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Archive through July 05, 2007

The TVClubHouse: General Discussions ARCHIVES: Jul. 2007 ~ Sept. 2007: Health Center (ARCHIVES): Knee pain-: Archive through July 05, 2007 users admin

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Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Monday, June 25, 2007 - 5:22 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
When my dad started PT for the IT band, he did say he hurt like a SOB at first, and then WOW! Almost no pain at all. It took a bit but it definitely did improve HIS knee problem!

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 25, 2007 - 5:26 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
how long is a bit--i have 5 more weeks of seeing the p.t. 2 x a week
before i see the ortho. dr. again...

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Monday, June 25, 2007 - 5:32 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
It was definitely a few visits. I think it was a coupla weeks, but I can't remember. I do remember that by the end of his treatment, he was walking normally.

Disclaimer: Remember, he had had knee replacement surgery. And then things started hurting again and he was limping again. And limping eventually shortened his IT band, which was causing the pain in the knee. A bit of an endless cycle. So his circumstances were different.

However, it seems Huk also mentioned exercises for the IT band, and, honestly, if you've been in pain for a while, I can't imagine they'll NOT help you.

Remember, too... you've been in pain for a long while. So it's gonna take some time to get to the point where either it's totally non-existent, or it's to the point where you don't notice it. And, unfortunately, Huk is right... it's gonna hurt cause you've developed some bad habits to compensate and breaking you of those bad habits is gonna, well, be a pain! :-)

The only thing I'd add is... if you aren't happy with your therapist, see about getting someone else to work with you. Each therapist, although they will follow the same prescribed treatment, has a different "bedside manner." Sometimes, you just plain don't like someone for no apparent reason. You do want to be comfortable with the person treating you, especially in the initial stages when there may be more pain than gain.

Good luck Nancy. Keep us posted and let us know what the doc says about your MRI results.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Monday, June 25, 2007 - 5:34 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Oh yeah... my right knee was starting to bother me a few months ago. Just intermittent, but sometimes it really hurt to walk. I've been working out fairly religiously for the past 2-3 months, and guess what? No pain in my knee! None at all! So the leg workouts are "working" (no pun intended).

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, June 25, 2007 - 5:51 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
I am not unhappy with her--I just don't know that it will work but i will give it the full 6 weeks--or why the ortho. dr. took so long to send me to it--from all that i've heard I should have been sent months ago.

I definitely understand that i've developed bad habits to compensate--and its probably why now my other leg is feeling it as well..(not the same pain--but now that i am exercising my legs--she's having me do both legs) i can feel that.

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Tuesday, June 26, 2007 - 2:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
ok pt session 3 was today--she gave me two more exercises to do--and had me do the bike again--also she did the ultrasound and a masage as well--the massage i actually felt more pain on the right(inner) part of my knee near what they say is the mcl sprain--the ultrasound hurt where the chondrial defect is..she said that is what the dr. is concerned about on whether its a tear or what this mass actually is--

she also told me what they are doing for therapy is exactly what would be done if i came to them after i had a meniscus repair surgery done. so that makes me feel a bit better.

lastly she is leaving the practice moving to s.c. mid-july so i'll be turned over to someone new- :-(

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Tuesday, June 26, 2007 - 4:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
LOL. Figures, especially if she's someone you like! :-)

One thing to note... it's possible that they'll finish the six week course of treatment and want to continue the treatment for another few weeks. If so, they'll get authorization (from both your doctor and insurance company, if necessary) to continue to schedule appointments for you. Sometimes, the initial prescribed course of six weeks works, sometimes ya need just a bit more. But they will let you know. (They may also send you back to the ortho guy who may in turn send you back to PT. Kinda like a bouncing ball! :-) )

At any rate, make sure you do your homework. The added time you spend on the exercises she gives you should help with what she's doing when you go in for a visit. Also, check with her to make sure you are doing everything correctly, if she doesn't have you do the exercises in front of her. If you do one thing just a wee bit off, it might not be doing what they want (and, in fact, could be doing more harm than good). My last traditional PT had me show her the exercises I was doing once a week (I was seeing her 3x/week) just to ensure that my "form was still correct". Of course, me, the joker, I'd start out doing 'em all wrong, just to tease her!! Ya gotta get yer laffs where ya kin git 'em!

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Thursday, June 28, 2007 - 1:50 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
ok-so not a hapy camper today! at my pt session the assistant p.t. person did my routine--whenasked my painlevel i said a 5 whichishigher(by one point) than it had been--the lateral sprain really really hurts after the pt workout on tuesday..the p.t assistant said she thinks i'm confusing muscle pain with muscle soreness--umm no i freaking know the difference--

then i said well when i cannot sleep at night due to the pain its pain! she said well that is because your muscles relax at night and you have nothing to support your knee--huh??

