one poster surmised. This is part of a very firm belief system, based on what they have totally accepted as reality, and for them, if anyone else does not "accept" this as reality, then those people are quite simply known to be part of Satan's legion of minions.

Mollywood

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 04:08 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
yes, it gave me nightmares. dani holding me down and forcing me to eat peanut butter.

Alegria

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 04:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Hi guys, it's the typist of the tale checking in. When Danielle was talking her voice was soft and theatrical, in a 'it was a dark an stormy night' tone. She was really putting on a performance.

Personally, I think she has gone on too much with all the devil stuff and could not see why she keeps doing that since it won't help her AT ALL in the endgame. She just can't let up and is like a stuck record. While she is determined to win she also seems to be shooting herself in the foot with all the negative comments about evictees. It does not seem strategic.

Danielle is a natural actress and loves big gestures and to take the stage. I also think she is getting a little full of herself which is a dangerous thing to do at this stage.

As far as all the devil stuff goes, I thought it sure is in Amy and Lisa's interests to egg Danielle on with that as it can only cost her and make them look better. They seem a lot more restrained by comparison. The more I hear her go on the more I am leaning towards thinking "gee, Roddy wasn't THAT bad."

Sorry if my feed stirred things up too much <bashfulgrin>

Spunky

Tuesday, September 10, 2002 - 05:19 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Okay, I can see that I created this thread just out of boredom but also because I ONLY read the tale and I didn't listen to it.
I'm sure I could agree with others that "listening" to it could have made me laugh as well and I wish I had because "reading" it made me shiver. I didn't know about the giggles... so it must have been funny listening to it...
And also, I brought it up because I didn't see the other "devil" thread, it went down, but this topic was very much debated before Roddy left.
I didn't really make much of it then because I figured "oh once Roddy is gone, she'll stop referring to him as the devil". So, when I saw that she did not stop that's when I wondered if there was more to it than a simple jest...

Anyway, thank you guys for your views, we'll always be split on this but I appreciated all the replies.

Auntie

Wednesday, September 11, 2002 - 12:09 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Bohawkins: You're right, there are people who take their version of demonology too far and see the devil in any one who's different or even see the different as devils. But Dani's use of the word "devil" to refer to Roddy seems playful to me and a very good way to prick his pompousity. She used the word as a device to destroy his credibility with herself and with others who heard her use it. This strategy of bad-mouthing houseguests to decrease their value may have worked for her and others in the short term, but they know they will pay a price in the long term. However, I suspect Roddy himself will be amused to have been made into a metaphoric devil, since it's a real recognition of the power of his personality. I bet he'd even like the little story she told--it might finally make Lisa's point to him that others have different viewpoints.

Niceguy

Friday, September 13, 2002 - 09:25 am EditMoveDeleteIP
It seems like the worst ripping off of Alice Walker's style I've ever seen and I'm not big a fan of Ms. Walker.

Again these people are credulous as twelve year olds.