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Reenie
Member
06-24-2006
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 7:28 pm
I never watched the Kate and Jon show. But I did watch her on DWTS. She just didn't come across as "likable". She seemed delusional about her "fame" and thought she was always right. I just wish the best for all those children. JMHO
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Lurknomore
Member
07-07-2001
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 7:46 pm
Reenie, all I'll say is I personally feel she was FAR nicer than usual on DWTS. I shall leave it at that. Off to find some duct tape for my fingers-- they aren't happy with my self-control right now lol.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 7:48 pm
I thought Jon would be surfacing by now. The other day I was looking at Twitter, which I tend to forget about and then when I do look, I always get spoiled on some show or sporting event that I'd planned to watch, so I stop looking at Twitter. But I've been looking at tweets and pruming back on the number of people I follow since some people just tweet about stuff I'm not interested in. And suddenly there were four tweets from Hailey.. heck I'd forgotten I even followed her! And these were four tweets referring to the time when Jon tried to say she had trashed the apartment and stolen stuff and when his now ex attorney had announced that Hailey needed to be locked up for her actions.. and Hailey was really (and quite incoherently) slamming Jon.. so I wondered if he had started talking again to the paps, but cannot say I've seen anything online on front pages lately. I don't see Kate as miserable and Jon seems to cycle between depressive misery and misguided manic episodes.. sort of out of control and then trying to backpedal. Last thing I saw was backpedalling on TLC and wanting to work with them, after he disavowed his attorney. Ah I see a post about the tweets.. and now Hailey's tweets make more sense (though still very badly written). == As for nannies, I would assume Kate is employing young women to be nannies, not bimbos and probably not sleeping with said nannies. The one young woman Jon famously slept with and claimed was a nanny was also a bartender and aspiring centerfold. And so far those he has dated haven't appeared to be interested in settling down with 8 kids but involved in partying with and without Jon. And since those activities are highly publicized, the kids will end up being aware, especially anyone he brings to the home, as he did with the bartender.
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Reenie
Member
06-24-2006
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 8:08 pm
Lurk...LOL...looking for some duct tape for you! smiles
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Brenda1966
Member
07-03-2002
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 8:23 pm
I didn't mean that the nannies were bimbos, but can see how my post could be read that way. I think, based on Kate's history of not being able to sustain relationships, that she probably goes through nannies quickly. Heck, just the nature of that job (often college aged gals) means they are usually temporary for the job. I just don't think Jon having a lady friend (bimbo) is so much more damaging than having nannies, who provide care and bonding, come and go from the kids lives regularly. It's really hard for most kids to transition to new care givers. I know from watching DD when she'd get a new teacher at school. LOL Lurk!
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Friday, June 04, 2010 - 8:37 pm
The difference between Jon's revolving girlfriends and the nannies, is that the girlfriends take Jon's time and attention away from the children; and can be seen as a betrayal to their mother, especially so early after the split. And mom has to explain some difficult things, like sleeping arrangements between non-married adults, which tends to oversexualize children at a very early age. So, yes, having seen this thing with so many of my young clients and the pain it caused them, I see it as far more damaging than new nannies. And as far as I know, we don't have evidence of new nannies, so that is speculation. While we do have evidence of all the other issues with Jon's friends that I have brought up. So, at least to me, it is an issue with more grave consequences.
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Kathyb
Member
05-17-2006
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 6:06 am
I don't understand why Jon isn't being charged with filing a false police report. That's a fairly serious offense. And: On December 16, 2009, Jon texted, “Leave the key on the counter. Not kidding. I told u if u choose them our friendship is over. Your choice. That’s not manipulation, that’s your choice.” I wonder who "them" is? Her parents?
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Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 6:36 am
How do we know that there are sleeping arrangements between non married adults that the kids would see?
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Texannie
Member
07-16-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 7:00 am
Again, do we know she has had a series of nannies?
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:05 am
Julieboo, because his girlfriend is sleeping over when the kids are with Jon at his apartment.
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Ophiliasgrandma
Member
09-04-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:17 am
Where is Jon living now?
