Author |
Message |
Spitfire
Member
07-18-2002
| Monday, December 29, 2008 - 12:56 pm
Julie thanks for all those links, I'm slowly checking it out. I agree with your comment Jimmer. My other Canon is the A540 and I like it for the easy and compact factor. My SIL has the exact same camera and imo does not know how to take a picture with it. Not that I'm an expert of course, she just takes different shots than I do.
|
Biloxibelle
Member
12-21-2001
| Tuesday, December 30, 2008 - 1:08 pm
Wow Ny, that made a big difference on the flower. I didn't even see the gray haze until you pointed it out. Told ya I had an untrained eye.
|
Nyheat
Member
08-09-2006
| Tuesday, December 30, 2008 - 3:03 pm
That's what they pay me for at the cracker factory! 
|
Wargod
Moderator
07-16-2001
| Thursday, January 08, 2009 - 8:34 pm
Don't know if anyone can help, but thought I'd ask. Sis got a Kodak Easy Share (10.0 mega pixels) digital camera for Christmas. I got one last year, except 7.0 mega pixels, and she loved how easy it was to use. She took the memory chip (just a cheap scan disc chip) out of her old camera and put it in the new one and it worked fine. Took somewhere around 100 pics between Christmas and New Years. She'd also gotten a new kodak printer and had told me she was going to print out some pics. The other day she called me very upset, she'd taken the chipout and stuck it in the printer, printed out her pics, then when she put the chip back in the new camera and turned it on, it came up with a message that it was deleting her pics and reformatting the memory chip. She clicked cancel and shut off the computer. She was very worried she'd lost 1100 pics (they don't have a computer to dl them) but when we checked the chip on another camera, it was ok, except for the 100 or so pics she'd taken between Christmas and New Years were gone. She wasn't sure if the camera was the problem or the memory chip so I told her to bring them here and we'd check with my camera and chip. I put my chip in her new computer, took some pics and had no problem. Then put her chip in my camera and had no problems. But her chip wouldn't work in her new camera (BTW, when we dl'd her chip to our computer, all 1100 pics were there, including Christmas and New Years.) We decided it must be the chip, so she went and bought a kodak memory chip and it's worked just fine. However, I put my chip back in my camera yesterday and turned it on and now I'm getting a message saying that the camera no longer recognized my chip. Any ideas if this is a problem with the camera or chips? I was kind of wondering if the new cameras were only designed to use the kodak chips, but there's nothing in her book about it.
|
Eeyoreslament
Member
07-20-2003
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 3:12 am
Neither. Basically, some cameras, and some computers want THEIR formatting for the chip/card, and they will refuse to play nice with the chip until you agree to let it format the card. I had a laptop that had one of those 6-in-1 card reader slots, but when I stuck my card in directly from the camera, it REFUSED to read the card, and asked to format it (of course, say NO). However, when I put the camera in its nice little USB 'dock', and plugged the dock into the laptop via UBS cord, the computer saw the pictures fine. SO, what I'd suggest, is that she just try a different method of communicating what is on the card to her computer. Also, a computer won't automatically start deleting pics; there is usually a message that the person doesn't fully understand the consequences of (due to wording), and they click OK out of ignorance. The message will be something like "This card is not in the right format. Would you like the computer to change the reformat the card to work?" Of course, the user is like, "OK!" not knowing the computer is about to reformat their card, and they may not yet know that it is synonymous with "delete". Then they click OK, and the computer will probably give a warning like, "This will delete any pics on the card. Are you sure you want to continue?" To which your sis realized, and got the card out of there. Another issue, is that it sounds like she has pictures from two cameras, on the same card. This is not a big deal, but with the "reading" issues, she'll need to pull off the different cameras' pictures. Most cameras have their own folder system for when they write pictures to the card, and they don't work well with other folder systems. To explain further......my small camera shoots only JPG files, and it is a Casio. The Casio will store its pictures in a folder on the card named something like CMIG or something. Conversely, my big fancy Nikon camera takes RAW files, and it creates a folder on the card called DCIM. I can use the same card in both, but each camera is storing their files in the folder only they know how to recognize. So the little Casio only sees the CMIG folder and the JPG files in it. And then I can stick it in the big camera, and the Nikon will only look in a folder called DCIM. So these two folders are sort of running PARALELL to one another. They will never meet. The other camera cannot "see" the other camera's stuff. The reason this is important, is that your camera probably can't "see" the pics your sis took between Christmas and New Years, because they are in a folder your camera doesn't recognize as its own. It doesn't mean the pics are gone. I would wager money on them still being there, and it's just a matter of using the correct method to pull those photos off. So first, get your sister to bring her old camera's "dock" to any computer, and she really should pull those pics off. (OT - 1100 pics on a single old card? Is she taking the photos at the tiniest file size? Not good if she ever takes a pic she'd like to blow up, as the quality will be blocky if she goes bigger than a 4X6. But that's for a future conversation.) Anyways, she needs to be pulling her photos off her card because it's very risky to not have a backup of those