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Medical Errors All Too Routine

The TVClubHouse: General Discussions ARCHIVES: 2006 Jun. ~ 2006 Dec.: Health Center (ARCHIVES): Medical Errors All Too Routine users admin

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Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 3:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported October 30, 2006
Subject: Medical Errors


What Scares Doctors? Doctors Speak Out

(Part 1 of 3)


ORLANDO, Fla. (Ivanhoe Broadcast News) -- When Reuben Rosenberg was taken to the hospital with a slight chest pain, he had no idea of the unimaginable pain soon to follow. Reuben would not only fight for his life, but fight for the quality of care he expected.

And that was a fear shared with his son, Mark Rosenberg, M.D.

"He kept begging and begging for help, and he said he was scared out of his mind," Mark tells Ivanhoe. "He was scared because he didn't think he could tolerate pain of this level."

That intolerable pain started after Reuben was admitted into the hospital because of chest pain. Something went wrong where a catheter was put in his leg.

This year, 100,000 people will go into the hospital with curable problems, but they will die because of medical mistakes -- errors that didn't have to happen.

To help the situation, Mark thought he would talk his father through the pain.

Reuben's words are clear on the tape recording his son made: "The pain by then was just worse than I ever imagined anything could be, and it was spreading down my leg," he said.

"The pain was intense ... and it was a pain that I had never, never experienced in my life."

"So you felt like you were going to die?" Mark asked. "I sure did," Reuben replied. "There was no question in my mind that I would not walk out of that hospital."

For that intense pain, a nurse only offered Reuben baby Tylenol. And in the exam room a resident saw the signs of internal hemorrhaging, but on Reuben's chart only wrote "Wait and see."

"Everyone left me," Reuben said on the tape. "And I was literally out of my mind." His life was in the hands of an inexperienced resident and a nurse who ignored his pain.

"It's an incredible indictment of the medical establishment," Mark says.

Insiders blame bureaucracy, inexperience, lack of communication, and time crunch.

Pediatrician Donald Berwick, M.D., has also seen the medical world from the other side. His wife was hospitalized with a rare spinal cord problem. He says not one day passed without a medication error, tests needed to be repeated, data misread, or information lost.

"Every doctor, every nurse, every pharmacist, every therapist sees mistakes every day," Dr. Berwick, who is CEO of the Institute for Healthcare Improvement, a nonprofit organization out of Cambridge, Massachusetts, tells Ivanhoe.

More than one in three doctors in a Harvard survey reported errors in their own or a family member's medical care.

"What I hope is they're talking to each other, but I know too much," Dr. Berwick says. "I know that often, they haven't had a chance to do that."

These doctors' advice is plentiful. Patients should read their medical chart daily -- even hourly -- and ask questions constantly.

Mark says, "I found as a doctor, I had no idea what it was like from their side, and I didn't even that I didn't even know. It was amazing."

Now because of witnessing what happened to his own father -- Mark knows.

"He couldn't believe that people could treat another human being like this," Mark says.

Back on the tape, Reuben said: "I was not terrified; I just thought I was going to die. Period." And Rueben did die -- on the operating table.

The surgeon told Mark he was sorry. "The surgeon said to me, 'We messed up. We really messed up,'" Mark says. And according to him, none of the doctors would publicly admit any wrongdoing.

"I do say that my father was killed by doctors," Mark says.

Reuben's family chose not to file a lawsuit, but now Dr. Mark Rosenberg is dedicating his life to making sure what happened to his dad doesn't happen to others as the Executive Director for The Task Force for Child Survival and Development, a nonprofit organization based outside of Atlanta in Decatur, Georgia. It works to reduce medical mistakes in children.


If you would like more information, please contact:

Mark Rosenberg, M.D.
Executive Director
The Task Force for Child Survival and Development

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 3:54 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported October 30, 2006


What Scares Doctors?
How to Survive Your Doctor's Care

(Part 2 of 3)



ORLANDO, Fla. (Ivanhoe Broadcast News) -- There are 600,000 physicians across the country and 5,000 hospitals. And what happens behind those walls can be miraculous.

It can also be deadly.

Technology can pinpoint a tumor, thread a tiny catheter up into the brain, pulverize a kidney stone without breaking the skin ... but the simple stuff, like getting the right drugs at the right time, reading labs correctly, and making sure which leg to operate on can cause the biggest problems. As a result, 1.5 million Americans are hurt by medical mistakes each year.

