Archive through August 19, 2002
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Did you hear what Roddy just said?:
Archive through August 19, 2002
Chancesdesign | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:31 am     I started another thread a few day ago about Roddy's mistakes and his attitude of superiority. If anyone is interested, it was called "Roddy is Mistaken - Mind your M's and Q's" - here is the link. ../10972/1045182.html?1029398465 |
Azriel | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:32 am     From Webster's Online Dictionary Main Entry: 1forte Pronunciation: 'fOrt, 'fort; 2 is often 'for-"tA or for-'tA or 'for-tE Function: noun Etymology: French fort, from fort, adjective, strong Date: circa 1648 1 : the part of a sword or foil blade that is between the middle and the hilt and that is the strongest part of the blade 2 : one's strong point usage In forte we have a word derived from French that in its "strong point" sense has no entirely satisfactory pronunciation. Usage writers have denigrated \'for-"tA\ and \'for-tE\ because they reflect the influence of the Italian-derived 2forte. Their recommended pronunciation \'fort, however, does not exactly reflect French either: the French would write the word le fort and would rhyme it with English for. So you can take your choice, knowing that someone somewhere will dislike whichever variant you choose. All are standard, however. In British English \'fo-"tA\ and \'fot\ predominate; \'for-"tA\ and \for-'tA\ are probably the most frequent pronunciations in American English |
Gentoo | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:35 am     There is no such thing as "Mispronunciation" of words. Language is ever evolving, and if the way you pronounce (or spell for that matter) a word catches on with the mainstream, that becomes the "Correct" way. Language is an ever evolving tool. It is not always (or even usually) indicative of intelligence level, only of assimilation level, and of one's social status. I cans speak like dis an' still have sum amazing thinks. |
Jan | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:40 am     makes sense azriel except for the spelling Forte is the feminine version of fort..so wouldn't it be La forte and as soon as you add the e on the end wouldn't the french then pronounce the t (it is true that as fort they would not pronounce the t) OK this is getting way to "so what" i guess. |
Azriel | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:42 am     Jan that all was directly from Websters. I added nothing to it. |
Bracken | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:42 am     Yikes, I didn't mean to start the "words we mispronounce thread." haha. Even so, I hauled out my massive Random House unabridged version of the English Dictionary which I use as my definitive reference book rather than the much lighter and easier to handle Webster's Collegiate. The unabridged version shows: forte to be pronounced fort. When used as a music reference: it is a two syllable pronounciation = fortay. On the font and fount issue, fount seems to be correct in that it is defined as "a source or origin: a fount of inspiration to his audiences." Interestingly, to me, anyway, is the word preventive. The Collegiate Dictionary shows the word "preventative", while the unabridged version doesn't list it as a word at all. My personal favorite non-word, however, is "irregardless." I just cringe when anyone uses it. lol. OK, enough for me on this subject. Will attempt to find out more about Roddy's stellar (in his own mind) educational background. Thanks all. |
Azriel | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:46 am     Well, whatever...I think the correct American white trash pronunciation is fortay so I'll keep using that.  |
Guiltyviewer | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:49 am     LOL Earthmother! You can always crack me up with your colorful sayings!! Your homespun wisdom is a true delight! And your truth that a person can be 'educated' but remain 'ignorant' is completely valid in my life's experience---one of the smartest folks I'll ever meet didn't have so much as a third grade education while I've known others with multiple graduate degrees that don't know diddly about real life! Now who's 'smarter?' The trouble with common sense is that it's not all that common! _______________________________________________ Jan--don't worry, I'm not getting my feathers ruffled at all, and don't think anyone else is either(hope not!) This is just a friendly little chit chat, at least to me. If anyone's offended or otherwise bothered by my musings, I'd be more than happy to tell ya to just chalk it up to too much caffeine in someone battling insomnia (BB addiction I'm afraid .) We're all friends here on the board and will mind our manners (or Snee'll come set us straight, I'd betcha!) __________________________________________ Awww, Spunky! Thanks for the support and reassurance that I still might have at least a coupla brain cells still bumpin' into each other! *hug* |
Guiltyviewer | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:51 am     Marameko, sorry I'm taking so long to respond and thanks for that tidbit---I'll bet your instincts are right and maybe our resident detective Piratesbay will be able to uncover something about his educational credentials. You are very observant! Thanks again. |
Goddessatlaw | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:52 am     Gentoo: I agree that there's no such thing as the true mispronunciation of words in the American language. Nonetheless, it can be a matter of self defense that you learn local pronunciations when you've relocated from a different neck of the woods. Where I came from, we always pronounced Louisville as "Leweyville". Moved to Indy and almost had to move again because I couldn't master the vowel-swallowing pronunciation they use around here - a sound which is somewhere between an "o" and a "u", more on the short "u" side of it. Louisville here is pronounced sort of like "Luuville" with a swallow in the "u." I've lived here almost half my life and people know I don't belong because I can't pronounce that word to local satisfaction. PS I've always avoided the word "sycophant" - I can never wrap my mouth around the first two syllables with any level of ease, so I just let it alone. Good word, though. |