memories. If she doesn't have a computer, I think most one-hour photo places will pull photos off the card and stick them on a CD at least, so you have them safe on a backup disk. This can also be done using a friend's computer (or yours) and the computer's CD/DVD drive, and a writeable CD or DVD. In order to do this at home, she will need a few things: First, she'll need the dock, or the USB cord that came with the FIRST camera (the one that took 1100 photos). It is through that dock or USB cord, that the computer will recognize the photos on the card without asking to reformat. Think of it like a translator, who speaks 3 different languages: camera, card, and computer. It helps them all talk to each other, without any misunderstandings. So once she has that, stick the card in the first camera, and connect that camera to the computer, either by the USB or the dock (if it came with one). Then, on the computer, you can click on my computer, and it should "see" the card as an additional drive, which you can click on, and then copy files from. Move them to the computer for backup. Second, she'll need the dock or USB from the SECOND/new camera. With THAT camera's dock/cord, the computer will be able to see the 100 holiday pics. Again, pull the pics off the camera, and on to the computer. Once all the pics are on the computer, it is safe to do whatever you want to the pics on the card, because they are in a second backup place. If you don't want them kept on the computer, just stick a CD or DVD in, and burn those photo files to the disk. Then she can take that disk home, and store it in a safe place. Now, a third way, is to buy a little "USB Card reader". Seriously, they are only about 10-20 bucks, they are like the size of a cigarette lighter, and one end holds the card, one end is a USB end that goes in the computer. The computer will read it like another drive. I prefer this method, so I don't have to fiddle with docks and cords, and it fits nicely in my camera bag. The good thing about this method, is that you can click on the drive, and you'd see BOTH folders from the different cameras. I often do this, and I'll see both the DCIM and CMIG folders, and I can pull the pics off all at once. Now, it's not a good practice to leave pics on the card, and never reformatting. Picture writing a bunch of words on a piece of paper in pencil. A couple of words are wrong, and so you erase them, but you can sometimes still see the edge of a letter here or there, that you missed erasing. Now this can happen on camera cards the same way, only it can also lead to errors in the files. Many photographers start every photoshoot with a freshly formatted card. This is a super clean slate, almost guaranteed to not give you errors. Taking a day of pictures, and then coming home and offloading them to the computer, then reformatting your card afterward is a good habit to get into. However, this is a bit difficult in your sister's case, as she doesn't have a computer. Just tell her (until she gets a computer) that she shouldn't let it get all the way to 1100 pics before she is backing those pics up somewhere. And formatting is DEFINITELY more important if a person is doing in-camera deleting of photos, as it opens up areas where file errors can happen. Just something to think about. Not as scary as it sounds, but just a good habit. In any case, hopefully I've explained everything OK, and you can help her pull all of her photos off the card. She just needs to know that she probably won't ever be able to use the card slot in that computer she was using to access her pics. She'll have to use the dock, or cord, or a USB card reader. Also, I've learned that when I stick the card in the laptop card slot (the on that wants to reformat the card), and then I LET it reformat the card into a drive it recognizes, it won't be in a format that my camera approves of. Plain and simple, they don't work together. You need a USB in-between the two, in order to do that translation. :-/ I'm not sure of the scientific reason WHY, but I think it's something to do with maybe something similar to FAT32 or NTSC formatting. I could be wrong though. Maybe Jimmer can shed some light on that side of things..... Oh, one more thing about the different cameras creating different folders. Often, cameras from the same manufacturer will have the same folder name. So if you have a baby Canon point & shoot, and you have a big fancy Canon dSLR, they will both store pictures in the DCIM folder (or whatever Canon calls it). However, just because they use the same folder, doesn't mean both cameras will show the other's pics on them. The big camera shoots JPG and RAW, whereas the baby one only shoots JPG, so, while the big camera will probably display the baby cameras JPGs because it recognizes the files, the baby camera won't show the big camera's RAW files, because it is in a format the baby camera doesn't shoot or recognize. I think I just wrote a NOVEL!!!! LOL
|
Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 7:39 am
Wow that is a great response, Eeyore. Not much I can add to that! One of the things you mentioned that I always recommend to people is to buy a card reader. Then you just plug the card reader into your USB port and Windows will install it automatically. Then take the card out of your camera and plug it into the card reader. It will just look like another hard drive and you can use your regular file explorer to copy the pictures from the card to a folder on your computers hard drive. It is much simpler and there is much less that can go wrong. Just make sure that you check all the folders on the card so you get all the images copied. With respect to the file system and formatting, different cameras use different file systems so it is always best to format the card in the camera. Of course, you only do that after the pictures are transferred to your computer and backed up to another drive or DVD. I never delete the files – I always format. Much cleaner and faster.
