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Archive through March 15, 2005

The TVClubHouse: Other Reality Shows ARCHIVES: Archives for 2005-3: The Contender (ARCHIVES): Archive through March 15, 2005 users admin

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Curlyq
Member

07-10-2002

Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 9:25 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I watched this for the first time tonight. It was more compelling than I expected, not being a boxing fan. I was just disturbed by the way they made the children, even the toddlers, sit ringside and watch their fathers get beaten up. The sight of that little girl with her hands over her mouth... I think there ought to be a minimum age requirement for watching a live boxing match. If they did away with that one thing I can see myself getting hooked on the show.

Max
Member

08-12-2000

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 1:20 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I agree, Curlyq. I really like the show with the exception of two things:

1. They project who will be going home. Both in the first episode and tonight, the fighter whose family the spent the most time showcasing went home. I understand that they can't show us the back story for all the fighters on every episode due to time constraints, but geez. They've certainly had enough time to edit it better than this. If they keep this up, then there won't be a whole lot of point to watch the fight to see who loses.

2. Small children should NOT be sitting ringside watching daddy get beat up/beat up someone else. It's just not healthy for a two-year-old to see that; they simply cannot understand what is going on. It's disturbing to see those kids watching their dads like that while the crowd yells for their favorite to beat the crap out of the opponent. Jesse's little girl probably thought she was getting all dressed up to go to a party of some sort and instead ended up ringside at the fight watching daddy trade punches with another guy. Just not a great parenting move, IMHO.

I do like the fights and wish they would show the entire five rounds, though. These guys all have good skills and seem fairly well matched.

Ishe acted like a jerk tonight. Ahmed needs to learn to control his emotions (and I don't think he really heard Sly Stallone's advice at all) and not let trash talk get under his skin like that, but Ishe came off in the end like someone who is all talk and no action as well as being totally self-centered. I hope we get to see the two of them in the ring soon or it's going to get really tiring watching them bark at each other like a couple of rutting wildebeasts.

Julieboo
Member

02-05-2002

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 6:47 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Well I may be in the minority, but I think this show stinks. Boring. Usually I love any reality show-even the Complex or Meet my Dad....

And it seems they use the kids gratuitously. I think it is crazy to let such little kids watch their dad not only get beat up, but see him beat someone else up. What exactly does that teach them?

And the boxers always say, I am doing it for my kids. I don't buy that at all. They are doing it for themselves. Maybe their inspiration to win is for their kids, but boxing in general is for themselves. I am sure they are all capable of earing money in many other ways (for their kids.)

Legalboxer
Member

11-17-2003

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 8:14 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I have to disagree with the notion that they are capable of earning money in other ways for their kids and that "boxing in general is for themselves".

There are two angles to the money issue in my mind that people have to think about. One is that I see this as any other sport and that many people who box see it as "a way out" just like playing basketball or football is a way out of the life they grew up in. Some may come from decent families but realistically - most people who box come from the inner city, from lower income families, and they see this as THEIR skill and their opportunity to get out of that life, to be able to give more to their family and kids if they can get to a level that pays - just like all the kids that dream of going to the NBA or even just dream of getting a basketball scholarship. I don’t want to bring fiction into this, but Maggie in Million Dollar Baby was exactly on target when she said and felt that boxing was her only way out - her only road to success - and the fact that these people are able to look for success instead of just staying in the life they came from is something great in itself.

The other thing is money is - yes they could be working at a minimum wage job somewhere but it wouldn’t be paying what boxing is capable of - and even though I may have been brought up to assume I would go to college, I also realize the majority of people don’t have that upbringing and so they don’t have the educational background to get the jobs that would provide for their family in the way they want - as smart and capable as they may be, book-smart education just wasn’t a thought to them and so this is their skill and their profession.

The other thing - with the idea that boxing in general is for themselves - but I just wonder, cant you say that about any profession that someone pursues - they pursue it because its who they are and what they are capable of succeeding at - like being a chef, like going into politics, like being a doctor or a lawyer or teacher - (at least the people who pursue it because its what they truly enjoy) - but they are not only thinking of themselves in that pursuit necessary - because they want to succeed for their family, in whatever they pursue - they want their parent, spouses kids, etc to be proud of them - as we all want in life - and they want to be able to give more to their kids then they had growing up - don’t we all want that? At least in my mind, there are thousands of people who box for themselves - in the corners of gyms, in their basements - wherever they can find a bag or a sparring partner - but with no thoughts of turning professional or moving to the next level - those are the instances where its boxing for yourself (and I admit to being one of those people) but I don’t think there is a lot more to it for those people decide to move to the next level and actually become boxers - as with these "contenders". -