Makeitstop | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:52 am     I'm really late getting in here, but I had a comment about Roddy's airline employee story. As a former travel professional, I can easily see this story being true. Everyone has a good point that the counter agent wouldn't make this mistake if she checked in passengers every day going to Alaska, but she probably didn't. Chances are he checked in at an airport without an Alaskan nonstop flight and made a connection elsewhere. So, he might have been the first passenger she encountered that was going there. However, for this event to have taken place he would have had to have initiated the conversation by asking the exchange rate just to make her look stupid (like he does to Gerry). I have traveled overseas numerous times and an airline counter agent has never had occasion to discuss exchange rates with me. Anyway, I learned after years in the travel industry to never assume someone else in the business knew diddly-squat about anything outside their own fortay, uh, fort. So, sadly, I can see an agent making this mistake. |
Eden | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:58 am     Language IS ever-changing. New words and expressions are invented every day. But certainly words CAN be mispronounced. The fact that some mispronunciations may become so prevelant as to become acceptable just means a lot of people are lazy about language, not that it was ever right. |
Jan | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:59 am     makeitstop I bet you are right about Roddy instigating it. In the caviar conversation with Marc and the rest , he challenged Marc who loves caviar, to say what fish and where from. He FULLY expected him not to know and was shocked when he did know. He made no secret of his shock and actually said VERY GOOD to both answers as though it were an amazing thing for Marci to know something. So I can see that he starts these things to show up the ignorance of others (and, of course, point out his own brilliance) |
Azriel | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:59 am     Goddessatlaw, I've had people correct my pronunciation of Houston and I just shake my head and say, 'Excuse me, I lived there half my life and I think I know how to pronounce it.' Hmmph Sometimes, there are a few different ways to pronounce a word correctly. There is some leeway, but I don't buy into the you can pronounce it any way you want. You will make yourself look ignorant if you don't pronounce words correctly. |
Guiltyviewer | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 09:59 am     My FINAL word on the subject is this: "sycophant" can NEVER be considered PROPERLY pronounced in any stretch of the imagination as "syncophant" (tain't proper, it just ain't!!) Nuff said by me---gotta go eavesdrop on the hamsters now! Mod=you may want to move this to the thread Chancesdesign began--or not. Whatever makes YOU happy, you bein' in charge here an' all-- I don't wanna mess wif you! (practicing my best white trash phrases) |
Guiltyviewer | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 10:18 am     thought it was my last word but didn't want to risk upsetting any of my fellow boarders=== my ending reference to 'white trash' in the last post is related to another thread (it is HILARIOUS, too---if you haven't made it over there yet, don't miss it. It's a hoot!) Okay, I *think* I'm done |
Jadarville | Sunday, August 18, 2002 - 10:43 am     I did not read all of this thread as it was way too long for me, but one thing sticks out. There is a post loudly pointing out to a fairly large audience Roddy's (minor) mistake in mispronouncing a word, and then another post by the same person berating Roddy for pointing out to an audience someone's mistake in believing Alaska uses foreign currency. So does this mean that poster learned an important lesson from Roddy? <returns to lurk mode> |
Realfan | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 03:28 pm     What was with Roddy's stories about hieroglyphs, and saying an ancient Egyptian script was 1 million years old? He corrected himself to 500,000 years, but geez--I don't THINK so. Try 8,000 years old at the outside! Or did I misunderstand the LFP I read? |
Crossfire | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 03:29 pm     Sounds a little stargatish to me. |
Oregonfire | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 03:35 pm     I like for-tay, never knew that it was "wrong." I've never even heard "forte" pronounced "fort," now that is a new one to me. |
Snee | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 04:02 pm     gentoo: 'Language is ever evolving, and if the way you pronounce (or spell for that matter) a word catches on with the mainstream, that becomes the "Correct" way.' i agree. when my students get frustrated with spelling/pronunciation/spelling, i tell them that they could change it. 'all you have to do is a few billion of your best friends together and do it differently!' frankly, i miss 'whom' which is going by the wayside. earthmother: we pronounce 'stipend' with a long 'i' here. in fact, i don't think i'v ever heard it with the short 'i'. hunh. |
Snee | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 04:04 pm     roddy told marce 'very good!' about the caviar. aaaaaaaaaaaaah, that man is so pompous. |
Willow_Woman | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 04:28 pm     Wouldn't you love to see Roddy and Alex Trebek in a room together for awhile? Snee, yes, I too am mourning the passing of "whom." I finally figured out when to use who and when to use whom...now nobody's using it! Oh well...whom cares? |
Guiltyviewer | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 04:36 pm     Realfan, I'm the LFP who posted the hieroglyphs story and I didn't realize I made a mistake and typed 'million years' when what Roddy really said was 'million NIGHTS!' I was typing so fast trying to get in as much detail as possible and must have missed my error in review---it WAS late for me (2 hrs later than BBtime). Thanks for being so observant---I know I wouldn't have realized this is wrong unless you'd pointed it out. Oh no, now I gotta go ask the mods to correct my post, and as much as I can't stand Roddy (in this game), he deserves fairness and my error is very unfair to him. One million NIGHTS is very different than one million YEARS---mea culpa. I am soooo sorry for my mistake, and thank you Realfan for finding it so I can set the record straight. *hanging head in shame, slinking away to go face the music w/mods, turning in LFP badge for good.....* |
Wargod | Monday, August 19, 2002 - 04:53 pm     Hey Guilty, we all make mistakes! I can't tell you how many times I typed Lisa/Chiara and gotten the wrong girl! Most of the time, I can catch the mistake and edit it, a couple times, I've just added in the next post, oops, that was....which ever it was. |
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