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Lurknomore
Member
07-07-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:18 am
Kar, I know both Jon and Kate said they were going to do that nest thing where the kids always stay at the family home and whichever parent has time with them goes and stays at the home. And we've seen both of them coming and going with luggage. So I don't understand why the kids would ever be with him at his apartment?
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:24 am
Lurk, according to the reports, he and Ellen picked up at the kids from the bus, spent time at his apartment and pool (doesn't specify how much time), before they ALL headed home together for the weekend. Turns out home was the family home (which I misunderstood). But yes, they spent time at the apartment, and then they ALL went home together, apparently the family home. And Kate said on the Today show (by the way), during her interview with Meredith, "they are spending time with Jon at his apartment right now", earlier this week. So, yes, they spend time at his apartment. Verified by photos, and by Kate during her tv interview.
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Ophiliasgrandma
Member
09-04-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:31 am
Exactly who is Jon's flavor of the day now?
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:32 am
Ellen Ross. Another 20-something, actress-wannabe.
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Lurknomore
Member
07-07-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:35 am
LOL well truth be told I take what BOTH of them say with a large grain of salt...like a shaker full. Beyond that, I figure I'm not there, I don't know how it's being handled with the kids. So I personally don't feel it's right to pass judgment. On the surface I wouldn't know how to begin to judge one parent who is having a 2nd childhood, and another one who mistakes hired staff for family and friends, and seems to want to be sure everyone including her kids see her as a victim. I hope it's not as bad as it sounds from both sides truthfully, as the only Gosselin's I honestly care about (or have any real interest in) are the kids!! Glad to hear I was right about the nesting thing, as I think that is in the best interest of the kids.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 9:59 am
I think Kate has generally been more forthcoming than Jon, who is now known for setting up a former girlfriend to look like she raided his apartment. To me, that is far more unsavory than Kate's personality issues. I have no problems passing judgment on Jon's revolving door of girlfriends, and now yet again, introducing a new one (after only a month of dating) to his kids. His acting is totally inappropriate and harmful to the children. Everyone who is lucky enough to have hired staff does well to treat them as family and friends, IMO. It's a much better relationship that way.
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Texannie
Member
07-16-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 10:15 am
I guess it boils down to personality versus actions. At the risk of sounding like a spoiled little rich girl, my parents had people who worked for them that all of us considered family. Three of them came back for my mother's funeral and even held me while I cried. My father and I gave the eulogies at another's, and I read a letter that my brother wrote because he couldn't be there. Yes, they were paid to 'be a part of our family', but that was over 30 years ago. If they weren't family they would not have felt the need to continue a relationship.
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Ophiliasgrandma
Member
09-04-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 10:26 am
This is a take on the family from a child specialist on ET: http://www.etonline.com/news/2010/06/87933/index.html
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Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 10:56 am
I don't really worry all too much about these kids. There are a whole lot of kids out there who are way worse off, with way worse parents. What gets me is the attitude Kate has regarding how putting them back on TV will be so good for them and return them to a sense of normalcy... And how excited they and she was to see the camera crew (not to be confused with hired help).
