Why can't a good person win Big Brother?
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TV ClubHouse: Archive: Archive THREE : Why can't a good person win Big Brother?

John32070

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 05:14 am EditMoveDeleteIP
In BB1, Josh was the best overall person in the house, but he lost to Eddie, who I consider the third worst after Mega and Jordan.

In BB2, Monica was the best of the final 4-5, but Nicole was so into beating the worst person of all, Will, she took out Monica third. Will ended up winning anyway.

Now we have Lisa and Dani. And who was probably the best overall person? Jason. And he just left. Dani has dug herself a huge hole which I imagine she is just now realizing, and Lisa, despite her good looks, hasn't got a heart of gold considering her comments about Gerry, Josh, Amy, and maybe some others here and there. Maybe it's true that playing the game with your heart won't get you anywhere (BB2's Sheryl is a perfect example).

Dfwteddy

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 05:31 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Wasn't this Lisa's question to Gerry when she and Eric were nominated -- why did he nominate the 'good people?' (I guess Gerry hadn't received his printed program listing who the 'good people' were.)

I, too, couldn't stand Eddie in BB1 and thought every week he should have been voted out -- and the public had the vote then -- so what happened? Why didn't he go if he wasn't one of the good people? In BB2, was Monica always 'good,' or did she only become good when were left with the b**ch, the bully, and the liar (aka Nicole, Hardy and Will)? Would Sheryl have been one of the good ones had she stayed in the house and been forced to play the game, getting dirty to stay inside?

Good is in the eye of the beholder. There is usually someone in the house we can all identify with and that person becomes a 'good' person in our eyes. Just look at the disparity in feelings this year about Danielle and Roddy -- no center ground for most folks.

In this game, for what it requires, for the most part I think a 'good' person is an evicted HG!

Earthmother

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 05:56 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Did Lisa start this thread?..lol

Missy2

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 06:01 am EditMoveDeleteIP
A good person? Who decides who is good or bad? I think a bad people are usually ones that are in prison or posted on your neighbor sexual offender list. Danielle is a good person who played the bb game. I don't think there were any bad people in the bb house - but then again I guess good and / or bad is all a matter of opinion.

Ryn

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 06:18 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I would not have been upset if any of the final 4 had won.

or almost any of them for that matter.

We have nitpicked and disected these people to death, I feel if any of use were in that house for 2+ month being watched 24x7 by the rest of the world we would be disliked too, at least I know I would.

I think if someone started a thread on this board as to which poster should win BB no one could agree on any ONE person, someone would always feel they were undeserving.

just my 2 cents

Jagger

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 06:20 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think this should be questioned more of why can't a fan favorite win, which I guess in all 3 of the shows the cbs fan favorite will probably win. I agree with John32070 on his choices for the favorites IMO, I liked all 3 of his picks and hoped they would win, but it just didn't happen.

In these shows the so called good people usally get eaten up early in the game, in bb3 one of the favorites did manage to last till the final eviction, and he ended up losing because he was also the hgs favorite.

Missy2

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 06:25 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Well said Ryn. I loved the board last year, I don't know if the board changed or I did - but this year the constant picking apart is just too much.

Lucymac

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 06:40 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Ryn, I agree with your two cents. I would imagine if we saw some of these people outside the house on a day to day basis we would think they were "good" people. And many of us posters who feel like we are "good" people might not be perceived that way when playing the game. Money can make you do strange thinks sometimes. I think it would be very difficult living under a microscope. And players who sit back and aren't aggressive get criticised for not playing the game, where as those that are aggressive often do things that make us dislike them. It's a tough situation.

Wcv63

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 07:25 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I just want MY favorite to win. It just isn't fair. Makes me want to pout and stomp. :O

Truly, although I will disppointed if who I want to win doesn't win it won't effect my life in any way shape or form so it really isn't a significant factor in my life. But it sure was an enjoyable way to pass the Summer. Thanks guys!

Zachsmom

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 07:39 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think no matter who wins tonight a "good" person wins..(even though neither one was my favoritie)

then again..I don't believe any of these people were "bad"..granted I would have strong personality clashes with quite a few of them if I were to meet them on the outside..but just because I wouldn't get along with a few of them..I don't believe them to be a "bad" person..

I wish all of the HGs only happiness..and thank them for entertaining me..and having the guts to go on the show!!!

What555456

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 07:40 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think both Lisa and Dani are good people. So, this year a good person will win BB3.

Ocean_Islands

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 07:54 am EditMoveDeleteIP
The picking apart on this board has been the same each year.