Two last thoughts - I know this is a place to speculate about the show - but in my mind, I don’t question what people say unless there is a reason to doubt them - so if they say they are doing this for their kids, I believe that. I don’t want to get into the kid thing being at a fight but I personally would want to see what the fighters wanted before judging whether their kids should be there – I understand how this seems like the producers are using the kids and I understand how it COULD be VERY damaging for the kids – but I also have this thing about respecting kids as humans and not just a kids – and I always want to be honest with kids at any age – and so IF those parents explain what their daddy is doing and they grow up understanding the difference in fighting in a ring and fighting outside of the ring – etc – then I think its ok – granted its likely they don’t explain all of that and the kids may not be as mature as some can be – and we don’t know if the parents bring the kids to fights before or if it is just for the TV, but I don’t want to judge them until I know what is going on – it’s the same as explaining why daddy is a cop or in the military or even playing football (and getting tackled all the time) etc – its just my belief that if you teach kids and respect them from the beginning then it wont be as damaging as if you never talk to them – and so if they grow up exposed to this, they will have a better understanding for everything. But if you don’t have all those safeguards in place then YES it is so wrong to just throw the kids into that situation.

And lastly - the difference in simply boxing versus being a boxer reminds me of the classic brando line - ‘I could a been somebody, I could a been a contender, I’m not a bum!"

They are all contenders - who have already spent years trying to succeed at their dream - and this show was a way to get to that dream.


Max
Member

08-12-2000

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 8:26 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
On the kids issue, Jesse did say last night that while his son had seen him box before, his daughter never had and he seemed kind of unsure about wanting her to see it, worried about how she would take it. That leads me to believe that the producers at least encouraged them to have both kids there and he had some second thoughts about it.

The promos for the show stress that this is not just about boxing, it's about families. The way the camera makes sure to focus in on the kids, especially when they are either looking very excited or upset, combined with the stated intent of focusing on family impacts and the statement from Jesse about his daughter having never seen him fight before (and his seeming hesitation to want that) makes me think that the kid angle is being played up for dramatic purposes.

Of course, that also makes me wonder if the shots of the little girl with her hands over her mouth were really shots taken when she yawned or something instead of showing her truly being upset. I wouldn't put it past editors to do just that so they could establish the level of drama they are seeking. :-)

Still, I don't think little kids like that darling little girl (who appeared to be around 2) should be ringside at a fight, especially when daddy is one of the contenders. I would think a better way to introduce a child of that age to the sport would be to watch some videos of a sparring match with her and explain it that way while she's cuddled in daddy's arms or something. But then, I'm not a parent, so. . . :-)

And I agree with all you said about motivations in pursuing the dream and boxing as a ticket out of whatever economic situation they're in, Legal.

Legalboxer
Member

11-17-2003

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 8:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
thanks max - i didnt get to entire show last night so i missed jesse's comments - definietly does appear to be producer encouraged from that angle. I would hope the producers will respect anyone who said no to having their kids there but maybe they all signed some release before coming to the show...

and i agree that a sparring video would be much better as an initial lesson of what daddy does for a living.

Makays
Member

07-12-2001

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:37 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I do like this show quite a bit.

Two weeks in a row the underdog won. WOW! I wonder if this is going to be the going theme?
I do like to see the underdog win.

But in the real world the odds are stacked against them.

Jimmer
Member

08-30-2000

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:54 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I wish I could watch this show but I can’t bring myself to. I do enjoy a good boxing match, I like Sylvester Stallone and Sugar Ray and the little I’ve seen of the show gives me the impression that is a good quality production.

Maybe I’m a wimp or too sentimental, but I can’t stand to watch some nice guy with loving kids etc., get beat up in the ring. Sure I know most boxers have kids but you don’t normally know their entire background story when you watch a fight.

As far as having kids watch the matches, I recall a documentary on wrestling where the kids were traumatised watching their Dads – even though they knew that it was fake and all an act. It’s just hard to watch.

Ladytex
Member

09-27-2001

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 12:49 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
There's a really decent article on the show here.

