As long as jason has your back, you better duck
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As long as jason has your back, you better duck
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 06:04 pm     On satursdays show. Jason repeatedly says his only alliance is to danni, she is the only one safe and that he wants to keep her out of danger. Then he ignores his own words and keeps roddy safe. Tonight before POV he says if roddy is planning on nominating danni he would have to put roddy up. He asks roddy. Roddy says point blank who he would be going for. Jason once again ignores his own words and keeps roddy safe. With friends like this who needs enemys? |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 06:55 pm     First and foremost, Dani told Jason to do what is best for Jason. Killing 2 birds with 1 stone was the best move for Jason. Up until nomination, Jason's 2 threats were Gerry and Roddy. If he puts both up and one got vetoes next nom Jason would be on the block if one of them gets HOH. Note that Jason had the intention of putting Roddy up, that was the reason why Gerry was interviewed 1st. Jason gave Gerry an opportunity to make a deal regarding the next nomination. But instead of giving a definite that he wouldn't use veto on Amy... Gerry have a non-committal answer. What Gerry failed Roddy provided. Roddy gave his word to watch Jason's back. That is the last thing that Roddy offered, after his various attempt to sway Jason failed. In his most recent AM chat with Jason. Roddy inferred that Dani is a threat, Jason diffused this by saying that everyone thinks that Roddy is a threat because of his intelligence... etc. Additionally, Jason told Roddy that everyone wants Amy nominated, and that Roddy could trust Lisa. These were the only 2 names mentoined in this conversation. The question is why did Jason mentioned these 2 names specifically, as compared to his HOH interview with Roddy when he didn't supply a specific name? If Roddy gets HOH, as it is setup nomination will be D-A or M. That should be sufficient to guarantee that Dani is safe. Jason himself said that he did that Math and that Dani will be safe. For Roddy to get Dani out he needs to nominate D-L or D-J. Unfortunately, Jason believes Marci more than he should, and Roddy hasn't been fully honest to Jason. Marci may betray all of Dani's secrets and have D-L on the block. Even then, it is not as simple what Roddy should do. Roddy must know that getting rid of Dani, leaves her 2 allies L-J for the next round. He must wholly depend on M or A to get HOH. He stands a 50-50 chance of getting booted. Does he take this risk? or try to play with an image of honor and hope that Jason gets next HOH and possibly keep him safe? At this point Jason has basically saved Roddy twice, enough to re-earn Roddy's trust? Finally, Jason has put himself in jeopardy for Dani before. He voted out Eric and did not inform Roddy for Dani. He got out of the HOH tub, even though it is obvious that Jason should have won (if Jason didn't get HOH this week he would have been up, due to this). He has contributed more risk to the alliance than Dani has, this is her 1st risk. Yes, the decision was emotionally unrewarding. The DR explanation, lame. And whether intentional or unintentional, this is the best decision for Jason and BB3 audience. Luckily, if Roddy is gone next week, we have Marci has a backup villian. |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:02 pm     I'm just going by jasons own words. He keeps saying one thing and doing another. |
Secretsmile | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:04 pm     Can anyone set up Theo17 witha folder? I don't know how, but I think he'd enjoy that. |
Lurknomore | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:09 pm     ROFLMAO...I'd volunteer to set up a folder but truthfully I usually can't find my way back to MY folder (which someone was nice enough to set up for me). That reminds me, I have it bookmarked I must go look for it later and see if anyone has been by. I'm really no where near as idiodic as I have seemed here lately HONEST (close as I could find to a dunce cap LOL) Now I must go eat. How sad is this. I live on the east coast and I'm going to cook dinner AFTER the HG's are sitting down to eat their west coast dinner. Glad I'm making an omlette. I could say I just did breakfast early  |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:15 pm     secret a folder? |
Cameltoes | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:21 pm     Maybe we need an RHA folder (Roddy Haters Anonymous) (because I certainly feel the need for a support group!) |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:22 pm     This is the question you posed: "With friends like this who needs enemys?" I'm saying that you took a myopic and simplistic view of the situation. The main point of my previous post can be summed up: If Roddy gets HOH. Does Jason think Dani is safe? Probably. Is Dani safe? (We have a more complete picture) Most likely, but possibly not. I don't think that makes for a bad friendship. Additionally, if there is a betrayal, it is not a directed to you. If anyone has a right to have a problem with it, it is Dani. Until she indicates otherwise, you have to examine yourself and ask why do you feel that it is a betrayal to you, since you seem to think that Dani should think it is a betrayal. |
