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Archive through November 05, 2007

The TVClubHouse: General Discussions ARCHIVES: Oct. 2007 ~ Dec. 2007: Health Center: Fibromyalgia & Chronic Pain: Archive through November 05, 2007 users admin

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Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 3:42 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
accuracy of this test

it is all about whether the lab is fully accredited and whether the Methodology is acceptable for reproducibility.

I would LOVE to have my hair analyzed but it means NOTHING for past Heavy metal detection. after a few years the metals go into the tissues of the body. Chelation will drag some of it out.

I saw a naturopath about it. As a child My parents happily paid me for copper/ lead painting our Steel hulled boat. I was COVERED head to toe in paint a few times.

I also remember playing with Mercury from a broken thermometer.

on the boat you would have strong exhaust and Odors from Diesel Oil. Those strong offgasses would get into the food. you wouldnt notice it when on the boat for days, then when you got home even the smell of the bread would make you nauseaous.

On the boat you couldnt tell.

just saying I've had tons of contact, would love to be tested....but hair metals and urine excretions is unreliable for a true picture.


however, If the metal contact was within the last year or so, i think the hair test would be okay.

Just throwin in my two cents.

Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 4:08 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
I would LOVE to have my hair analyzed but it means NOTHING for past Heavy metal detection. after a few years the metals go into the tissues of the body. Chelation will drag some of it out.

I agree with you here, Sunshyne. Just didn't want to go too far off on a tangent. My primary purpose was suggesting use of the hair elements test if someone wanted to try the Sea Biotics, for determining whether it is causing heavy metal accumulation or an excess of 'good' mineral elements. For that, I think it could be helpful.

The lab they contract with btw is Doctor's Data.

Many nutritionists, naturopaths, chiros, and MDs use the hair elements test as sort of a preliminary gauge of metal poisoning and mineral status. Mineral imbalances in the hair, like with calcium etc, can even provide more subtle clues as to deeper metal storage.

The 'gold standard' however for accurately determining stored heavy metals is a urine challenge with a chelator - though these can be rather dangerous - which is why I've never done one myself.

Another finer but important point is that sometimes when metal levels increase in the hair, it's a positive sign that they are moving out of storage and being excreted from the body - though presumably this interpretation only makes sense when someone is actively trying to detox.

Sun, have you considered RBC elements testing? This was rather helpful for me.


Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 4:25 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
Another more esoteric point, but one that I think you might appreciate Sun (if you weren't aware already) is that bacteria and fungi can actually sequester heavy metals -- most notably, lyme and candida.

Which is one reason why the herxes can be so brutal - it's not just the dieoff toxins from the organism itself that the body has to cope with, but heavy metals that the elimination organs may not be prepared to handle.


Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 5:49 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
interesting information, thanks so much for sharing!

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Tuesday, October 23, 2007 - 3:12 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
RBC elements ? Is that the same as a Live Blood Reading?

I'm a trained Haematologist. I've done my own readings if that is what you are referring to.
I contacted someone locally who was claiming to do Live Blood reading thru the healthfood and supply store.

I felt it was a complete scam done by nontrained personnel. Yeah, Anyone can sort of guess what is going on but unless they had the four or five years of training- their opinion is nontrustworthy. also, their technique guaranteed 'artifact' ( microscopic defects in the RBCs) which can be shown to the patient to 'prove' they need certain supplements. of course it doesnt prove anything unless the person has severe liver damage which is so obvious on smear that anyone can diagnose it. No training needed LOL

Buyer beware! LOL



I've just done a quick search and cant find what RBC elements even are. Anyone have a link?? I'm always open to new stuff (although it must not seem that way most of the time)

and on a final note, yeah Chelation and Detox can be really hard on the body. My naturopath told me that he would only do it if forced. he felt I would have a complete crash and it could be risky.

I was told Pectin capsules can absorb any floating free Metals and will naturally carry them out.

I tried to research the Sea Biotics but am confused. Are they raising those sharks in Fish Farms?? if they are it is very possible that the animals are given Antibiotics and other drugs to keep them disease/ fungus free. Sharks are supposed to be naturally resistant to most stuff.

Would love a link for that as well.

Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Tuesday, October 23, 2007 - 5:41 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
Sun,

no the rbc elements are different than a live cell, but I've had one of those too :-)

The guy who did my live cell reading had at least 5 years of experience. He actually used to work as an attorney and used to have CFS himself - now is a trained nutritionist, etc. He worked with Dr Mercola, a very prominent holistic MD with the second most traveled natural health site on the net

http://www.mercola.com/

My hubby had one done as well... it was pretty interesting. He had high cholesterol and his 'conventional' MD was pressuring him to go on Lipator. Then he had this live cell done which showed liver issues, and the nutritionist gave him an herbal liver cleanse. Guess what? His cholesterol dropped like 30 points to normal range, in just a few months.

Now, he does an herbal liver cleanse twice/year, which is a common 'prescription' in the alt med community. He will be cleansing his liver of disease causing toxins instead of burdening his liver with more with the Lipator.

