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Twiggyish
Member
08-14-2000
| Friday, July 22, 2005 - 8:12 pm
Hope it's ok to start this thread. Wanted to discuss some theories. One has to do with Snape.. Is he evil? Is there more to the story with him? What was the tie that Dumbledore had with him?
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Weinermr
Member
08-18-2001
| Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 11:49 am
I'm going to keep holding out hope that Snape will redeem himself in the end. Pollyanish of me, I know. Is Dumbledore REALLY dead? I guess we'll have to wait and see.
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Mamie316
Member
07-08-2003
| Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 12:30 pm
Weinermr, I am with you on that one! I don't care what anyone else says and they won't convince me until I read it in print in the last book! I am still holding on to Snape working for good.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 4:35 pm
I finished last night. Great book, much better than the last one. Can't wait for the final and hope it answers all questions.
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Bluejaxrock
Member
04-23-2004
| Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 8:06 pm
Weinermr, I'm glad I'm not alone in thinking Dumbledore is not dead. If he's gone, then Harry has to really step up to get Voldemort, and Harry may not do that if Dumbledore were still at Hogwarts. Loved this book, and can't wait for #7. (Well, kinda, because #7 means the story is over - wahhh!)
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Reader234
Member
08-13-2000
| Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 9:36 pm
Weinermr... I liked your thoughts on the other thread - I agree with you! *G altho I think Dumbledore will have the same fate as Gandalf, or Aslan (think Lord of the Rings/or Narnia - both I highly reccommend *G) I also believe in Dumbledore, so if he says Snape is a double agent/on their side... I'll reserve judgement, altho I think his annomsity for James is so very strong..that he uses that for Harry, which helps foster that Snape is on the Dark side... (I think I just confused myself!!) I think I need to reread the whole scene of snape and Pettigrew etc... I'm inclined that JK gave us a clue with how he is helping Lupin, what other motivation does he have? I think I saw previews of an interview with JK, she seems so peaceful... I do remember her showing the 60minute crew her notes/ outlines, and she said at that time she wrote all 7 books beginning to end in an outline, specific details in the outline, but as she writes the books, she has to add details, then go back to make sure it all congeals well, on her website she lol at the "eggs" or mistakes she makes, noting that its tough to have her works under the magnifying glass, but she stands by her original concept, and it holds true!! I highly reccommend The Lexicon Site, and JK official website, both found thru a google search btw (not listed as a fav here on my dad's computer!!)
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Kaili
Member
08-31-2000
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 5:43 am
At the start of Ch 10, when Harry goes for his lesson with Dumbledore, they're talking about how D has theories about what all happened and he says "Naturally I do, but as I have already proven to you, I make mistakes like the next man. In fact, being - forgive me - rather cleverer than most men, my mistakes tend to be correspondingly huger." I think this may have been a clue. He was a smart guy, but when he made mistakes, they were big ones. Trusting Snape was a big mistake.
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Nightcrawler
Member
02-12-2002
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 9:13 am
I just got done with the book I had it on cd. I must admit I did not see dumbledore getting killed coming I had figerd out the half blood prince long befor harry did but for snap. when snap camp to the top of the tower D looked at him and said severs PLEASE. then snap killed him was he asking for help or was he asking snap to kill him. like they might have pland if it came to some thing like this? (remember I was hearing the book not reading the book). the way D said severs PLEASE. to me was more like please do it more then help me. that makes me think that there is MUCH more to this to come. D could have called for his wound to come back to him also and did not? if you get a change to get the book on tape or cd you should . Jim Dale does a great job bringing the book to life. giving evry person the own sound. nc
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Bookworm
Member
12-18-2001
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 1:36 pm
Lots of great theories here. One thing that might tie into the 'unbreakable bond' between Snape and Dumbledore theory... Way back in the chapter with Bellatrix and Narcissa and Snape...when they were making their bond Snape's hand twitched during the third part of the promise. I thought that was significant at the time and still think it means something. Kaili, I have also had that quote running through my head. I am thinking that having evil win out that much is a horrible ending to a series that is meant for children. So that is why I am holding out on the 'Snape is on the side of good' theory. I do think Dumbledore is dead. What sold me is that his portrait magically appeared in the headmistress's office. I do think he will play a significant role in book seven, similar to the roles the past headmasters and headmistresses played in book 5. Where else would Dumbledore's protrait be hung? He was a very influential wizard and I imagine there are a few places that have his portrait hung by book 7. I think you all have figured out the RAB and the locket thing. That was really bugging me and I think what you have suggested makes a lot of sense. And another sign of an 'evil' person turning back to the good side, a nice theme for a children's book. Well I hardly meant to post that much, but once I get started... I am going to re-read the book by listening to Nightcrawler's CDs next. I am sure there will be more things that will pop out during a second read.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 1:46 pm
La di dah. Bookie I agree about Dumbledore being dead. I also think that his huge mistake is in trusting Snape. What could be huger than death? That's a big oops. I think Harry's gonna need to master that nonverbal thing for the next book especially for going up against Voldemort.
