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Archive through June 28, 2004

The TVClubHouse: Movies & Library ARCHIVES: Movies: May 2004 - March 2005: Fahrenheit 911: Archive through June 28, 2004 users admin

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Yankee_in_ca
Member

08-01-2000

Sunday, June 27, 2004 - 4:22 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I just came back from seeing the movie.

Devastating...

I'll write more when I've gotten my head around it a bit. And yes, I cried. And I don't cry.

Gina8642
Member

06-01-2001

Sunday, June 27, 2004 - 4:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Another factoid to consider regarding troop strength. During the first Iraq war, there were approx 400,000 troops in the theatre vs. ~120,000 when this war started. And, the goal of the earlier conflict was much simpler, only to puch the invading troops out of another country. Not invade, hold, rebuild, and first deconstruct and then reconstruct a political system of a much larger country. It makes afganistan's US + Allies troop strength seem quite laughable.

BTW - I heard a story the other day the US is considering sending an additional 15,000 troops. That's on top of an increase that already happened a few months ago.

Bluebug
Member

01-05-2004

Sunday, June 27, 2004 - 5:02 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I know that a person that lives near me just arrived in iraq a couple weeks ago.

Jan
Member

08-01-2000

Sunday, June 27, 2004 - 6:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Fahrenheit 9/11' breaks records

Sunday, June 27, 2004 Posted: 2158 GMT (0558 HKT)
LOS ANGELES, California (AP) -- Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 9/11" took in a whopping $21.8 million in its first three days, becoming the first documentary ever to debut as Hollywood's top weekend film.

If Sunday's estimates hold when final numbers are released Monday, "Fahrenheit 9/11" would set a record in a single weekend as the top-grossing documentary ever outside of concert films and movies made for huge-screen IMAX theaters.

Adding the film's haul at two New York City theaters where it opened Wednesday, two days earlier than the rest of the country, boosted "Fahrenheit 9/11" to $21.96 million.

"Bowling for Columbine," Moore's 2002 Academy Award-winning documentary, previously held the documentary record with $21.6 million.

"Fahrenheit 9/11," Moore's assault on President Bush's actions after the 2001 terrorist attacks, won the top honor at last month's Cannes Film Festival and has attracted attention from both sides in the presidential campaign.

The movie has been embraced by left-wing groups, which mobilized members to see it during the opening weekend. Conservative groups sought to discourage theaters from showing it and asked the Federal Election Commission to examine its ads for potential violations of campaign-finance law regulating when commercials may feature a presidential candidate.

"I want to thank all the right-wing organizations out there who tried to stop the film, either from their harassment campaign that didn't work on the theater owners, or going to the FEC to get our ads removed from television, to all the things that have been said on television," Moore said. "It's only encouraged more people to go and see it."

The Wayans brothers' comedy "White Chicks," about two black FBI agents who go undercover as white debutantes, opened in second place with $19.6 million for the weekend. That pushed the total for "White Chicks" to $27.1 million since opening Wednesday.

The previous weekend's No. 1 movie, "Dodgeball: A True Underdog Story," slipped to third place, taking in $18.5 million and pushing its 10-day total to $67.2 million. Steven Spielberg and Tom Hanks' "The Terminal" fell from second to fourth place with $13.9 million, raising its 10-day gross to $41.8 million.

Premiering in fifth place with $13 million was the tearjerker romance "The Notebook," featuring Ryan Gosling, Rachel McAdams, James Garner and Gena Rowlands.

Despite good reviews, the family film "Two Brothers," about tiger siblings separated in youth and reunited as opponents in the ring as grown cats, opened weakly at No. 9 with $6.2 million.

"Fahrenheit 9/11" opened in 868 theaters, a wide release for a documentary but narrow compared to big Hollywood flicks. The film averaged $25,115 a theater, compared to $7,190 in 2,726 cinemas for "White Chicks."

Distributors Lions Gate and IFC Films plan to put "Fahrenheit 9/11" into a couple of hundred more theaters this Wednesday, when competition heats up with the release of "Spider-Man 2," summer's most-anticipated movie.

Lions Gate and IFC came on board after Disney refused to let subsidiary Miramax release "Fahrenheit 9/11" because of its political content. Miramax bosses Harvey and Bob Weinstein bought back the film and went looking for independent distributors.