Seamonkey
Moderator

09-07-2000

Friday, June 29, 2007 - 11:43 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Seamonkey a private message Print Post    
Was she at least kind enough to suggest supporting it with pillows or something??

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 1:40 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
you have to be careful with using knowledge gleaned from other sources to "diagnose" and offer treament suggestions

Who's diagnosing in this case? I'm gleaning nothing from ANY sources. Only my own testimony about people I know And information told to myself by physios and specialists.

each one of my quotes you've used says Clearly stuff like " I never could take Ultrasound "

think you've misunderstood the situation, since you then tell everyone in exquisite detail WHY ultrasound is harsher on me then Laser. in other words you've backed me wonderfully, thx.

however, I think you must not understand the mechanism of Ultrasound.

snip* The waves are generated by a piezoelectric effect caused by the vibration of crystals within the head of the wand/probe. The sound waves that pass through the skin cause a vibration of the local tissues .....Ultrasound can produce many effects other than just the potential heating effect. It has been shown to cause increases in tissue relaxation, local blood flow, and scar tissue breakdown.

the shaking/ vibrating can relax tissue, increases blood flow due to the area being relaxed and is harsh enough to Break Down Scar tissue. Years ago I'd get five star back spasms which would pull my vertebrae out of alignment. Ultrasound would allow them to Pop back in again. The shaking/ relaxing did it. Other things did not.

once again, first hand experience..not gleaning info from shoddy online pseudo-sites

the laser is much more focused to a tighter area and as I said extremely clearly, suited me better.

i'm glad you added "If the patient is referred for knee pain, we treat the knee. "

for that is the exact reason people I know, including myself, ended up injured by physios who blindly followed what they were told instead of doing a patient analysis themselves.

thx for your explanation as to the USA We are not free to do what we want.


that explains a lot. Not sure why you havent heard of doing a full body range of motion/ mobility testing though. It is a part of a standard exam for anyone with hypermobile joints.

Then after a few months of treatment you have it done again to see if there is any improvement, tightening of the joints and loosing of scar impingements.

obviously you have great pride in your job, I bet you do the testing but just call it by a different name/title.

Cheers.

Sunshyne4u
Member

06-17-2003

Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 1:45 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sunshyne4u a private message Print Post    
nancy, It is going to be hard to figure out what could be contributing to the pain.

I find that when I sit here at the pc I often twist my feet kinda around the legs of my chair....then when it starts to really hurt I notice what I've done.

Even walking can change a bit when a knee or hip is out. I have to really watch my rt foot as it will turn in a bit as i walk. I try to make a effort to be 'body conscious' as it sometimes makes things worse.

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Saturday, June 30, 2007 - 8:53 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
yeh i am trying this week to see what i asmdoing when it hurts more--today i went to the movies and it hurt just sitting there--it seems maybe to be in the angle my knees are at--i.e. if i can't touch the floor firmly or if its at a certain ange--like at 40 degrees or so--so that might give the p.t. and doctor a better idea of what exactly is causing it..right niow my knee around where the mcl sprain is is ery very swollen..

Sea i tried pillows its actually worse with them(again the angle its in msotly)

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 4:54 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Nancy, it may have to do with the lateral movement of your knee (rather than the back and forth movement). You might try a flat pillow UNDER your knee/leg when you sleep (assuming you sleep on your side).

Actually, do you sleep on your side or your back?

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 5:10 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
my side

Jaja
Member

02-16-2006

Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 6:22 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jaja a private message Print Post    
I just read your knee saga, Nancy, and I feel for you! I had a torn meniscus and had to go through the PT and the meds, sono and MRI, I drew the line at the cortisone shot. I have the advantage of working for a Dr so I had more help with the Ortho guy, but I finally told him I wanted the surgery. I had the arthroscopic surgery and it was a breeze. They repaired the meniscus and scraped the arthritis out and off I went with my crutches and 2 little stitches,one on each side of my knee. I had a little pain for the first week, but after that it was up hill all the way. I was off the crutches in 5 days and walking on my own. The stairs were tricky and I had a mis-step or two, that I saw stars, but for the most part it was 100% better then before the surgery. I went to PT 3 times a week for about 3 weeks after the surgery and I was very vigilant about doing my at home pt, which started on day 1. This was almost 2 years ago this month and I have had no pain(knock wood). One of the signs I had that it was a torn meniscus was a Bakers cyst behind the knee, it's like a bubble, not too big, but boy is it painful. I am sure not everyone or every tear shows that sign, but I will tell you this, if I get that again behind the other knee, I would recognize it, and would push harder for the surgery. It is wonderful to be pain free. When I think back on mine I lived with the pain for about 3 months give or take, never again.

