Author |
Message |
Rupertbear
Member
09-19-2003
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 8:40 am
Adven...you are always so amusing! ((hug)) Judd...get the door, Judd!
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Adven
Member
02-06-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 8:50 am
Thanks, RB, but I wasn't joking. I take my hokey, staged for TV, pseudo-cultural ceremonies very seriously.
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Sheilaree
Member
07-19-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 8:57 am
Anyone know when the next Survivor's starts? Thanks.
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 9:17 am
It really did bother me a lot that they ate the sacrificed chicken. Part of my family is a different faith than the rest, but when we are at their house, we respect their ways and follow their rules. To me, they should have felt as if they were in someone else's home. I can imagine the look of horror on my stepmom's face if I did something like start frying up a pound of bacon on her stove. I think I would be banished...LOL
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Rupertbear
Member
09-19-2003
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 9:28 am
But many people watching would not have such a blasé-paid-for-by-Burnett approach. Even if it was staged Adven...it was done to show us part of their culture...and no matter which way you carve the chicken...their actions bespoke disrespect in my books. 
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Native_texan
Member
08-24-2004
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 9:39 am
How do we know this was not a ritual performed on a regular basis and Mark Burnett had to work his schedule around it? And so what if they were compensated for it? I bet they made better use of any form of compensation they received than most people would. In any event, it still doesn't give anyone the right to disrespect the culture.
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Bluejaxrock
Member
04-23-2004
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 9:41 am
I'm glad Danni won, but I saw very little of the "reunion" show and my question is this...how much weight did Danni put back on? Did she look healthier? (Other than her poofy lips.) I'm also gonna weigh in on the Mayan ritual and the chicken-eaters. I think it was unthinkable to eat the chicken - it was part of a ritual for pete's sake. In my mind, this is no different than a non-believer pi**ing on the altar of my church. Whether they believe in my religion or not, I do, and would take offense at others who so blatantly disrepected it. They had, what, two days before the final? Puhleese. I really thought that Rafe would win due to the fact he's the only one who didn't eat the bird. Can anyone point me to pictures of the survivors after their return to civilization? TIA!
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Naja
Member
06-28-2003
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 9:48 am
Wow, I just looked at the Early Show video from this morning at CBS site. You get a much better look at Danni's lips. The top one is actually crooked as if the right side got a little more blown up than the left. I didn't notice that last night.
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Denecee
Member
09-05-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:01 am
I was hoping for a Steph win but what ya going to do? I was shouting at the tv when Judd was saying that he was brutally honest. No, Judd, you aren't honest just brutally rude. The chicken thing kind of freaked me out. I guess I couldn't say for sure what I would do but I would like to think that I would not have eaten the chicken. Made me a little sick just thinking about it. Dani seems like a really nice girl and I liked the way she was with her family.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:04 am
I think eating that chicken was very disrespectful.
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Catfat
Member
02-27-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:14 am
I am not superstitious and I don't believe eating the chicken caused the storm. I also don't believe that any words or ritual made the chicken anything other than what it was--a cooked chicken. The only thing that would have stopped me from eating it was the fact that the feathers and guts were cooked along with it and it probably stank. Have you ever smelled burnt feathers? And wouldn't the guts have contaminated the whole thing? There is an obvious reason that animals are gutted before cooking and it has to do with health. I am just using logic here, not trying to disrespect someone else's superstition, but I don't believe in things I can't see. And they said the corn had gone all moldy, isn't there some hellucinogenic disease caused by eating moldy grain?
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Watching2
Member
07-07-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:26 am
I thought it was disrespectful and I thought it poetic they had that horrid thunder & lightening storm right after. We couldn't help but chuckle at them thinking they were getting their due! I try not to be superstitious, but I have to admit there's been times when certain things freaked me out a bit. I think the storm was coincidental, but I might have gotten spooked at the time! I think the laughter at tribal council was directed toward THEM and how freaked out they got about what they had done. If it wasn't so close to the end and they hadn't had anything to eat in ages, I could better understand them eating it. They would have lived w/o it. The only one who looked like they were starving was Danni and she looked that way from the start just about. Anyway, I don't like to disrespect anyone's beliefs and I even cringe a bit with reading a communion host being called a "cracker" even though I know no ill was meant. I'm not that uptight! And while I might have my own take which isn't EXACTLY what the church teaches, I still think it's an article of respect once it's used in a service. Prior - get a bag and eat away if you want! LOL Danni does look healthier. I saw a bit of her on Regis & Kelly but missed most of it so only saw her for a couple of min. Still can't get over those lips though. She looks like a different person! Rafe definitely pulled a Marcellus!!!!!! DH thought he would vote for Danni and I'm thinking "no way" and then he made the comment that Steph would be getting his vote. He was gambling and he lost and he had no right to hold it against Danni for not picking him. He just got too full of himself. I don't think he threw the last IC. He tired too hard to win all the others.