|
Suz
Member
10-13-2005
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 11:03 am
I love your novel Eeyore. So well explained that even I could understand it. I printed it off for future reference, hope you don't mind. I just bought a card reader for myself and my DD. She lost her cable for her camera and reader worked for her. It was cheaper than buying a new cable. Jimmer should I get her a cable or just let her use the card reader? Also does it sometimes miss some of the images on the camera? Thank you for the information about formatting instead of delete. I did not know that. Formate is a must do for me now. One more question. What is the best and safest way to format? Thank You in advance.
|
Eeyoreslament
Member
07-20-2003
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 11:26 am
I wouldn't bother with the cable. The card reader is universal. The best way to format is from WITHIN the camera. So you'd go to your camera's setup menu, and there should be a menu option that says "Format memory card". Make sure you have all of your images backed up somewhere though. No worries about printing my novel. If you get a book deal though, hook me up with a bit of a commission. :-)
|
Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 11:28 am
Always format the card in the camera in which it is going to be used. There will be an option to format. Some cameras offer the option of doing a high level or low level format. It is better to do a low level format and it only takes a few seconds more. Keep in mind though that it is very difficult (if not impossible) to retrieve old images from a formatted card so be careful to ensure that your images have transferred properly to the computer and are backed up before formatting the card. I would just let her use the card reader for transferring the files to the computer. I think it is easier. The only time she might need a cable is if she is transferring certain information from the computer to the camera. Some cameras (the Canon SLRs for example) allow you to put your name in the Owner location of the EXIF data (EXIF is file data contained within the images) but the only way to tell the camera what the owner is is to connect to the computer by cable. But you only do that if you need to change the owner name. Or you might use the cable if you are shooting tethered to a computer (but I'm sure she won't do that with her camera). I don't think it is likely that a card reader would miss transferring any images. The only thing you have to watch for is that many cameras create sub-folders and you have to make sure that you transfer the images in all of the sub-folders. Feel free to let us know if you have more questions or if something needs further explaining. ETA: I didn't see your explanation about formatting Eeyore, before posting (though we said pretty much the same thing).
|
Julieboo
Member
02-05-2002
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 11:35 am
Hey, I know there are some photography purists in our midst, but I just have to share my new favorite website with you all. And this website favors using photoshop to enhance photos. Anyways, this is the same lady who has spoonfed me recipes so I could actually cook one or two things without crockpot or microwave. She similarly explains photography. Oh it is not all about photoshop, there is plenty about metering, white balance, etc. It is definitely worth wondering about in!! Here is her main site: http://thepioneerwoman.com/ Here is a link to the photography portion of her website: http://thepioneerwoman.com/photography/ Notice on the left side several sub-menus. So much good info there!!
|
Suz
Member
10-13-2005
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 11:59 am
Thank you very much Eeyore and Jimmer. I will first put all pictures on my computer and also on a disk so they will not be lost. I so love my pictures. Then on to formatting. I looked at the site Julieboo. It's a good one.
|
Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 12:06 pm
Hey Julie, I've only just glanced at it but I like what I've seen so far. Lots of good information and a nice presentation. One thing I agree with is I simply don't understand the concept of not using PhotoShop to enhance images. As I've said before it is not cheating. It is about producing a good final product. The camera itself already enhances images if you shoot jpg. Why shouldn't the photographer do it as well. It is all the more important if you are shooting with an SLR.
