Archive through September 22, 2000
The ClubHouse: Big Brother 2000: General - Archives:
Questions, questions and more questions:
Eddie's Desire to "Clothesline" Jamie--Unacceptable?:
Archive through September 22, 2000
Fenixtx | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:48 am  Jujubean said: "you are getting inside of someone's head which by my estimation is a REMARKABLE feat". This can be said about both sides of this argument. |
Wendy | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:49 am  Cookie: It seemed as though Mega was intense and confrontatioal 99% or the time. Eddie isn't like that. He fools around and sometimes he takes it too far. He would never hurt her. And here's my question: If it really was such a horrible thing, why didn't Josh or Curtis (who were sitting there) tell him to shut up or lay off? |
Green | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:50 am  because they are pussays? |
Deni_San | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:52 am  Before, I go on I want it to be clear I am not saying Eddie is an abuser. That is a heavy term to throw around. What I am saying is that there is a disturbing trend in his behavior to suggest that he may be hanging with someone who may think this would be okay. His behavior towards women of the house is inconsistant with his behavior the males in the house. If alarms go off, it doesn't always mean there is a fire. About public reaction to bad things: If you take Psych 101, you will hear of a famous stabbing of a woman in an apartment complex with countless neighbors who heard her screams and did nothing. There are cases where violence or something going badly wrong, and no one will come to the person's aid. No one thinks it is there business, its easier to not say anything. American's mind their own business. Domestic violence and child abuse is "family business". There was a streetperson who slept in front of the offices we worked in who hadn't moved as usual. Several of my fellow employees stepped over him to get to work and I was the only one who made sure we called the ambulence. One women I volunteered with the Domestic Violence Center, was an Executive with AT&T and abused for 10 years. For ten years, she walked in the office with sunglasses to hide the bruises, until one day a co-worker confronted her to get help. For 10 years, no one spoke up. People will see and hear violence and only few people will get involved. Its easier to deny your senses or rationalize its not your business. Its difficult to perk up your ears, look outside, and check if everyone is okay and if you can help. When I was in college, one night i was on my front porch talking to a friend on the phone. I lived in a nice neighborhood. I saw a woman who was a neigbor running and screaming for help. I hung up and called 911. I found out her husband was after her with a knife. 2 other neighbors joined us and we waited with her even though there was a guy out there with a knife. When the police came and took control we headed back to our apartments. I had to call 911 again because I saw a man with a large kitchen knife and had to alert the police of his whereabouts. 3 neighbors out of entire neighborhood got involved to make a difference. That made me feel good. Domestic violence doesn't start with a brandishing of a knife. It starts with the assumption that you can communicate with women through intimidation and violence to gain a sense of power. It is not helped by a public that takes violence and the treatment of women lightly, or looks away. |
Jujubean | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:54 am  OOOPS! Sorry Wendy, I was going through the archives and trying to type so fast that I didn't even realize I had put your name instead..Won't happen again- and yes it was "Whatever". Well, whatever...... You may flog me over the head or even "clothesline" me whichever you prefer! And yes, I am tired, tired of all the ridiculous posts about Eddie and the other house guests about silly things. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:54 am  For the same reason that people stay out of it when things happened to me. I was in a room with a friend when my ex came home. I came out of the room and she stayed in it. He came up to be and became very verbally abusive and then left. She said and did nothing but just looked away when I came back in. She would never talk about it. You explain it. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 12:55 am  For the same reason that people stayed out of it when things happened to me. I was in a room with a friend when my ex came home. I came out of the room and she stayed in it. He came up to be and became abusive and then left. She said and did nothing but just looked away when I came back in. She would never talk about it. You explain it. |
Jujubean | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:01 am  Fenixtx- Not my side. I was specifically referring to the way Katie had said Eddie is angry. I have never heard Eddie express that he is angry for what happened to him. I stated facts about what we HAVE seen and heard, not what MIGHT BE or POSSIBLY IS. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:01 am  Deni You said it all so well. I am not saying he is an abuser. I am saying that he seems to have the potential of it because of the way he treats women. He very well might not become one but he needs to learn that the way he treats women is not acceptable. |