Azriel | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:23 pm     Secret, you can make one. Just go to the members room, then message board and at the bottom of the page start new conversation Just title the conversation Theo17 and then you have created a folder. |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:24 pm     Why cant you disagree with somebodys actions w/o being a hater? I disagree with how amy and marcy bash gerry. Do I hate them? I disagree with how jason says one thing and does another do I hate jason? i disagree with danni not following thru with the dlj plan last week. do i hate danni? I didnt like gerrys veto specch am I a gerry hater? Its only roddy that you cant disagree with his actions without somebody trying to demonize and label you a hater. |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:26 pm     pto after watching roddy just tell jason he would be going after this person how can you come to this conclusion? If Roddy gets HOH. Does Jason think Dani is safe? Probably That makes no sense if we watched the same show this evening |
Cameltoes | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:29 pm     Theo - my post was all in jest since those of us who don't like Roddy's actions are labeled haters. Believe me, I am no Roddy fan! |
Wcv63 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:31 pm     Theo take the title and wear it proudly. I do. Ptomaine that was an EXCELLENT post! |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:33 pm     I'm not a fan of him but dont hate him. I think there is a high road and a low road. He bothers me because he not only takes the low road but then acts very self rightous about it. Thats why i didnt like kikis way either. |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:37 pm     Did you not read what I just posted ... the long drawn out explanation. Roddy now trusts Lisa... he has been divulging his thoughts to her as a result of his chat with Jason. He had already trusted her with some reservations, but now more so. Roddy will probably put up Dani, I think Jason sees this. But Dani will not get voted out unless Roddy puts Dani up against either Lisa or Jason. That will only happen if Marci spills the beans. And I hope that Marci does, because it would result in his downfall. The power is not in the HOH, for the next nom. It is the POV who decides who goes. POV and the person who is vetoed controls who leaves. I for one, hope that Roddy does gets HOH, because that is the most complex result possible. |
Theo17 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:42 pm     pto where did I ever say it was a betrayel to me. I'm not in the house. I was rooting for jason for a long time including up til this week. I'm disappointed in what I think has been speaking out of both sides of his mouth this week but he hasnt betrayed me. He doesnt even know me how could he betray me? I think you are reading a but much in to my post. |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 07:53 pm     Theo17, if this is any consolation. I don't want to see Roddy win. And Jason will vote Roddy out. Unfortunately, at this point there were not enough justification for Jason to nominate Roddy, with Gerry (not his friend) as an equal threat, how could Jason put up Roddy, after promising Chiara that he would take care of Roddy. Prior to his nominations, I though that the smear campaign was enough. And Jason really pulled out all the stops to make that work. At one point even telling Roddy that he knows that Roddy has an answer to everything. Whether it is a persona or not, Jason, like Roddy is bound by the image that they have presented. Jason is trapped into this "role", to not follow it, Jason will lose the endgame because he will be viewed as a fraud. |
Robinyyes | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 08:00 pm     Theo....I think you forget how this game works...I'll sum it up for you. We start with twelve, and eventually only ONE wins. While people buddy up and promise not to screw each other over, only ONE can win. Thats ONE not more then one. Hence you play for yourself. ITS A GAME.... :steps off soapbox: |
Floresmama | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 08:11 pm     Well actually there are two winners one who gets half a million and one who gets a 10% of that. So you can team up and take an ally with you to the end(ala Colby & Tina). Which I think is what is the plan that is still in effect with Jason and Danielle. They go to the end together and let the house decide who played the game the best. So far I haven't heard or read where Danie or Jason said anything negative about the other behind there backs. Go Jason! Go Danie! |