|
Eeyoreslament
Member
07-20-2003
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 1:38 pm
I have no problem with the use of photoshop to enhance what is already there. It's really is only about what the photographer is trying to represent, when one should debate whether to use photoshop or not. If you have a picture of your son on his graduation day, and e cut himself shaving, I have no problem removing the evidence. I have no problem making people look better by deemphasizing wrinkles, cleaning up a few blemishes, etc. The only place I think anyone can take issue with the use of Photoshop, is when a photo is supposed to be "reality" and some of the reality in the photo is altered. And I don't think it is altering the reality to up the saturation, or contrast, or try to sharpen details. Those colors, edges, and sharpnesses were THERE, and you're just bringing them out. They don't change the "truth" of the picture. Even with film, all of those things can be fixed. My grandmother worked in a professional photo plant, and I've seen her really improve the film pictures, with all that high tech machinery. Photoshop just brought those fixes to the digital world, to match the fact that film was moving to digital. Many people are taking photos to be ARTISTIC, and ART is not supposed to be an exact copy of reality. So I'd say I am OK with large use of Photoshop in about 95% of situations. The only two places I don't like it in LARGE quantities, are in magazines where they are supposed to be showing stars, but really they take 6 inches off the waistlines, lengthen legs by six inches, etc. And I don't think it has a place in any type of photojournalism, other than for color/level enhancement.
|
Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 2:56 pm
Once again I agree. For example, if you are taking a nice picture and someone has thrown some garbage (say a paper cup) in the middle of it, there is no problem with picking the cup up and putting it the garbage. I also have no problem with someone improving the colour and appearance of an image (through sharpening, dodging and burning, etc.). I don't even have a problem with the artist/photographer making some minor changes to improve people's appearance. Where I do have a problem is when the photographer alters an image in a deliberate attempt to deceive the viewer. I especially think it is unethical for the news media to pose people or change images unless it is clear to the viewer that they have done it.
|
Juju2bigdog
Member
10-27-2000
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 8:05 pm
Excellent information and explanation, Eeyores!! A thing I learned in a cruise ship photography course - NEVER format a camera card in a computer. ONLY format the card in the camera that the card will be used in (and, of course, never end a sentence with a preposition). How to format in the camera without reading the instruction manual - Look for a Menu or Set-up button on the back or top of the camera and press it. Then look for a Tools menu (this is also where you set the time and date). The tools menu may look like a picture of a wrench. If you can find the tools menu, you can figure out how to reformat it if you are smart enough to post here. When transferring and copying photos make DOUBLE sure you look in EVERY folder before you put the card back in your camera and format it. I about gave myself heart failure after I moved all the pictures to my computer and then gamely went on to format the card in my camera like the instructor on the ship told me to. And THEN I remembered there were TWO folders, and I had not looked in one of them, AND it was all of the cruise pictures on that card!!! BUT, it is not always fatal if you have formatted, as I found out after I had finished panicking. I downloaded a free program that I found by Googling something like recover deleted pictures from camera card. I was able to recover ALL of the pictures from that camera chip (only to find out that the second folder was an empty camera system folder). So that was a good but scary lesson. And it is a lesson which I recently taught to Watching2 in Bonzacat's folder, and she recovered her pictures! Yay! Okay, what else? Oh, it is also possible to edit or rename your photos while they are still on your camera card while you are looking at them on your computer. IF you do this, claim you did it by accident, as it is an inadvisable thing to do. Just remember if you do this, those photos will no longer show up when you put the card back into your camera, and you might panic again. BUT, if you will recall, Eeyores already taught you that lesson up above. Once you change anything about the camera card files, your camera will no longer recognize them, but they will still be on the camera card. And another thing - there is a seller on ebay who is in Hong Kong who sells camera card readers ridiculously cheap, like $2.87 for an SD card reader, including postage. I have bought from this seller, and the readers work just fine, and the seller is very, very nice and dependable. You just have to be patient because it takes about two weeks to receive your card reader from Hong Kong. Let me go look it up. The seller is dailyglamour. I have bought several card readers from him or her, and s/he was even very accommodating when I screwed up my order. Okay, that might be all I can recall for now. Keep up the good work, Eeyores and Jimmer.
|
Eeyoreslament
Member
07-20-2003
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 8:17 pm
I grabbed a couple of card readers from a Hong Kong ebay place too. I've had a few times where my computer won't "recognize" the drive, or it will just eject the drive for no reason, but it's never been a big deal. I just take it out, and stick it back in again and everything works fine. Heck, even my ipods have not been recognized once in a while. I don't think it's anything about the equipment, but really just a communication hiccup. Actually, I have to admit, I buy a lot of stuff from Hong Kong. HDMI cables are a good one, because digital signal cannot "improve" in quality based on the materials. Little trinkets and things I'm not sure I reallly want to sink a lot of money into, I get from HK. I bought a USB powered mug warmer, because my tea goes cold so quickly, but it didn't get too hot, or at least, it doesn't heat the tea up very well because only a thing ring of the bottom of mugs actually touches the table.