Big_Al | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:02 am  I haven't been following this thread closely and certainly haven't read all 175 posts, but I thought last night that many posters were complimenting Jamie on how loose and fun she was, going toe-to-toe with all the guys on their wisecracks, etc. Seems to me that if she had done the same today during the "clothesline" caper, giving Eddie back the same as he was giving her, and being the easygoing and "one of the guys" person she showed herself to be yesterday, that everyone would have enjoyed it and this thread would be about 170 posts shorter. I imagine, however, that Jamie is pretty sensitive to everything now that the euphoria of last night has worn away (which seems to be the same with many of the posters here.) I hope she realizes that the more that Eddie can get her goat, the more he will try to find ways to do exactly that. That's the way he plays the game some, but not all, of the time. |
Azriel1104 | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:06 am  I can't believe what this thread turned into. This is as bad as people calling George a murderer. I think its disgusting that you would even hint that Eddie would abuse a woman. It's one thing to discuss actions that we saw and say that Eddie was rude or overboard, its another thing to slander him with this garbage. I think this thread should be removed. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:09 am  Eddie has talked about being angry. He has talked about the fact that he believes his cancer is caused by the powerlines by his house and that the insurance company dropped the coverage because of his cancer and that the powerline company isn't accepting any responsibility for what happened to him and that the attorneys have helped them get away with it. That is where I saw and heard the anger. I am not trying to get into his head but just what I heard him say a very long time ago. I feel he has every right to be angry with them. |
Zaney | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:10 am  I hate to admit that I know this but, the terms Eddie used "clothesline" come from TVs' wrestling shows "WWF","WCW". My husband watches occasionally when he can get away with it. Sometimes he says if you don't watch it I'll take you down. Sometimes I tell him I'm going to "bonk" him in the nose. Of course neither one of us have ever even come close and never would. We joke around. I understand how it feels to be abused I dated someone who was abusive. I know the phrases and roughhousing guys do. I have 4 nephews who are in their twenties and they still wrestle around. One of my sisters gets right in there with them. In fact I think she and I were rougher with one another growing up than they were. We never got hurt. Jaime is not use to being with guys in such a close environment. So to her it might have been insulting and I hope Eddie will see she doesn't see it the same way he does and will not go any farther. As for the bruises, I personally bruise very easy. My nine month old bruises me just by grabbing on to my arm. I don't think Eddie meant any harm. I think he was playing, however I can see how some of you see it differently from your own experiences. Eddie and his mom are very close that usually isn't the case with guys who are abusive. Jaime use to ask Eddie why he didn't do the stuff with her that he and Brit do. Eddie told her it was different between him. Now he is starting to be more open with Jaime like he was with Brit. I think she realizes it is not the same with her and Eddie. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:16 am  NO one has said he is an abuser. I don't believe he is but his behavior is such that it is not appropriate. It is also the type of behavior an abuser would exhibit in the begining. Jamie did just sit there and finishe her breakfast. She didn't do anything and I think it is interesting that we have people complaining and saying she should just relax and not make a big deal of it and then we have people saying she should have given it back. She is kind of damned is she does and damned is she doesn't. |
Big_Al | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:21 am  Not a BIG deal, but is it Jaime, Jaimie, or Jamie? I've seen all three spellings used in the last several postings. |
Voyeur | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:22 am  The point of the Kitty Genovese story (the woman who ran screaming for help for over a half hour and nobody called the cops) was not that people don't want to get involved, but rather the fact that multiple witnesses lessen their sense of responsibility to do something about it. An experiment was developed to test this, they put people in a situation where they believed they were hearing another person talk about something, and while this person was talking, they would simulate an emergency. When subjects were told they were the only person listening, they all left to find help. When they were told that multiple people were listening, a high percentage just sat in their cubicles, and listened to the person's pleas, albeit very uncomfortably. When asked later why they did not get help, they said that they figured that someone else would have done that and they didn't need to. That lesson from my psych course has taught me to always assume that no one else is responding in any emergency, even if I see a crowd of hundreds of people watching. As for Eddie, I think he's tired of getting pity about his leg, and he likes to see how far he can push people before they will push back. He knows Jamie is totally unwilling to confront him. Hell, he knows they all are. He knows that if he had two legs he would have been voted out of there long ago, and he's absolutely contemptuous of his housemates and the public because they will not call him on his behavior. |