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Maris
Member
03-28-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:38 am
My whole problem with the chicken was Stepenies attitude and arrogance. First of all she pressures Lydia to ask about whether they can eat it, why I dont know since she had decided she was going to eat it anyway. Stephenie's whole game play has been me me me, pity me, poor me, my aching back me, I am starving and I deserve that burnt chicken me. I dont care about anything other than what I want. I mean come on, they were down to the final four, what two more days? Stephenie couldnt wait another day for a piece of burnt chicken. No it just got to her that the chicken was sitting there and she felt she deserved it.
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Allietex
Member
08-16-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:43 am
A few observations Rafe should now know that Cindy did the right thing with the car. Reverse psycology seldom works. He admitted at the Reunion show that he believed that Danni would still take him. By then he could laugh about it. I think it was a ploy to appeal to her conscious to emphasize the promise she made to him. Bad choice. However, I don't think it would have mattered because... If Danni had taken Rafe, it would have given Steph an opportunity to reveal how much Rafe had to do with her own actions. By the time she got through, Rafe would not have had Bobby Jon, Judd, Jamie, or Cindy on his side. Of course, by their reactions last night, they had already figured it out anyway. And Steph would problably have voted against him because she would have realized how much he had used her as a scapegoat. Gary would certainly have voted for Danni. Not sure how Lydia would have gone, but from her comments last night, she was very hurt by Steph voting her out. Once Danni won the IC, she had it won. I think the vote would have gone pretty much the same way. Judd came across as still not realizing that Survivor is a game and everyone except one is going to get voted out. He had no qualms about voting out others, but it was not supposed to happen to him. Even in the Reunion show he tried to put a good face on his actions with the old, Well, this is just me and I tell it like it is baloney that rude people often use. LOL I was impressed with Jamie at the reunion show. He could admit he was losing it on the show and laugh at himself. I also think it was disrespectful of the women to eat the chicken. It was too close to the end of the game for them to use the 'we are so hungry' excuse. They had one more day for pete's sake. Actually, I was surprised at Lydia, because she seemed so blown away by the experience and so attuned to the culture. I respected Rafe's decision and how he handled it. He did not try to make the others feel guilty but he stayed true to his own gut feeling. When they first ate it, I had an uneasy feeling that they might all get sick from it, but instead they got a storm. Was rather eerie. LOL I have to admit, I did not even notice Danni's lips. I was blown away by how much better all the women looked. Of course, I have always had a thing about how much better the men usually look after they have been out there a few days, but in this case, I thought they all looked better. Gary certaily looked better. He looked ten years younger. The KC/football connection. Do you remember who KC lost to last night? The Dallas Cowboys with whom Gary quarterbacked for several years. Stange uh? And isn't it interesting about the real Survivor fans getting on the show as opposed to those who are recruited. And this year, you get Gary who was recruited, but who is also a big Survivor fan and who brought a lot to the show. Just goes to show, you can get both if you look hard enough. On the whole, I thought this was a very good season. It had interesting people, some good drama, and an ending I could live with. I came to really respect Danni by the end, and while I respected Step's game, I did not like her personality, so I was happy to see her get as far as she did without winning. Does that make sense? See you all next season.
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Watching2
Member
07-07-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:49 am
Maris, I agree about Stephenie. Had she been one of my kids when they were young and asked in the middle of a ceremony if they could eat the chicken I probably would have squeezed her hand until it was ready to fall off to keep her quiet. There would be a lot of glaring! I would have done that to her had she asked me to ask the man. I thought that was incredibly rude and self-centered. I couldn't believe she had the nerve to ask that right in the middle of it all! She really got on my nerves, too. DH didn't quite see it, but then again, he doesn't read these boards where we pick apart everything everyone does. 
