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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:13 pm
I said this before, Auntiemike, but I think they all deserve each other. No one is smelling like a rose, not even Dawn.
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Auntiemike
Member
09-17-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:14 pm
LOL, right you are GAL. That I can totally agree on!!!!
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Mameblanche
Member
08-24-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:29 pm
Kar & Gumby are absolutely correct, I was referring to the other players on the show when I used the word 'sophomoric'. Sorry for any confusion or misunderstanding!
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Holly
Member
07-21-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:38 pm
GAL, you asked the question 'Why the sympathy for a grown human being, etc....?' I think it's a common dynamic you see all the time around people who play the victim such as Cochrane does. There are always those who rush to the defense of these 'poor bullied victims', and I would bet you anything the 'victim' is secretly smiling to him/herself, laughing at their defenders, yet at the same time enjoying the attention they're getting which they crave. Has anyone heard Cochrane say one good word about the the people in the tribe who rushed to his defense a couple of weeks ago? The sarcastic, passive-agressive style remarks he made about them during his on-camera interviews convince me he really has disdain for them for falling for his 'game'. I think he's a text book case of the inferiority/superiority complex--always feeling (intellectually) superior to those around him, yet at the same time feeling inferior, probably based on his child-like physique and general lack of physical attractiveness. And that's my armchair psychology over for the day. Ta-ta ;)
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:41 pm
GAL, I have some sympathy for anyone who is treated badly. No one, at least not at this level, deserves that. I have some sympathy for those who were disappointed at not getting further in the game as well. But really, there's no reason to treat him badly, and not just about his game move - they treated him badly all along, because he was different. That's just wrong, IMO. The point of the game is to outplay. If each of the miserable losers had an opportunity to screw others to get ahead, they'd have done it too. That's what is often hypocritical about this game, it's okay if you screw someone else over (in your own mind), but they get wildly pissed if they get screwed over. And not just this season, it happens all the time. I have little sympathy for that.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 3:57 pm
I think it's the lack of self-awareness of the 'cool' kids that bothers me the most. I don't really even they they see why Cochran would jump. I don't think they see that they treated him badly over and over IN the game. IT doesn't surprise me that the did at Ponderosa because they'd treated him badly all along! (Now it does surprise me that Dawn snubbed him at Ponderosa.) And well-fed Jim calling him a coward. Well, I hope Probst addresses that one at the finale. Coward to roll the dice? Not in my eyes.
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 4:24 pm
Why should "the cool kids" be more self-aware of why Cochran jumped than he is that they are mad? Even Cochran seems to realize that he owes them a grovelling, which he does. He used their behavior to justify doing what he wanted to do all along, which is use them to get further in the game and then do what he thought he had to do to get even further. Coach helped him along radically to reach his decision. Why not anger for the tribe that he helped get to the money and then thanked him by showing him the door, not even a howdy-do or a reach-around on his way out? And they did the same thing to Edna, Coach being the most heinous example. He was so "grateful" when she showed him a bit of human kindness at the beginning, and then shut the door in her face and voted her out at the first convenient opportunity, even though he had two means to save her. It's only been a couple of days in the game for them, as I stated in another thread I think, even though we're seeing it play out over weeks and weeks. I'm guessing many of them will come through with largesse very shortly. We're expecting a bit too much of our humans, I think. I'd be hellapissed if I were those other tribemates, although I wouldn't have found it so easy to be unkind to another human being. Just about everyone in the game has admitted that Cochran wore them down, though. From past experiences with his type in law school, I'm pretty sure that I would have been short with him at times also. I'll watch future seasons of Survivor and I'm sure I will dislike the new and improved Cochran as much then as I do now.
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Spear
Member
08-06-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 4:52 pm
His decisions to divorce himself from his other tribe members is pretty clear in the clips. In one, all the other members are sitting at the table eating and he chooses to sit away from them. Which clip is that? In Part 1, when Cochran eats, I thought he sat down before the others but it's really hard to tell.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 4:53 pm
Oh, I don't care that they are mad at him for flipping, except that for the fact that if any one of them had thought that dumping their own tribe would have worked for *them* they would have done it too. It's just that they treated him very poorly from the very beginning, and then seem shocked that after treating him like dirt, that he would betray them. That's the hypocrisy of their anger. It's not expecting too much (I think) that people recognize if you treat someone badly, you ought not expect their loyalty! I've always more admired the ones that take it on the chin, and then say "well-played". I don't like Ozzie much, but he does seem to 'get the game' that way. Maybe the diff is that Cochran is a student of Survivor, and had no preconceived notions that people would stick to their word. Yeah, he felt pissed at the other tribe, but he also gets over it more quickly. That's the difference. He also 'gets the game.'
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Auntiemike
Member
09-17-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 5:14 pm
Very nicely put Karuuna. Thanks.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 5:25 pm
Yes Karuuna. Exactly. Cochran *is* aware that they are mad. He tried to make nice, spoke to each one. Out of everyone at Pondersa now, I'd say he's one of the most self aware. Jim and the love birds are clueless! LOL!