Really | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:22 am  Katie, this is how I'll explain it... Some people choose to or continue to allow themselves to be victimized. Perhaps your 'friend' felt it was not her business to be telling you what or what not to do. Vulnerable and naive people will get verbally and physically abused until they realize they need to remove themselves and learn not to get involved with people who do not treat them the way they would like to be treated. I once was temporarily involved with a guy who slammed me in the face (once) I called 'a friend'from the police station asking if I could stay with her, she declined. I won't say what I did to the guy, but let's just say he learned not to mess with me. I later gave him the privilege of dropping the assault charges when we went to court. As for the 'friend' - it was the last time I ever talked to her. Good riddens to both of them. Please note, I grew up with 5 brothers - all older than me. One unfortunately was abusive to the whole family, one other was one that horsed-around to show his feelngs. Two totally different people and two totally different behaviors. There is a difference...you can usually see it in the face and hear it in the tone of voice. About Eddie - I also want to note from Eddie's bio: Eddie's proudest accomplishment is teaching children that being disabled doesn't mean that you can't live a rewarding life... Eddie has once again been misunderstood for his actions and now has been associated with abusers in this thread...that in itself I find abusive. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:33 am  No one has said that Eddie is abusive. The point I am trying to make is that this isn't good. His behavior toward others in disrespectful. He doesn't treat any of them with any respect. It is not abusive. However this is the way abusive men start. That does not mean he is. The point is he has no right to do something that makes other uncomfortable. If he regularly horses around with other, why isn't he doing it with the guys?? He doesn't!! That is the issue. There are all kind of abuse by the way. Some of them don't leave scars on the outside. |
Katie | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:37 am  Really How do you explain this same person and another like her refusing to testify in court when I asked her too? Her reason was 'She didn't want to get involved!!' He walked because no one wanted to get involved. |
Jujubean | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:39 am  Katie- Even if you are not saying Eddie is an abuser, or maybe you are back pedaling a bit each time. It is still a strong accusation to say he is "borderline", or exhibiting abusive behaviour or behaviour an abuser would exhibit. It's still too much. Eddie still did not say, "I'm angry." He has simply stated the facts before as to how he thought the cancer occurred, and the situation surrounding his ordeal. It's really kind of irrelevant to the "clothesline" situation anyway. |
Azriel1104 | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:39 am  Katie, this is something way personal that you are projecting on to Eddie. I repeat I think this thread should be removed. |
Jujubean | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:55 am  OH GOODNESS KATIE- Look, I am sorry, but now it is just starting to look like you are just trying to gain SYMPATHY. Another FACT: Eddie messes around with the guys as well, mainly Josh. He verbally bashes him from time to time by cursing at him, etc. Still all in fun. Happy now? Now please, stop making false, strong accusations and assumptions about things you don't REALLY know about. |
Really | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 01:55 am  Katie, you said you think Eddie has 'the potential' to be an abuser, some of us are trying to point out to you that we see it from a different point of view and do not agree with you. I think perhaps you need to seek some professional help to help you with your own victimization. Sometimes that can distort the way you view others. And this is not 'the way' abusive men start. Eddie does not display this type of maliciousness. If you know anything about communication, which it appears you are in the process of trying to learn - a high percentage of communciation comes not from words themselves but from tonality and expression (approx 7% are attributed to the actual words.) And as far as his actions he was only demonstrating to Jamie what clotheslining meant when she asked him what that was. This hyper-sensitivity has been taken way too far and too out of line. These accusations I would say are borderline or if not already doing so - slanderous. Which I believe is considered a felony, if I'm not mistaken. |
Jujubean | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 02:01 am  Oh, BTW- Remember when Jamie and Eddie were having a rubber band fight? She hit him in the nipple and the eye, LOL....I think she can hold her own... |
Really | Friday, September 22, 2000 - 02:08 am  Katie, to answer your above question... some people just do not want to get involved. I have met many people like that. Perhaps it stems from fear, fear of retribution, fear of being mistaken, many people respond and are motivated out of love or fear. The older I get the less involved I want to get. Each person's life has trouble enough without adding someone else's. Some people do not want to associate with anyone involved with abusive people, criminal behaviour, questionable behaviours, unpredicatability, the list goes on. It's just part of how we experience life here. There will probably be very few people in your life you can truly count on and those are the ones you keep precious and protect. These are just things you have to learn on your own. This is why we have pain (mental/physical) to protect and guide us. And everyone's measure is different. |
|