Marymc

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 08:08 am EditMoveDeleteIP
i never saw eddie as a "bad" person...a lil rough around the edges, maybe, but a good heart. monica never struck me as all that "good"....i mostly remember her sitting around smoking and plotting with krista. isn't it funny how we all watch the same show and come away with very different opinions? guess that's why witnesses to crime should always be taken with a grain of salt.

Lurknomore

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:20 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I think this has a very simple answer...because he couldn't hold on to the key, or win the last HoH game.

This year a good person COULD have won...sigh.

(disclaimer...I don't really think Dani or Lisa are "bad" people, but they didn't play clean games IMHO. Lisa never really played if you ask me...she just had a sweet romance then floated into the finals. Dani played too hard)

Costacat

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:24 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I'll see Ryn's two cents, and raise him by another two. I agree wholeheartedly. And I also agree with Missy: who decides who the "good" and "bad" people are? Is it based on their character inside the house or out? Based on how they played the game or lived their life? Based on how much they needed the money or wanted the experience?

Until you've been in their shoes, and lived in that house, how can you possibly say that a "good" person did not win? I thought both Eddie and Will deserved their wins. I'm hoping that Lisa will win BB3, and I feel that she deserves to win. I feel she deserves to win based on how she played the game. There might be others who played a *different* game, but that game didn't get 'em in the final two, now did it?

Crazydog

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:29 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree that some people are defining "good" as "my favorite", and thus our responses are based on our biases. Lisa is the fan favorite according to the latest CBS.com poll. She is also my favorite, and therefore I think a "good" person has won BB this year.

Jaysgal

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:30 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Well, I don't think that the presumption that good people cannot win simply because they are good is well-founded.

I think the underlying issue is strategy, not with the good and the bad. I recall Jason repeatedly bragging about being a BB addict. I remember reading that his father and he discussed strategy and went through different scenario. It would seem to me that they strategised on complex things and overlooked a simple scenario that should have taught them a lesson by now: In a two person alliance, never stick on to the end with that person. Hardy made that mistake and suddenly seemed willing to take the bullet for Nicole. The same applies to Jason this season. I can excuse his decision to form alliance with his opposite, the <mod>, but staying to the end with the <mod> made me lose respect....

Had Jason exploited that critical moment where Marcellas was nominated and won GPOV, Jason would have been where Danielle is today. A great strategy for Jason would have been to tell Marcellas everything about Danielle's plot against Marcellas. He should have advised Marcellas to save himself. Although Marcellas is egotistical, he would have shredded Danielle for playing the race card with him yet plotting behind his back. And then Jason should have put up Danielle against Amy. If he couldn't secure Lisa's vote against Danielle, at least he would have Marcellas' vote to pull a tie. And then he would evict Danielle.

Again, people wouldn't view him as a saint anymore. Marcellas would think that Jason finally grew a spine, and so would Lisa. They'll be shocked to see him do that to Danielle of all persons.

Additionally, Marcellas didn't like the fact that Lisa was a part of the original six and he didn't like that Amy was still in the game even though she was not playing the game. So, if he won HOH the next week, he would have been after Amy and Lisa. Jason would vote to evict Amy. Both Lisa and Marcellas would then want to take Jason to the final two, since he was no longer a saint.

To me, Jason would still be a good person and would earned my complete respect. However, Jason chose to go the Hardy/Nicole route. Consequently, he was left a destitute, as was Hardy. There's no one to blame....

P.S.: I too was disappointed in Lisa for not sticking to her words of the "good people" winning. She pulled the trigger on Jason. That's the only reason I would question my decision to give Lisa first place. I guess she could argue that she was leaving it up to the jury to let the good person win.

Ryn

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:32 am EditMoveDeleteIP
The picking apart is the same - just different people that are getting picked apart.

Last year, Kent, Hardy, Nicole, Will, Shannon, Mike, Justin, Krista, the list goes on and on from last year.

Year one, Will Mega, Jordan, Jamie, Eddie, Eddie (yes twice - lol), George, Karen, etc etc etc.....

Even the 'nice' people are disected when some folks run out of things to rip in the the other HGs about - lol

Countrymeadow

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:35 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Can each of you step back for just a moment and actually comprehend how emotionally draining and stressful that house environment must be? I think about that all the time....especially when I find myself making judgements.

I myself cannot even imagine how I would change as a person. The house does that to you. It brings out things you never knew were inside.

I am glad that 2 actual nice people made it to the finals. They each played a different game and made it to the end that way. It's not for us to judge until we are actually in their shoes, ya know?