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Weinermr
Member
08-18-2001
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 5:02 pm
La la la la la But that's a big clue! They made such a point of practicing nonverbal spells that you have to wonder why Dumbledore didn't proctect himself 2,000 different ways. Dumbledore was(is) as good as or better than Voldemort at wizarding. Definitely better and smarter and wiser than Snape. He could have avoided death. He ASKED for it. If even which you are to believe he is really dead, which I don't. Maybe there is a trickier answer, but Dumbledore is either not dead, or is coming back in a form that Harry can interact with as he makes his way through Book 7. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 5:22 pm
Interesting but I disagree.
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Ladydewtel
Member
07-18-2002
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 5:55 pm
okay here goes my 2 cents worth. These are just my thoughts on some things. I had a thought tonight about Harry dying in book 7. My thought was that Harry would get his happy ending by dying and meeting up with his parents and Serius. On the Today show interview I caught JK saying that Harry was now preparing for the end and then it seemed she caught herself and said the end of the books. Could have been my imagination, but I swear thats what I heard her say. No I believe that Harry himself might indeed be a horcrux and not even know it. I dont know I could be way off base here, but that is my 2 cents.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 6:12 pm
Good point Ld.
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Kaili
Member
08-31-2000
| Monday, July 25, 2005 - 8:02 pm
Hmmmm....welll.....ummmmm.... Oaky, that was enough space I think! He's dead. He'll be in the next book I'm sure, but through his portrait. I am thinking maybe you guys are right about him asking Snape to kill him, but that line about his cleverness and his mistakes being as extreme as his cleverness is extreme sttuck with me throughout the book. Especially since he so frequently told Harry how clever he is. The other line that stuck with me and I don't know that it's significant or how, but when he was weak, Harry told him not to worry- that he'd get him back- and he told Harry he wasn't worried because he was with him. I'm guessing it was just a response to Harry always feeling safe with him and that it was mutual, but it kind of stood out to me too.
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Terolyn
Member
05-06-2004
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 5:16 am
lalallaalala but about Harry being a Horcrux. How would that have worked? The only way V could have done it was when Harry was a baby, but at the same time he was trying to kill him. It would not make sense for V to make Harry a horcrux and then try to kill him thus destroying the horcrux. And would it be possible for a living thing to be a horcrux? I would think that the person would know that something was residing in them. As for Harry preparing for the end, I do think he is. He must know that it is now do or die.
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Faerygdds
Member
08-29-2000
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 6:23 am
Totally agree... It's do or die... or worse... it's do or loved ones die! Protectfulness can be a powerful motivator! I try not to think about the possiblility of Harry dying, but I just can't fathom it. Harry may die, but he won't go down alone. I just can't see J.K. letting LV win! I think I finally figured out the smile from book 4! Remember at the end of the book. Harry is recounting is tale of LV's return. He talks about how LV took his blood and then he could touch him. D smiles something like a little triumphant smile. We all wondered about that smile. Well........... I THINK he was smiling because if his blood is now comingled with LV and that means that LV was not the only one who could touch the hocruxes -- Harry can too. What do you think?
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Terolyn
Member
05-06-2004
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 6:32 am
Yeah, but before that Harry touched, and so did other people, Tom Riddle's Diary which was the first horcrux he made (I think) Also RAB has the locket Horcrux. What was the other 6 that are know about? The locket, Diary, the small cup.... as far as I know there are 3 unknown. So that leaves 1 down and 5 to find or am I missing something.
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Kaili
Member
08-31-2000
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 6:45 am
I thought the other one was the snake?
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Tashakinz
Member
11-13-2002
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 6:58 am
If I'm not mistaken the horcruxes are/were: Tom Riddle's diary (destroyed) Slytherin's locket Malfin Gaunt's ring (destroyed) Hufflepuff's cup Nagini ??? the seventh piece is the one LV is using right now
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Terolyn
Member
05-06-2004
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 7:16 am
I forgot about the ring and Nagini. Thanks Tash. The seventh would be Lord V himself and I guess would have to be the last destroyed. I imagine Nagini would be 2nd to the last. So 2 down and 4 to go before he must face LV.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 7:21 am
Lots of good points here. Do we know who RAB is though? I've been googling but came up with nada.
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Calamity
Member
10-18-2001
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 8:08 am
Sorry, forgot the spoiler space!!! Mocha: Many of us believe R.A.B is Regulas Black, Sirius' younger brother. I have some thoughts about the other horcruxes and Dumbledore but will post those later.
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Faerygdds
Member
08-29-2000
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 12:43 pm
At the end of the book Harry lists them all in his head as: *the locket - taken by RAB - kreature may be the key to this one *the cup - Hufflepuff's cup *the snake - Nagini - This one is going to be hard *something of Griffindor's or Ravenclaw's - I will guess Griffindor for 2 reasons... 1) Salazar and Godric were good friends (would have been ironic - LV likes irony) and 2) I would think he would covet G's power more than R's Then we also have the destroyed items: *Riddle Diary - Thanks to Harry *Marvolo's Ring - Thanks to Dumbledore And of course, LV himself holds the last. - Go Harry!
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 12:46 pm
Oh oh oh thanks Calamity.
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