Wrat1010 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 08:13 pm     Marcellas and Amy are the couple most likely to be nominated since Danielle is the only one trying for HOH -- well Marcellas is trying to get Amy to go for the HOH but it seems that neither Lisa nor Marcellas want to get HOH because they would have to choose a side. I think Lisa will side with Roddy and save Marcellas instead of Amy who Danielle wanted to save because (1) she will be mad that Danielle didn't tell her that she wouldn't nominate Roddy and (2) Lisa can gain an ally at the expense of Danielle, who is ineligible for HOH the following week anyway. It would be fitting for Lisa to use Danielle to win over Marcellas the same way that Danielle used Chiara to win over Lisa. Then next week everyone except for Jason will be after Danielle but Marcellas' deal with Roddy will still be not known by Jason, so Jason will not nominate Roddy. Anyway I think Roddy can easily make it to the final and win without winning HOH or being nominated, as long as he can make sure Danielle is evicted before Marcellas and if Danielle targets Marcellas before Roddy I think she's going to finally wear out Lisa's patience after the Josh and Chiara and Gerry (?) evictions. |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 08:19 pm     In such a situation you can take a positive, negative, or neutral view of the situation. NEGATIVE Jason knew that keeping Roddy puts Dani into Jeopardy. Implication. There is no threat in keeping Gerry to either Dani or Jason (Gerry did state after POV, that if he gets HOH, he PROBABLY won't go after Jason). Jason screwed Dani. POSITIVE Jason is completely clueless about Roddy being a threat to Dani. Jason is a dummy. NEUTRAL He probably sees that keeping Roddy is a threat, but also keeping Gerry is a threat. He made a decision that is 1st best for Jason, and 2nd OK for Dani. Jason also stated to Dani that he believes Roddy will nominate Marci and Amy (we don't know at this point what Roddy will do, we don't even know that he will get HOH). The reason, I think that you feel it is a personal betrayal is because I assume that you have all these options, but elect the most negative because you took Jason's decision personally. This, ofcouse, may not be the case. And it was a hasty conclusion on my part. But to be fair, you need to show that Jason intentionally elected to put Dani in danger. You have to demonstrate that #1 he understood that Roddy meant Dani and #2 that Gerry is not a threat and #3 of all the options available this was a poor option. To show that Jason's frienship is akin to having an enemy. You have to show that Dani only does what is best for Jason, but Jason does not reciprocate. As I pointed out, Jason has put himself in risk for his alliance with Dani. He could have voted out Lisa, and retain both Roddy and Dani... weakened 1 member of the6 without putting himself in jeopardy. Additionally, he could have informed Roddy beforehand, but decided to follow Dani's suggestion to not. Jason at one point told her, he has to... knowing the full ramification if he doesn't. After the vote was revealed. Jason expressed his concern to Marci that he was up on the block that week (Chiara HOH). How was Dani's advice "friendly" then by your definition? |
Ptomaine | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 08:31 pm     Wrat1010, I find your assessment without foundation, and not reflective of what we currently know. Lisa is more allied with Dani than Roddy. She has been informing Dani of what Roddy says to her, and not vice versa. Lisa is playing Roddy, although, I think she enjoys the flirtation. Although Lisa does not reveal everything that Roddy tells her to Dani (mainly his suspicion that Dani is after him). Marci will not go for HOH, you are probably right on this. Marci is hedging his bet. Right now he only tells the partial truth of what Roddy says to him to Dani. But I haven't given this much thought if he should win HOH or not. Whether everyone will be after Dani remains to be seen, and I am puzzle as to what events lead you to believe this. Amy says to Marci that Roddy goes then Dani goes. Lisa says that Roddy goes, then Marci goes. To say that Lisa will use Dani. You have to show that Lisa has an intention to do this. Has Lisa expressed such words? The only statement that I've heard Lisa make against Dani was a while back with Marci saying that she is overplaying her poverty. |
Wrat1010 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 09:56 pm     Ptomaine. Lisa has a chameleon-like strategy. She acted like Tonya and Chiara when she's with them but admitted later she is uncomfortable with it and didn't want to participate in the Amy-bashing. She might very well be just as uncomfortable with Danielle calling Roddy the devil and Marcellas the spawn of Satan, although sadly, she doesn't seem to mind joining Danielle in Gerry-bashing. She also has copied Danielle in other aspects as many have pointed out. But I think you may be right. Lisa will not vote against Danielle as long she can keep her as an ally to get rid of Roddy. Getting Roddy out would be in Lisa's best interests because she could secure Eric's vote. I don't think Lisa could beat Jason in the finals but could she beat Danielle? You would think so, but at this point Lisa has made more enemies (Josh, Chiara, Lori?, Gerry?) than Danielle (Tonya, Eric). Also Lisa is not much of a