The RBC elements test I had was done by Metametrix as part of a larger nutrient panel. I had another one done some years earlier, I think by Great Plains.

I can't find a good link that explains the test, but it basically gives you some indication of the amount of minerals/metals stored in your red blood cells. It's a favorite test of Dr Sherry Rogers MD, a very prominent and well respected integrated physician.

Like I was telling Karuuna earlier, apparently it is a much more precise indicator of mineral status than just plain serum readings.

My impression with the live cells is that although they may help provide nutritional clues, they are not nearly as precise in this respect.

But anyway Sun, if you are interested in the rbc elements test, you may want to contact one of these labs

http://www.metametrix.com/content/Home

http://www.greatplainslaboratory.com/

FYI to everyone: these labs are a great doctor referral source, if you want to find an integrated physician who uses these sorts of tests. Just email them with your zip code and they can give you a list of drs in your area.


Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Tuesday, October 23, 2007 - 5:59 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
oh btw - about metal chelation.

I use modified citrus pectin - which apparently works systemically, unlike just plain pectin, which will help absorb metal in the gut.

Chelation I agree can be dangerous and has to be done properly. Of course, it is also dangerous to leave yourself poisoned and succumbing to all sorts of diseases :-)

Three key points I've learned wrt chelation:

1. it is CRITICAL to be boned up on all of your nutrients (and continue to supplement)

2. it is best to 'cleanse' your elimination organs first

3. infectious organisms not only harbor metal - they can overwhelm the body making chelation very difficult - many people need to reduce their infectious load before starting on chelation

I have never used synthetic chelators myself. There are many more gentle ways of detoxing metals - incl the pectin like you mentioned. Someday I may (though they scare me), but I still have dental amalgams so for now it's not even an option. I have detoxed a LOT of metal over the years though without them.


Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Thursday, October 25, 2007 - 12:20 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
i read that it was dangerous to do a chelation when you still have mercury in the teeth as the body will stir up the surfaces which actually causes MORE Hg+ to come out of the teeth.

I had all my Amalgam removed now!!

I really think that I wont do chelation. I have too many allergies to make me feel comfortable with it.

Going to check out your links...thx

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Thursday, October 25, 2007 - 12:25 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
okay I found the list of RBC elements. Yes, that would be an Excellent indicator.

Serum levels are very dependant on hydration. It is completely possible to be in the toxic range yet if a person has drunk lots of fluids that result could be in the normal range.

using cells would eliminate that problem.

I'll look into it! My appetite and eating habits suck. I really should do this test and make sure I aint too low.

Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Saturday, October 27, 2007 - 3:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
Sun if you take the test, lemme know :-)

also re metals, there are other ways of getting rid of them (as you may know) - like saunas (but the same rules for chelation apply)

i have seen SOO many people get well after addressing metals. of course i don't know your toxic load, but it may be that you can never get well unless you take this on.

many people get rid of their allergies when they get rid of the metal. i think this was a very signficant factor for me.

have you tried kidney/liver cleansing? they can really help your body detox metals naturally, along with optimizing your nutrient levels. cleansing also helps many people get rid of allergies, rather dramatically

some highly recommend many months (or years) of juicing as a first step before chelation. this will cause you to dump metal (the nutrients catalyze detox enzymes and can chelate metal themselves) and also help cleanse. you can start off with really small amts and work your way up. dr mercola's site (that i posted above) has ideas

chlorella is also great for carrying out metal in the gut, and pectin like you say. they are nothing like using systemtic synthetic chelators, but can gently reduce your metal load over time

here is a little article that many may want to read

http://itart.info/Eliminating_Heavy_Metal_Toxins_Naturally-32444_view.html

i would add that people 'in the know' say to only use cilantro in conjunction with chlorella - cilantro is primarily a mobilizer and will redistribute metal if there is nothing else to absorb it


Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Saturday, October 27, 2007 - 4:45 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
like saunas

I rarely perspire. It is a big problem for me. I have a sauna in my house. I can be in for a long time and barely break a dew on my hands or feet. I will get sick and dizzy before that happens, the dew is like a last attempt by the body to deal

My boyfriend, by contrast, would lose ten lbs in the same amount of time.

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Saturday, October 27, 2007 - 4:52 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
I've done almost everything numerous times. Including various BRANDS of Bluegreen algae/ chlorella, chlorophil.

I eat primarily RAW food and have for years

Eat the same type of thing over and over due to restrictions.

Went for years without Red meat. Only celery onions carrots beansprouts brocc cauli garlic
and Rice.

occ'ly chicken or turkey....mostly fresh caught local fish.

I have NOT done too much "guided" cleansing or anything since my history is mindboggling for most practioners. One naturopath took an entire THREE hour appointments to just take down my history.

Expensive.