Oh and one of the things I did for my knee at night was use one of those air filled exercise balls(shaped like a peanut or hourglass), not fully blown up, to cradle the bad knee in. I had to sleep on my back but it was worth it, and it totally supported the knee. I used it when I first came home, also, to support the knee while exercising it, it worked great. Here is the link in case you want to see what they look like. http://www.sensoryedge.com/gyph.html

I hope you find some relief soon. (((Nancy)))

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 7:16 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Ohgawd, if I ever have knee surgery, I'm doomed. I cannot sleep on my back!!!

Jaja
Member

02-16-2006

Sunday, July 01, 2007 - 7:25 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jaja a private message Print Post    
Don't worry Costacat the pain meds, after surgery, will help you out for the first couple days and then you can be on your side, pretty much!! hug

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, July 02, 2007 - 2:42 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
thank you jaja i do have a bakers cyst(popliteal cyst) -- I am usually pretty stoic about pain and such but this is just driving me nuts because its been so long!

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, July 02, 2007 - 2:11 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
costa how is your shoulder? any word on the mri results yet?

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Monday, July 02, 2007 - 3:04 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
LOL Jaja. Gimme good drugs!!!!! <wink>

Thanks for asking Nancy. The MRI was pretty much inconclusive. I dunno if I'm happy about that or not. There's a small tear, but it's in the back of my shoulder and isn't contributing to the pain.

So the ortho guy gave me another cortisone cocktail (in a different place, directly into the bursa). And I'm due back tomorrow to see. This cortisone shot has alleviated some of the constant pain, but it still hurts to lift my arm and move it (holding my arm at shoulder high is quite painful).

If I remember correctly, he said if that shot didn't completely help, he'd try one more shot. If the bursa shot helped, then surgery wouldn't be anything he could fix. However, if he gives me a shot tomorrow and it helps, then orthoscopic surgery would more than likely solve the problem.

Apparently, a teeny sharp point of my shoulder bone pokes into the rotator cuff when my arm is in a certain position. Not all the time, so that's why the RC isn't inflamed. But enough when I move my arm to cause pain. And he thinks that he could just saw off the tip where it pokes into the RC and that would solve all my problems.

So... I'm still at the dunno stage. Dunno if I'm glad it's not serious, like a RC problem. Or dunno if I'm sad, cause that would've been a definite cause of pain and, although surgery would've been recommended, there would've been a clear plan of action. <sigh>

Thanks for asking though! :-)

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Monday, July 02, 2007 - 3:08 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
ugg sorry to hear that costa--

i've been reading a lot about my chondral mass and it seems like surgery is indicateed even without there being a definitive tear--so i have a feeling that the p.t. won't do what he wants to do and i'll be having surgery anyway--but i guess in the long run having my muscles stronger will help after surgery recovery..

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 7:03 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Yeah, that's one reason why I started working out again three months ago (really working out, not just my normal walking routine). I thought, worse comes to worse, it can't hurt to strengthen my shoulder and surrounding muscles, and to increase my flexibility.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed... doc appt in an hour.

Don't you have PT today Nancy? Good luck!

Nancy
Member

08-01-2000

Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 8:18 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nancy a private message Print Post    
thank's costa yes i had p.t. today..I did 10 minutes on the bike and did some weighted leg lifts--I mentioned to her about when it hurt the most--certain angles its in--she said that my knee is hyperextended and locks in place--ALSO my knee tracks to the left as well--so NOW i've got a taped up knee to try to re-align the knee cap back to the middle--its the weirdest feeling in the world walking on it now--because it won't let it more to the left like it wants to do--In all likelyhood it won't take care of the underling chondral defect but it will help build up muscle to support the knee .. :-)

Seamonkey
Moderator

09-07-2000

Thursday, July 05, 2007 - 1:08 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Seamonkey a private message Print Post    
The muscles are really important for knees.. quads and hamstrings especially.

Costa, any news from your appt? Or will it take more time to tell for sure?

My friend who recently had arthroscopic susrgery on one knee for a torn meniscus is in PT now and is having pain. They say to be expected, but I'm thinking that is from her arthritis more than from the surgery. Anyway she had a huge calf cramp the other day and felt like something tore. Seems like one thing after another.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Thursday, July 05, 2007 - 6:14 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Ortho guy is sending me back to PT for four weeks. My first appt is next week. <sigh> I really don't have time for PT appts 3 times a week for a month! But he's not entirely certain he can solve anything with orthoscopic surgery and doesn't want to go digging around looking for something. So after a month of PT, I'll go back and see what he has to say.

I had to LOL at the doc's office... a big giant poster showing normal knees and then what a torn meniscus looks like and a total knee replacement. Great illustations. And the poster? Provided by the makers of Oxycontin! Sheesh!