public speaker while Danielle has the motherhood thing going for her. Lisa could take the safe bet of a sure win against either Marcellas or Amy, which is why if Danielle nominates those two, I expect Lisa to win the trust of whichever one of Marcellas and Amy is not voted out. The following week I said Dani would be everyone's target but it could just as easily be Roddy, but Dani's an easier target since she would be ineligible to compete for HOH if she had won the previous week. But depending on who wins HOH it's likely that either D/J or R/A-M would go up and chances are D or R would be voted out, either 2-1 (HOH tiebreak) or 2-0 so Lisa, knowing which way the wind was blowing, would probably vote to make it unanimous, which means either Roddy or Dani would be evicted. |
Saph036 | Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 10:10 pm     Theo, I second what you say!!! I couldn't have said it better myself. Thank you! Also, I think some of that magic Roddy fairy dust has made into the boards... ;) |
Jan | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 07:58 am     Theo , I felt exactly as you felt about Jason after watching the show last night. Ptomaine you make some very excellent points. I could almost be convinced that you are right. However, Jason did tell Dani it's OK if my decision hurts me but I WILL NOT let it hurt you. I have yet to see him put a scintilla of action behind those words. I tend to think that Jason is very, very young and naive and does not want to believe that Roddy will hurt Dani because then he would have to go after Roddy. I also think that Jason will never vote to evict Roddy UNLESS he is up against Dani..and then Jason will do everything to get the veto so he can take Dani off and not be forced to make the choice. I also think it is rather pointless and unnecessary to attack Theo for his/her views but that is just my opinion for whatever it is worth. |
Jayalltheway | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 08:58 am     What all of you seem to be forgetting is that Jason isn't playing the game for Dani, he is playing it for Jason. Yes they are allies, but if it's a choice between putting Dani in danger and putting Jason in danger, who should he pick? This week Jason hedged his bets and it is going to pay off. Dani royally screwed him with the whole 'opposite' thing, painting a big target on Jason's back. It clearly revealed their alliance and confirmed Roddy's opinion that Jason wasn't trustworthy. By making the nominations that he did, he ensured his biggest threat's eviction, and he regained Roddy's trust. Was Roddy badmouthing Jason before the HOH comp last week? Yeah. This week? No. Roddy knows Jason saved him ... twice, despite house pressure. At this point Roddy cannot nominate or campaign for Jay's eviction. I do think Jason has proven himself to Roddy, did you see the look on his face during the POV when Jason said something like 'there's just no one else I want to nominate?' With the upcoming clash of the titans, Jason's going to fall below the radar again. And regardless of which one wins, they have promised to protect him. That's the position Marc wanted to be in and he just isn't. As for protecting Dani from Roddy, well Dani's fate is in her own hands, just as Jason's was last week. Dani left Jason in a vulnerable position last week, just so she wouldn't be in danger from Amy/Marc. Fine. Jason can do the same thing. It's obviously within the parameters of their alliance. Except Jason handled the whole thing more smoothly and has made less enemies through the process. I just can't believe that as astute as Jason seemed in the beginning of the game that he suddenly goes all naive now. He knows very well what to say in the DR and even if Roddy or Dani are evicted, they are going to go home loving Jay. So good for him! |
Wrat1010 | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 09:57 am     I agree with all your comments Jayalltheway. Either you are dead right or dead wrong. From the transcripts, Jason is talking to Danielle alone in the hot tub and : "Jason says at some point before HOH competition, he needs to tell Roddy that all deals are off from now on. Dani says that it is not advisable to do that. Jason says that it would not be right otherwise. Jason says at that point is everyone for themselves.... Dani says that she must get HOH this week and break her word. Jason says she musn't do that. " See Jason has the right to call off his deal with Roddy because Roddy owes him one but Danielle does not have the right to call off her deal with Roddy because she owes Roddy one. This forces Danielle to nominate people from the group whose numbers she needs to vote Jason out later. And if she can't get Jason out before the finals then those people will vote for Jason. |
Theo17 | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 10:02 am     I look at jason like that line from jaws. "He is either very stupid or very smart" I do not see him being smart letting roddy dictate. Roddy is making plays for lisa and amy tonight. Last night he solidified his deal with marcy for final 2, and he even had a deal with gerry if gerry stayed. Not to mention he feels he has a deal with danni not to nominate him. Basically roddy has the board covered. |