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 2:13 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
OH MY GOSH!! You guys crack me UP!!
watching them bark at each other like a couple of rutting wildebeasts

Curlyq
Member

07-10-2002

Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 1:07 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
When they showed the previews of the next episode last night, I froze the picture and it appeared that the West fighter had a beard like Ishe and the East fighter just might've been Ahmed. It was hard to tell because all you could see was the lower half of his face. Maybe they'll finally get it over with. Can anyone tell me what exactly happened to make these two hate each other so much?

Carlito
Member

03-26-2004

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 7:04 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Tonites fight Ishe Smith vs Ahmed was incredible. Ishe won a unanimous decision in 5 rounds. He showed a lot of heart and determination in overcoming his fears. Great support from his wife .It was beautiful to watch.I am so glad he finally fought and beat Ahmed. Fight had some drama and moments where it show ed their mutual dislike for each other. I couldnt stand Ahmed's arrogance and disrespect. Glad he was beaten and had the smirk knocked off his face tonite. Good for Ishe!

Legalboxer
Member

11-17-2003

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 7:09 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
i was happy for ishe too

Ketchuplover
Member

08-30-2000

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 8:16 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Was tonight's show a rerun?

Rosie
Member

11-12-2003

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 8:18 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
sigh

Legalboxer
Member

11-17-2003

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 8:43 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
nope it was new

and sundays at 8 is its regular spot now

Ladytex
Member

09-27-2001

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 9:15 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Yay for Ishe! Does Ahmed think he's the new Ali? He is so obsessed with what he thinks is his pretty face.

Makays
Member

07-12-2001

Sunday, March 13, 2005 - 11:19 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Third show in a row that the supposedly better fighter lost.
Oh well... It seems to be the going theme...make it look like one fighter is stronger. David defeats Goliath.

Hootyhoot
Member

12-18-2001

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 6:17 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
About the scene where Ishe was expected to challenge Ahmed and instead called up another fighter and then instead of challenging him, Ishe asked him to pray for him ... that really seemed staged to me. Sometimes I think the producers don't know when to leave well enough alone.

Max
Member

08-12-2000

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 9:18 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Great fight. During the closing credits when Sly and Sugar Ray and the other trainers/judges were talking about the fight, I agree with the guy who said he thought Ahmed got hurt by those body shots. In watching the bits of the fight they let us see, he really seemed weaker after one of the initial barrages of body shots from Ishe. Uppercuts and jabs may be good crowd-pleasers, but body shots are what wear down an opponent and I think Ishe understood that where Ahmed didn't.

I wonder who leaves "unexpectedly" next week and who they'll bring back.

Oh, I was also glad to see that they didn't do the two things that bugged me before. They didn't project who leaves by showing more of his family (it would have been Ishe if that were the case) and they didn't foccus on the small kid being ringside. In fact, I didn't even notice of Ishe's son WAS ringside; it seemed like maybe he wasn't since his wife was on her feet during much of the fight instead of watching after a small child.

Hootyhoot
Member

12-18-2001

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 9:33 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I thought the scene at the clothing store where the guys each got to pick out a whole new outfit from hat to shoes was incredibly touching. Most of them had never had a suit before, let alone a suit and new shoes and shirt, tie, even a hat! I loved it.

Bonzacat
Member

07-08-2003

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 10:52 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Regarding the way the underdog seems to be winning the match, defeating the better fighter: I feel the theme of the show is "Rocky" all the way to the finals.

Ladytex
Member

09-27-2001

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 10:52 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
The first three fighters eliminated will be on Fishbowl radio show "Reality Now" Tuesday 3/15 at 1 pacific/ 4 eastern.

www.thefishbowl.com

Luvmykitties
Member

01-02-2004

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:57 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I'm not a fan of boxing, but being the reality TV junkie that I am, I had to at least check this show out. (plus, I watch NBC a lot)

I actually am liking it.
Of course it's always sad at the end when the loser walks off - especially after you got to learn a bit about him and his family. (well, wasn't so sad about Ahmed losing)
But then again, most challenge shows get me worked up.

I'm curious as to who has to leave and why. As far as who's coming back, it has to be an East coast contender, because there is no one to "bring back" from the West coast.

Do you think they'll bring back Ahmed? He is great "drama" so far.(although I find him annoying) And Stallone made it clear that he really like Ahmed. Seems like Sugar Ray did also.
Plus, maybe the East coast might want Ahmed to try to rattle the West coast team?

I'm hoping they bring back Jonathan Reid.

Sunrvrose
Member

08-13-2001

Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 12:47 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Didn't read the thread, won't ever watch the show.

I hate boxing with every fibre of my being!!