CNN


THis means Farenheit made more in one weekend than Bowling made in it's entire run!!

Zules
Member

08-21-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 7:42 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I went to see F 9/11 Friday night. Needless to say, the showing was sold out.

I was surprised by a couple things in the movie.

First of all, the scene of Bush's limo being pelted with eggs and the huge protest that went on outside the White House when he made his first trip there as President that required him to come in the back door rather than take the traditional walk to the White House. This was news to the four of us who went. None of us could recall this being shown on the news at the time.

And this was the first time I have ever witnessed a standing ovation at the end of a movie!

I'm curious whether any conservatives here went to see it.

Otforest
Member

06-23-2004

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:17 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I just wanted to encourage everyone to go see Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 911. It was number 1 this weekend even though it was only in 1/3 the theatres as the number 2 movie. Let's keep it number 1 for as long as possible to send a message to the White House. Please, anyone who is even considering voting for Bush needs to watch this movie to learn the truth about him, his administration, his family, etc. Don't let him have another four years to do more damage then he already has.

Vee
Member

02-23-2004

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:25 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Just be aware that there are two sides to every issue and this movie has many verifiable points to be argued. Sometimes Mr. Moore plays fast and loose with the truth.

Dahli
Member

11-27-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:26 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I can't wait till this comes to Canada... anybody know when that might be? Hopefully folks who might be thinking of voting for Bush's buddy today up here will reconsider that.

Otforest
Member

06-23-2004

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:29 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Actually , Mr. Moore employed 3 fact checkers and a lawyer to make sure everything in the movie was accurate. He also stated that he is prepared to answer anyone who disputes something in his movie with proof of it's authenticity. Just because you don't like what he's saying doesn't mean it isn't the truth.

Moderator
Moderator

06-30-2002

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Some of the above posts have been moved into this thread from the General Discussions area of the board.

ModND

Otforest
Member

06-23-2004

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:38 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
That's exacting what I said. When I left the movie I said to my boyfriend, "I don't remember Bush getting pelted with eggs at his inauguration. He said "They never showed it." Seems that everything about Bush was kept secret from the public.

Texannie
Member

07-16-2001

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 8:48 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
First let me say I haven't seen the movie so I am only going on what I have read. I don't believe that anyone is disputing the fact, but that he has edited the facts in such a way to present a different message. With Bowling for Columbine for example, many of the things Charlton Heston said were edited to look like they were said in response to Columbine but actually happened at different times.


Otforest
Member

06-23-2004

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:04 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I'm curious too. Did any avid Bush supporters go see this movie? If so, did it change your mind or at least make you have second thoughts?

Azriel
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:07 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Otforest, just because you like what he is saying, doesn't mean it's the truth. Micheal Moore definitely knows how to play to the choir.



Texannie
Member

07-16-2001

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:09 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
The fact that this movie has almost taken on an evangelical zeal among it's supporters is scaring me.

Kaili
Member

08-31-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:13 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
So you see, because of his reputation, many will ignore whatever he has to say....

I haven't seen the film, or read too much about it. I haven't seen any of Moore's previous films. Still, there has to be some degree of truth. I don't know what's true and what's skewed (I don't even know what's in the movie really)- but to make a 2 hour film, you can't do that and have no truth in it.

Moondance
Member

07-30-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:23 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
<evangelical zeal>

Ok that just made me LOL! Where on earth do you see references to Christianity and God in the reviews to this movie?

I agree Kaili

Maris
Member

03-28-2002

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:25 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Everyone should zealously support the right of any filmaker for free speech. What is scary is the anti-Moore folks, trying to scare movie theatres to not show the movie, filing with the election commission to try and prevent any marketing of the film.

I will support the rights of the producers of "Michael Moore Hates America" to show their movie in any movie theatre when that film comes out in the fall.

We should all take an evangelical position when it comes to defending our basic rights to free speech. I say scream the roofs down if anyone tries to stop a filmaker from expressing himself.

Azriel
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:31 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Kaili, I'm sure there is certainly some truth to the movie, but the feeling I have is that I would no more rely on Michael Moore for my political facts than I would rely on Rush Limbaugh for my political facts. We could easily make a two hour film about any president in history and totally trash them while showing a carefully edited version of 'the truth'.