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Lurknomore
Member
07-07-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 11:30 am
Personally I think there is ample blame to go around between Jon and Kate, and what a sad competition it has degraded to. While I most certainly feel there is no excuse for the incredibly poor life choices Jon has made in the last few years, to me his saving grace is that he has always impressed me with his parenting skills and love of his kids. And while none of us have any clue what is going on now, in the past Jon never brought the kids into arguments with Kate. Conversely she often did, and from how she has spoken in the media, it seems to have gotten worse not better. All that said, and as I'm pretty sure I've mentioned awhile back, 2 wrongs have never made a right, and for me it's not going to start now lol. I think BOTH Jon and Kate need to shape up for their kids. And Tex, I think the situation of having 1 or 2 regular people who worked with your family and became close is natural. I just don't see this TLC CREW of people in the same way. And what concerns me is how Kate has had fallings out with each and every single person, both family and friends, that we have come to know, by HER, as her "nearest and dearest" over the years. And it's that combination of the two, with the TLC crew now replacing ALL of her family and friends, that has my warning bells going off in overdrive. Lastly, I try to look at what we've been able to observe first hand and put more stock in that. I guess I'm far too jaded after years of working with the press and knowing how easily stories can be spun. Many of my issues with Kate is that even with the TLC press machine spinning in overdrive, she still can't seem to come across well. Her fighting on National TV with one of the kindest dance instructors on DWTS spoke volumes to me. But again, that doesn't make Jon's behaviors better. What frustrates me is that it seems like folks have to be on Team Kate or Team Jon. Not me! I'm on Team Those Poor Kids!!! Julie I hope you are right, but I've seen first hand kids who were parented better (but still not well IMHO) that have grown up with MAJOR issues. This is one case I pray I'm wrong about btw! And with this looong post, I'm going to try to leave Jon and Kate behind me. I reserve the right to change my mind, but as of right now I'm sick up to my eyeballs with BOTH of them. And heck, if I'm not enjoying them, why put so much energy in em eh?! So have fun. Here's hoping I can learn to ignore both of them, and maybe just peek in on the kids from time to time.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 11:51 am
in the past Jon never brought the kids into arguments with Kate That went out the window when he filed for full custody, but didn't really mean it. That's bringing the kids "into it" in a big, and very damaging way. I"m sorry, I get that Kate has her faults. She's uptight, rigid, and controlling. But these things are a mile away from the way Jon is behaving with his young lady friends, frivolous court battles, and *LYING* to the police and making a false accusation against a previous girlfriend. These behaviors are atrocious and far more damaging to the children, IMO, than anything that Kate has done so far.
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Texannie
Member
07-16-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 12:18 pm
The crew is a grand total of 3 maybe 4 people. The camera man has been with them since the very first documentary. I could see how they would bond with one another.
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Lurknomore
Member
07-07-2001
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 12:24 pm
Ok maybe just one whittle more comment, then I'm off to start a thread about a show I've really enjoyed. This is why I feel we can all go round and round. How sad to try to figure out which of IMHO are two horrid parents BOTH setting horrible examples should we support? BLECH gives me a bad taste in my mouth. I think they are BOTH teaching those precious kids just horrible lessons. But to my eyes Kate, who from day one has encouraged them to disrespect their Father and has always undermined his authority and berated him to his kids even in good times, well that turned me off long before he fell down to her level. Sure, he's lost his mind. I don't argue that at all. I do question if all we are reading is true. I'm a holdout in the accepting TMZ type news outlets as being the Walter Cronkite of today. In other words I don't trust them. I think if Jon did what is said he would and SHOULD have been arrested. I think there is some truth and some spin most likely. Otherwise there's no reason he's not in handcuffs today. So sorry, I don't and won't think either is right. They are both behaving badly, and the kids are exposed to simply awful impressions of what marriage and relationships are about. Not the least of which was that sham Hawaiian marriage. Tell me how 2 parents can stand before their kids, explain to them they will ALWAYS be a family, and they will work things out while KNOWING the marriage is a sham in in shreds?? Ample atrocious behavior that has LONG been going around, and now is like a runaway train. They both need to get off TV, stop giving interviews, and refocus on the kids first IMHO. Nope, two wrongs still aren't going to make a right in my eyes. I just can't get to that. Ok, off to try to cleanse my mind of the J & K names lol PS Not so sure that's the crew size, as we've often seen more than that. Plus they seem to add extra Nannies and Chefs when they are filming. I'd say it adds up. And if they are indeed now real life friends, why were they totally gone when not working?? Shouldn't they have stayed in touch etc, if they are indeed real friends not just crew?
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Brenda1966
Member
07-03-2002
| Saturday, June 05, 2010 - 12:25 pm
Legal custody papers and lawyering isn't the same as bringing kids into the middle of an arugment you are having in the kitchen. I don't think my assumption that nannies come and go is any less valid than an assumption that Jon is having sleepovers in front of the kids. So, they all went back to the house together. We don't know if she left later, after midnight. If she slept in the spare room. We don't know any of it. Nearly 90% of what we discuss here is speculation and assumption. And yes, two wrongs don't make a right. The more Jon does "wrong" thing, it doesn't make Kate's wrongs any less evident or wrong. From the TV footage we have seen, I'd still rank him as the better parent easily.
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