Luckhunter777 | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 10:19 am     I think 'watching someones back' does not include sacrificing yourself in the next round... seems that is what some people expect others to do. I think his decision was the best he could make under the circumstances - Just because he said he would watch her back we cant assume or expect him (or anyone else for that matter) to give up thier own chance at winning. |
Theo17 | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 10:23 am     luck you could be 100% right but if you watched the last 2 shows jason has said one thing and then turned around and did the exact opposite. Last night he said he would have to use the pov if roddy would nominate danni. He then asks roddy. roddy basically comes right out and said he would be gunning for her and then jason ignores what he said and doesnt use the pov. Out of all the hgs I like jason best. he just isnt somebody you can count on when push comes to shove. If i was at home hanging around I would like jason to be my friend but if I was in a foxhole during a war he wouldnt be somebody I would want with me. |
Ptomaine | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 11:27 am     Jan, 1st please read the HT transcript from last night. Jason tells us about his game. It is clear, even prior to this that Jason is not naive. After his DR session, I had doubts regarding how keen Jason is, hence, I moved from a position of saying that his action is intentional to perhaps unintentional. We get clues early on of how good an observer is by what Jason says. He stated that when he and Dani talk, he tries to make it seem he is uncomfortable so that Roddy wouldn't be able to know that he and Dani are allies. Jason also told Roddy who the good dependable players are in this 1st AM session with Roddy where they made the 3 week deal. I think Jason is the best player in the house at this moment, he's got everyone fooled, except Dani. He is still in the house despite 1. voting Eric out 2. throwing HOH when Amy came back 3. survived Roddy's campaign 4. being an early "favorite" in the house I hope that Dani does follow Jason's advice to throw HOH, but at this point it seems she is intent of winning HOH and breaking her word. (Last night's prayer to God, reminiscent of Vecepia) |
Jan | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 11:48 am     ptomaine I didn't read yesterday's/last nights live feeds. Sigh, I really seem to have gotten away from reading them lately. Can you give me a hint about what time the post was made so I can find it easily? Thanks |
Luckhunter777 | Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 02:33 pm     To no one in particular ... my ramblings ... In ref. to saying one thing and doing another wouldn't we have to assume that the situation (or information available) has not changed signifigantly? I think in this game your plan must change with every bit of information that you have available at any given time. If you are talking about clips from the diary room in which Jason has said things like 'if Roddy would put up Dani I will have to use the veto' ... every DR monage I see I take with a grain of salt. I believe statements in there are edited for effect and taken out of context in more cases than NOT. Imagine if you will... Jason in DR ... discussing how Dani told him to use the veto and Nom Roddy if Rod has intention of nomming Dani .... what we see is 'If he intends to nom Dani I have to invoke Veto and put up Roddy.' Or ... While he is in DR he runs though many different scenerios ... if this... what if that ... maybe thinking out loud ... and mentions the above being an option. Once edited and taken out of context it is presented to us as a decision or a statement rather than the thought process that he was running though. Another thing that interferes wiith doing what you say you are going to do or intended to do is a change in the situation, or a perceived change. Such as it could easily be perceived that Dani is losing her focus and becoming unreliable, I don't see that the title of friend in the context of the game obligates Jason or anyone else to jeopardize thier chances of winning when the other's judgement may appear to be clouded. Another possible perception introduced by Dani herself ... she mentioned (actually harped incessantly) to both Lisa and Jason that Roddy gets others to do his dirty work ... hmmm maybe he wanted to make sure that he isn't being used for the dirty work.... Also his actions go along precisely with what he said before entering the house .. What strengths do you bring to BIG BROTHER? My easygoing personality and the ability to adjust quickly to new situations and new people. How do you plan to win BIG BROTHER? Build relationships with all players, align myself with two key people, stay in the game at all times, and adjust to any changes thrown my way. AND Why did you want to be on BIG BROTHER? To win the money! Plus, I'm a huge BIG BROTHER fan and wanted to be on the show. |
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