OH< and that Dr then said the solution was that I wasnt eating enough OR properly and encouraged me to do some kind of powdered drink Cleanse? Riceprotein base. Made me Sick sick sick! with explosive diarrhea.

and I was out another $120 for something that I couldnt take.

so much for the indepth history. I was such
a sucker back then. Now I'd demand my money back

Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Saturday, November 03, 2007 - 9:26 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
HI FFF!! I just reordered more Corvalen, I think it is helping. I am having a kinda bad pain wkend but still nothing close to the one in July.

I started my chantix yesterday, so fingers crossed and prayers answered, I will be a non smoker soon :-)

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Sunday, November 04, 2007 - 8:47 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
yay,Pamy! I had a kind of rough week. I think I've been overdoing it with exercise, trying to lose the extra 20 pounds I gained with the Lyrica.

I really like the Corvalen. It really does help increase my energy, so I feel better.

I don't think it's helping me with the muscle spasms at all, nor is the magnesium or potassium. Sigh.

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 3:58 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
question.....what was the dosage of lyrica that was tried?

Also, did it actually Work for you?

was Gabapentin (the real pill yellow capsule pzifer NOT neurontin) also tried?

I am on Gaba, neurontin did nothing. Gaba barely touches my pain AND impairs me like I've had a glass n a half of wine (or am slightly stoned)

tried Two gaba every six hours and was a zombie PLUS it didnt address my pain.

just curious about the Lyrica. I want to give it another trial but at a higher dose.

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 9:17 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
Sunshyne, I started with 25 mg at bedtime, and worked up to 150mg. That's half the usual dosage, but I had twice the weight gain. :-(

I'm very very sensitive to meds, so I always start with the smallest dose possible and work up. I could never take it during the day at all, because I would have just slept through the days.

At the lower doses, it made me so sleepy I slept through the pain. By the time I got to about 125, it really diminished the pain at night, and all through the next day even though I only took it at night.

Mameblanche
Member

08-24-2002

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 4:05 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mameblanche a private message Print Post    
My health has taken a nosedive for the last few weeks and it's been so frustrating! I'm betting it's stress, cuz as I just told VinBlanche right now, the weird stinging sensation on the right side of the top of my head that I had experiened 2 years ago when mom lived with me and I was caregiving her, has come back. I've had headaches, lingering stomach cramps and now nausea. Geez Louise. And now I'm sliding into depression/anger at myself. I feel like such an effin' loser.

Ginger1218
Member

08-31-2001

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 4:32 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Ginger1218 a private message Print Post    
MB, you are NOT an effin loser. So stop that right now. This too shall pass. We all have rough times. I think it is when the weather changes, it affects a lot of people. Just keep your chin up, take meds and all will get better.


Suz
Member

10-13-2005

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 8:21 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Suz a private message Print Post    
(((((((Mameblanche))))))))I hope you feel better soon. I second what Ginger said. You are a good person. Stress can really hurt your body and mind. Sending good thoughts your way and hoping the stress goes away.

Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 8:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
(((Mame))) I know its frustrating. you just need to rest, your body is telling you to, dont fight it, just rest, get massage, pedicure, or something good done for you! xoxxoxo

Mameblanche
Member

08-24-2002

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 9:39 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mameblanche a private message Print Post    
Thx guys... Like I told Deansie on the phone tonight. I'm totally NOT in my HappyPlace right now - so no doubt this is stress related. But the weird thing is that things on the job were getting better, so THAT's why I'm worried and frustrated. Does that make sense?

Kstme
Member

08-14-2000

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 9:47 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kstme a private message Print Post    
Mame, YES, it does! When the dr. told me that I needed to de-stress my life, I stressed out about that. It's normal, but Mame, you REALLY need to relax a little bit. You are making yourself so sick and you know how hard it is to get back to where you feel 'normal' again. My thoughts are with you and I wish I could cast a magic spell to make it all better for you NOW! {{{{HUGS}}}}

Mameblanche
Member

08-24-2002

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 10:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mameblanche a private message Print Post    
Aw thanks Kstme, Suz, Pamy, Ginge! I really need the emotional support right now. DH is great, but part of the stress is that I feel like I'm letting him down, even though he's not saying anything negative to me about it. (yet/lol) It's just that his and his family's work ethic is that you go to work and die with your boots on if you have to, but you go to work, regardless. Personally I cut and run if I'm not up to it, either physically or emotionally, and in this case - it's both. Luckily the assignment is (supposedly) winding down. I'm looking forward to seeing my doctor tomorrow. When he has the time, he's a good listener with great advice.

Juju2bigdog
Member

10-27-2000

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 10:15 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Juju2bigdog a private message Print Post    
You are a handful and a mess sometimes, MB, but you got that shining good soul thing going on that always brings you through the worst of it. So, next time you get down and downtrodden, just smile and say to yourself, or out loud, "I am working on that shining good soul thing."



Mameblanche
Member

08-24-2002

Monday, November 05, 2007 - 11:10 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mameblanche a private message Print Post    
Hey Jooj, thanks for the straight talk wrapped in kindness. Just the right balance, I'd say. Honestly, sometimes it's just easier to shine for others rather than myself... Just call me Donna Quixote. LOL.