|
Suz
Member
10-13-2005
| Friday, January 09, 2009 - 9:07 pm
I have never made a folder in my camera. Is it something I should do and how do I know there are folders? Folders are not automatically made by the camera are they? My pictures were taken and stored on the Memory Stick Duo then if there was one I didn't want, just deleted it. Boy, I can see I have a lot to learn. I did read the user guide. Guess not much stuck in my head. With all the marbles in there, there is not much room.
|
Eeyoreslament
Member
07-20-2003
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 12:24 am
Nope. The camera does it automatically, and it's just best to leave it that way. Some cameras have menu functions that let you CHANGE the name of the folder, but it's one of those stupid moves the camera company made, because honestly, most people aren't swift enough to use the function the way it's meant to be used, and it just causes more headaches than it's worth. We're smart enough to adapt to the way the camera wants to work, but the camera isn't smart enough to figure out how WE want to work, so it's best to just let the camera be. Basically, once you've gotten all the pics off the card, and you format it, just let the camera do its thing. :-) Don't feel bad about not knowing about the deletion of photos. It really is such a small and finicky detail, that rarely causes problems. But the potential IS there, and when you're dealing with precious memories, it's just a safeguard against losing those memories from something that could have been prevented. MOST people don't know that little detail about cards. Heck, I didn't know until I went and took a photo course and found it out. It's something professional photographers know. I'm sure they've found out the hard way, because they take SO MANY MORE pictures than the average happy snapper, so that's why they know it, and we don't. They've probably encountered it more, are more familiar with very technical details, and are very dependent on things going properly. The average happy snapper may have come across the error, but probably blamed themselves or attributed the problem to something else.
|
Wargod
Moderator
07-16-2001
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 2:40 am
Thanks guys! I'm going to make sure Darren reads all this tomorrow as well since he's far more techie than I am. We did manage to save sis' pics, even the ones from between Christmas and New Years, downloaded them, backed them up, and now Darren's gonna make her a dvd of them. I wasn't too worried about my chip, or rather, my pics, cuz I'm pretty good about downloading them. I didn't know about the formatting. I've always just deleted the pics off my chip after downloading.
|
Juju2bigdog
Member
10-27-2000
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 5:43 am
Good point about mostly professionals knowing about formatting the card, Eeyores. The guy giving our class (who was from Vancouver, by the way) takes thousands and thousands of pictures.
|
Suz
Member
10-13-2005
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 6:19 pm
All of the above is good information. Thank you. Glad I don't have to worry about making folders. :~) How do you see if there are more folders on the chip?
|
Juju2bigdog
Member
10-27-2000
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 7:44 pm
Suz, when you hook the camera to your computer, or when you use a card reader with your computer, you go to My Computer and look for a new drive (maybe F: or G: or H: ) that is your camera card. Double click on that and you should see the folders. They are not visible in your camera.
|
Suz
Member
10-13-2005
| Saturday, January 10, 2009 - 11:31 pm
Thank you, Juju2bigdog.
|
Holly
Member
07-22-2001
| Wednesday, January 14, 2009 - 6:19 pm
Jimmer, I have a question. Escapee just posted a family picture. The photographer tilted/canted the shot. My nephew just got married recently (up there in Canada too ) and the photographer did the same thing in many of the shots. What's the purpose of that--just to make it more arty-farty? IMO, it is just irritating that you have to tilt your head to get the right angle. When did this style take hold? TIA.
|
Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Wednesday, January 14, 2009 - 6:49 pm
There are various styles of photography that fall in and out of favor over the years. Recently a journalistic style of portraiture has become fairly popular (for Weddings for example) rather than the more posed formal style portraits. Sort of the idea of the type of pictures you see journalists produce at times, in crowds or holding the camera over their head. Some people think it creates a more dynamic, gritty, realism in capturing the occasion. Plus they are always trying for a style that makes their work look different. Tilting is all part of that. Personally, I think both types of portraiture have their place. The more formal posing can be very nice and the candid stuff is fun too. I tend to go for a happy middle ground, helping people to position themselves in a flattering way that looks natural and relaxed.
|
|