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Countrydaze
Member
11-07-2003
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 5:59 pm
If I recall correctly in the past, when a person was sent to the ponderosa the game for them is over. The game isn't about making nice with everyone, it is about winning. Once at the ponderosa they all have gotten along, if I am not mistaken. I can't believe how the "cool kids" are acting. Especially after the crappy way they treated Cochran, and they are so shocked that he would dare to turn on them. In my book they are not the "cool kids" at all they are just jerks. I am not a Cochran fan by any means, but there is no excuse to treat any one the shabby way they treated him.
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Mamabatsy
Member
08-05-2005
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 6:08 pm
ITA Karuuna. You said it much better than I could.
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Egbok
Member
07-13-2000
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 6:14 pm
What I find interesting is all the discussion our wonderful and diverse TVCH group has going on here. This is why I expect to see Cochran back on a future Survivor season, he brings out the best in all of us!! . . . and even after washing out my mouth and going to confession as suggested by my TVCH friend, the lovely GAL, I am still a Cochran fan.
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Brenda1966
Member
07-02-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 6:19 pm
LOL Egbok. I refuse to wash my mouth out and the trauma of confession -- I will never repeat that willingly! But I'm totally on board: Cochran for the next Survivor All Stars!
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 6:59 pm
Let's see - Cochran's tribe doesn't like him, don't act like they do, but they keep him in the game he loves despite his best efforts to be evicted. Coach's tribe pretends to like Cochran, use him to their own means, then humiliate him by throwing him away like a piece of used toilet paper. So this guy doesn't just have to go back to school and deal with the fact that he lost the game and people didn't really like him, he has to explain to a bunch of fellow egg-heads why he was stupid enough to get sucked in to Coach's web. And then expect clients to hire him despite his inability to think his way through Coach's ridiculous and transparently self-serving logic. I'm thinking there are bigger villains here than the rightly upset Ponderosa crew. And being the huge fan of the game that he is, Cochran should have known better. Eggie, you will be cured of your Cochran love the next time around, I am sure of it.
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Tntitanfan
Member
08-03-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:07 pm
Certainlly NOT for ALL STARS! Maybe they could have a new version called "VICTIMS" and "VILLIANS?"
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:13 pm
I'm saying no to "Victims and Villains" even though it's an awesome concept TNT - it would mean that we would have to suffer one or several of the Hantz's again, and I simply will not go there. I could take Cochran again if I had to, but not a Hantz.
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Tntitanfan
Member
08-03-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:15 pm
Oh, but GAL! Coach would have to come back as a VICTIM this time since he has had all the other roles. Glad you like the concept -
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:28 pm
No Coach. No Hantz. Speaking for myself, I've had enough of them. And I didn't need to see Coach's brother, either - I remember reading his blog after Coach's first season and he has the same grandiose, delusional, self-laudatory thinking that Coach has. They both live in a hallucinatory Ren-Fair, and we're all just their imaginary serfs. Maybe worse than that, we might just be particles in a microscopic world that exists in one of their nose-hairs as far as they're concerned. Blecha. OK, Coach puts on like he has all kinds of regard for the people around him, but I don't see where he holds anyone in anywhere near as high a regard as he holds himself. I actually feel sympathy for Coach in a way that I don't feel for Cochran, because Coach and his brother seem to have developed the need to congratulate themselves out loud in response to the fact that no one else sees them as special. Maybe if they say it loud enough and often enough other people will find them special, too. This is my armchair psychological quarterbacking for the day.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:41 pm
If you read Cochran's interview, Coach did promise him a final four deal. As far as he knew, he was number 6 in his tribe, that is if he didn't draw a rock to send him out on the tie vote. Yeah, both tribes used him. At least one tribe was civil to him while using him... LOL And given that, I think he did the best he could under the circumstances. I don't think he was foolish at all.
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Countrydaze
Member
11-07-2003
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 7:50 pm
What I think, and I may very well be wrong is we can all say how can Cochran be such a big fan of the show and actually believe what they tell him, and I am guilty of that as well, but when a person is in that position I am sure it is so different. I am the number one armchair critic but maybe if I were there and dirty and hungry, I would hope that I could believe what they are telling me. Who knows......not me because I could never do that show I just like to watch it.
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 8:04 pm
True enough, Countrydaze - but they were all dirty and hungry and possibly acting against their ordinary characters. Meh, they all suck to some degree or another I'm not defending any of them anymore LOL. But as long as they all agree to continue sucking on televison, I'll keep tuning in. Unless it involves a Hantz. I've even grown to dislike Probst because he's such a big fan of the Hantz's. I only like to have my peace of mind disturbed so much, and they cross the line. I can't even name anyone I'd like to win this game, I thought I would favor Sophie but the sound bites they've shown of her are all over the board and I can't figure out who the girl is or what she stands for. I think she's going to win, though, she doesn't seem to have gone out of her way to be disliked by anyone on the jury. Which in and of itself is great game play with this particular bunch. She's played an excellent "under the radar" game.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-30-2000
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 8:04 pm
I understand the issue about believing them (final four), but he had no more reason to trust his own tribe, and fully believed that he would be sixth man out there. So, do you go with the people that you don't trust, and who have treated you badly and threatened to vote you out almost every single tribal council and promise you sixth and maybe draw the wrong rock? Or do you go with the tribe that you don't know, and don't trust but are treating you well and promise you fourth? There's no real good way to decide, is there?
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Cinnamongirl
Member
01-10-2001
| Thursday, December 08, 2011 - 8:27 pm
kinda like being between a rock and a hard place.
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