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:57 am
Eating the chicken (which in Mayan culture are generally sacrificed in healing ceremonies) is highly disrespectful. Whether you believe in someone else's religious rites or not, to me it lacks integrity to openly disrespect them. They asked, the Mayans said no. Since when does no mean yes?
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Allietex
Member
08-16-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 10:58 am
Oh, and as to the religious and cultural icons, I remember how angry I was when Ozzy Osburne urinated on the Alamo. He was all but banned in San Antonio until he apologized about ten years later. To this day, I have no use for him, and have never watched his show. Respect for others and their beliefs is just basic human courtesy. What you cosider scared someone else might consider superstition. And talking about superstition, check this out about his little stunt. It is pretty funny. http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/alamo.html Sorry I have forgotten how to post a link. Maybe someone else could do it for me.
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Fruitbat
Member
08-07-2000
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:15 am
Adven, hysterical. I watched the chicken ritual again. He did not say, don't eat the chicken. He answered the question as if it were asked, "Do we eat the chicken?" He said no, it is a sacrifice to the gods, as if explaining that eating it was not part of the ceremony. He also laughed, probably at the notion someone would want to eat an undressed chicken burned to a crisp. Honestly, I doubt they cared. It was a staged ceremony for pay and if they take this ritual seriously in the context of their life, this probably held no meaning for them. It is sort of like the Indians at the Best Western in Taos doing native dances every night at 8pm for the tourists and then passing the hat. Anyway, doesn't matter. The most important thing we learned from last night is that lip augmentation does not make one more attractive. We also learned there is such a thing as too much lip gloss.
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Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:21 am
I think she asked "Can we eat the chicken?" To which he said no. Semantics aside, we all know what he meant--that the chicken was not to be eaten.
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Ginger1218
Member
08-31-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:43 am
I was glad that I didn't have to hear the usual crap about voting for the player who played the game the best. Bottom line, this is about betrayal and sometimes your betrayals come back and bite you in the butt. So, I was glad Danni won. Rafe was annoying at the end, Stephanie was totally manipulative, I think she thought Lydia was her gofer. So, I think Danni deserved to win.
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Denecee
Member
09-05-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:49 am
I think Stephanie played a great game. The odds were stacked against her from the beginning and I don't think she did anymore backstabbing than any of the others in her alliance did or would have done had they been the one to make as far as she did. She was the fall guy, lucky for Dani. I don't think badly of any of them for eating the chicken I just don't see how they could because I wouldn't have ate that chicken.
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Mameblanche
Member
04-13-2005
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 11:53 am
It wouldn't matter if the 'Mayans' were from rent-a-local-Mayan-actor. This was a replication of an actual religeious ceremony recreated by actual Mayans. And it was the HEIGHT of disrespect to even contemplate eating the chicken. These <55> (the 3 women) were guests in this country, and should have felt honoured (Okay, I would have been visibly gagging seeing the 'sacrifice' of that poor bird. BUT that's my gut reaction to any violent act.) But since it was a religious ritual, the chicken was a gift to their Gods. I agree if this had been in the early days before all the food-reward challenges, and they were sick with hunger, even Rafe would have had the good sense to eat to stay alive. Which is always forgiveable in my book. But since there was no urgency, the whole thing smacked of an attitude of 'arrogant cultural superiority'.
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Adven
Member
02-06-2001
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 12:30 pm
Sorry, I'm with HRH. Once the ceremony was over, the chicken was no longer a part of the ceremony, but merely a cooked bird. They intended no disrespect. They were hungry. Steph's request came while the ceremony was in progress. There was no indication that the chicken would be off-limits once the ceremony concluded. In fact, the Mayans left knowing the chicken was edible and Steph wanted to eat it. They hardly seemed concerned by the prospect. It strikes me that people are taking offense when none was intended and none was taken that we could see. If the ancient Mayans were to be upset about something, I would think it would be having a reality TV show filmed in and around their religously significant and possibly sacred pyramids, not a cooked chicken. I
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Native_texan
Member
08-24-2004
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 12:34 pm
We don't know if any offense was take by the Mayans, but if the women had not thought they were doing anything wrong, why did they act like kids with their hands caught in the cookie jar at TC and felt they needed to confess to what they had done.
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Allietex
Member
08-16-2002
| Monday, December 12, 2005 - 12:42 pm
I agree that they meant no disrespect. To me that is even worse, that they did not even realize what they were doing was disrespectful. Rafe certainly did. And apparently it occured to them at some time because they kept talking about it.
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