Texannie
Member

07-16-2001

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:32 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I absolutely agree that this film should be allowed to be shown. I would never in a million years try to prevent anyone from the right to free speech. I am greatly offended if anyone thinks I would. And I don't believe, I ever for one minute said that it should not be shown or even made.
I was drawing the parrell not in relation to Christianity, but in the zeal of an evangelical for proclaiming that "if you want to know the truth, if you want to see the light..you must (see this film) so you can see the error of your ways".

Azriel
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:45 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I second that Texannie. I'm certainly not saying that the film shouldn't be shown. I won't go see the film because I wouldn't want to put penny in Michael Moore's pocket and I already know what his agenda is in making the film, so I know his 'facts' are skewed so far to the left that I couldn't stomach watching it.

Tishala
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:48 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
For what it's worth, Mr. Moore has a page that responds to various claims about him distorting the facts. It's here, but it's obviously not all-encompassing because so many people, like NBC's Lisa Myers, who is famous for falsifying exploding Ford trucks on Dateline NBC, have "fact checked" Mr. Moore's film. And, indeed, many of the things in his film are opinion, i.e., he believes it was a bad idea to let the family of an international terrorist to leave the nation so quickly and without thorough vetting from the FBI after the largest foreign attack on our nation's history (he compares it to flying TImothy McVeigh's parents to France after the Oklahoma City bombing); Richard Clarke, who helped coordinate those flights, disagrees with Mr. Moore. That's OK, really, because both are simply expressing opinions.

As I have said before--and I think I made this point about The Passion of the Christ--I'm more interested in the film as a narrative medium than as a vehicle for some elusive version of "the truth."

Texannie
Member

07-16-2001

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 9:55 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Tish said "As I have said before--and I think I made this point about The Passion of the Christ--I'm more interested in the film as a narrative medium than as a vehicle for some elusive version of "the truth."

I think if more people had that viewpoint, there would be less bickering regarding the film.

Yankee_in_ca
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 10:32 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
A few things -- Regarding the protesters on Inauguration day, and the pelting of his car with eggs, etc., I DO remember that being on the news, but it was a VERY small story -- I do remember the CBC putting the numbers of protesters at tens of thousands.

And Dahli, it's playing in Canada. I went to see it yesterday.

And for those who say Michael Moore is not someone to be relied upon blindly for political facts -- duh. Michael Moore has said from the beginning that this movie is an Op-Ed piece by him about his beliefs about the war, SUPPORTED by facts that have been published by outside sources, including the 9/11 Commission.

I would support the right of anyone to say, "I disagree with Moore's opinion, after everything I have read by the 9/11 commission and other sources about the terror threat to the U.S. and the war in Iraq."

But many of the people who are slagging this movie, who will not and have not seen it, are focusing on the fact that Moore plays "loose with the facts." Well, in this case, they're not his facts. His opinion/conclusions about what those facts mean is something that are just that -- his opinion.

But for people like me, I have looked at those facts and come to similar, if not the same, conclusions. And I did that LONG before I went to see this film.

For me, the "zeal" was there before -- but when you've been force-fed half-truths and manipulations by a government for so long, it is nice to see someone brave enough to stand up and say, "Enough."

I am not blind to Michael Moore's tactics -- I completely understand that he is someone who has a strong opinion and isn't afraid to put it out there. But I also respect him for it. Someone has to do it.


Brenda1966
Member

07-03-2002

Monday, June 28, 2004 - 10:46 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I saw the film Friday mid-day in a packed, but not sold out theater. I was very saddened and moved by it. I didn't know about the egg pelting either. I also didn't know we flew Bin Laden's family out of the country until I read reviews of the film.

One theme of Moore's movie, that was also a theme of Bowling for Columbine, is how the American public is being manipulated into being fearful. First the media and now our government is using fear to rule us, to get us to agree to go to war for weapons of mass destruction that didn't even exist.

Like the old woman in the film, I feel duped! I was duped into believing we needed to invade Iraq. Why didn't we send more troops into Afghanistan to actually get Bin Laden? Is it because there isn't the oil that Iraq has?

Die hard Bush supporters won't see this film. And unless they do I don't want to hear their arguments that the film is full of lies.

It's the people who are on the fence, who are feeling disillusioned about this war that need to see this film. It's the people who aren't motivated to get out and vote that need to see this film. I'm so glad it's getting press, both good and bad. Anything to get people talking, questioning, and thinking.