Bastable

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:38 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree with Ryn. Plus, let's put each one of us in a pressure-cooker fishbowl for three months and see if we don't do a few unlikable things. Then watch as the boards rip into us for those little things. (Washing hands?? Puh-leeeze.)

On BB, the good people outnumber the bad ones.

Krossd

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 09:44 am EditMoveDeleteIP
I agree a good person Will win this year..... I agree with John (and others) about Eddie BB1 (I always asked then if he wasn't an amputee would his sleeping all day, bad manners, farting, & foul language have gotten him booted sooner? IMO yes, he wouldn't have stayed playing the way he did.) However, I disagree that Josh was the best BB1 player- to the best was Curtis. It's all a matter of personal taste, and maybe even age.

In BB2 I think we wanted entertainment! That we got with Will - and then some! I didn't like Chilltown (not the people the gang), and that is exactly what Josh tried create hour 1. Bad tactic since more HG were wise to how BB worked and took it down - fast. And I am glad they did too, because I didn't want to see a march through like that. I didn't like arrogant Will at all (though he was a blast to watch and even to look at), but by the end & even tho he was part of chilltown, I wanted him to win.. he deserved it.

It seems to me, that Dani tried to combine the Eddie ploy and Will's way, but it just isn't the same (don't know if this was deliberate, just seems a bit of both).

This year I do think a 'nice', or good, or kinder heart will win, compared to BB 1 and 2. IMO

What555456

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:04 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Shouldn't this thread have been more accurately named -- Why can't a NICE Person win BB? Isn't this what is really being talked about -- how nice the person is, not their moral integrity?

To me, the reason a "nice" person can't win BB is the same reason a person who is not physically agressive cannot win a football game -- because of the nature of the game.

This is not a game which rewards people for being nice. It never was and never will be. If you want a game where nice people win, then you have to find another one.

Kellirippa

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:10 am EditMoveDeleteIP
There ya go What555456: That's what it boils down to, this isn't "Touched by an Angel"!

Rabbit

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:15 am EditMoveDeleteIP
What567890123a2j7215 your post is very insightful and accurate so I thought I would nit-pick it just cause its the last day. Nice people would stand a very good chance under the original game 1 format.

Sorry, I couldnt find more to disagree with.

What555456

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:25 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Agreed Rabbit. But even there, all one had to do was fool the American public. Many people thought Jimmy Swaggart was a nice guy too -- until they found out he was out finding wh*res all over the place whenever he had a revival.

Suitsmefine

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:27 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Ya, but if it was just all nice people sitting around sipping tea and playing bridge, while discussing the weather, WHO THE HECK WOULD WATCH 24/7?????????? Plus who would we dissect then????? Your trying to take all the fun outta the game talkin' all this nicey,goody stuff!!!!LOL!!!!I want action...with lots of connivin',cussin',and brawlin'!!!! If I want to see nice people play a game I'll go watch grampa playin' checkers!!!!

What555456

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 10:41 am EditMoveDeleteIP
Suitsmefine

Believe me, if you have ever played bridge, there are a LOT of ways to attack someone for their playing. And viciously too! I suspect we would have far worse bashing iof we were watching them play bridge than we have watching them just interact! LOL!!!

Suitsmefine

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 12:18 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
What555456, Bad example!!!!LOL!!! as i lurk back out the door}

Gina8642

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 12:21 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Personally I feel comfortable saying I don't like something someone has done. Or, saying I don't like them. Or, saying who I want to win or not.

However, I feel really, really, uncomfortable saying someone is not a good person. Not my call.

Bastable

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 12:22 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Yes, Gina8642, that call is only for God and, apparently, Dubya.

Gina8642

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 12:28 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
lol @ bastable

John32070

Wednesday, September 25, 2002 - 03:06 pm EditMoveDeleteIP
Krossd, I agree with you about Eddie. I too have always wondered if that missing leg kept him in the house til the end despite his bad points. Would he have been as close to Karen and George? I know Cassandra wasn't too fond of him at times. If not for the missing leg, I think he'd have been evicted week 4 (the week everyone left but Jamie was up and Brit was shockingly evicted).

Cricket

Thursday, September 26, 2002 - 07:01 am EditMoveDeleteIP
You brought up something interesting John32070, because I have wondered if Lisa was the 'favorite' because of the way she dressed. I never found a thread to comment that I was getting tired of the very low cut shorts and pants and short tops.

I sure hope the women next year don't think they have to walk around in a string bikini to win the game. That gets old after awhile. This game should be a brain game, not a beauty pageant. The best brain didn't win this game.