"Every patient who is in the hospital is likely to be subjected to at least one medication error every day," Albert Wu, M.D., Professor of Health Policy Management at Johns Hopkins School of Public Health in Baltimore, tells Ivanhoe.

Dr. Wu not only witnessed mistakes happen to patients, it happened to his own family. Four weeks pregnant, his wife Diana Sugg woke up with severe stomach pain and a fever so high she was definitely sick.

"We went straight to the emergency room," Dr. Wu says.

Diana battled a mysterious illness for nine days. Scared of what might happen, Dr. Wu moved into her room and slept on the floor. "I knew that if I was there, there was a chance that things perhaps might be averted," he says.


Diana says, "I vaguely caught wind that there was another person on the floor with my same last name, and I know one time they brought me her medicine, but Albert caught that."

Dr. Wu says you don't have to be a physician to catch mistakes. He believes patients need to take responsibility. "Make sure you understand every single thing that's happening to you," he says.

Ask questions. Even at the top-rated hospitals mistakes happen.

Pamela Gallin, M.D., a pediatric surgeon at Columbia-Presbyterian Medical Center in New York, had her right hand operated on. The surgery went fine, but then her cast was too tight and caused nerve damage.

Dr. Gallin needed two more surgeries to correct the problem. "I couldn't operate," she says. "I'm right-handed. I couldn't lift things up."

Because her own surgeon dismissed her concerns, Dr. Gallin wrote the book "How to Survive Your Doctor's Care."

"It's a job to be a patient. A great doctor doesn't just drop in your lap; you have to find them," she says. Dr. Gallin believes when it comes to your health, choose wisely. If you don't like your doctor or hospital, change it. If you have questions about a lab result or treatment, speak up. When giving blood or specimens, ask the nurse if you can check the label. And if the results are alarming, retake the test.

"Organize your own medical care to be on top of it," Dr. Gallin advises.

Diana survived and went on to have a healthy baby boy. She says her husband's watchful eye kept her alive and all patients need someone on their side.

"Have someone with you in the hospital, 24 hours a day," Dr. Wu says.

And Dr. Gallin advises, "Spend as much time picking your medical center and your doctor as you do buying a car." She believes one of the most important things a patient can do is create a medical passport. It should list diseases, medications and doses, allergies and phone numbers of your physicians and nearest relative. Keep copies of all medical reports. Take them to every doctor's appointment.

Remember, errors are not rare -- some doctors believe they are the norm. It's up to patients to protect themselves.

If you would like more information, please contact:

Pamela Gallin, M.D.
Columbia-Presbyterian Medical Center
(212) 305-5407

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 4:00 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported October 30, 2006


What Scares Doctors?
Choose the Right Hospital

(Part 3 of 3)



ORLANDO, Fla. (Ivanhoe Broadcast News) -- Going to the hospital can be overwhelming. Where do you go? Who do you see? How do you choose? Not all facilities are created equal. Are large academic hospitals better than community hospitals? Making the wrong choice can mean the difference between life and death.

When 75-year-old Roy Sheldon was diagnosed with prostate cancer, he trusted doctors at an academic hospital to keep him in the game. "One thing that you gain is you don’t just have your doctor and his assistant. Because it's a teaching hospital, they have several groups," Sheldon says.

"Instead of dealing with 10 people with this a year, we're dealing with 500. Then, we're going to be better at it," Donald Berwick, M.D., CEO of the Institute for Healthcare Improvement, a nonprofit organization in Cambridge, Massachusetts, tells Ivanhoe.

On the flip side, Dr. Berwick believes not everything about academic hospitals is an improvement. "Most major medical centers are under-invested in helping you leave and integrating you back into your community," he says. There, doctors often don't inform local doctors what's happened to their patients.

Hospital President Kirk King, president of Harris Methodist Hospital in Bedford, Texas, says sometimes patients just need more personalized attention. "I think it’s a lot more of one-on-one care, and again, the access to a physician is a lot easier in a community hospital," she tells Ivanhoe.

A recent study shows community hospitals are just as good at treating common illnesses. But academic hospitals have access to new treatments, which can cut recovery time and prolong life.

Knowing not just where to go, but when to go can also be vital.

Mark Rosenberg, M.D., believes an inexperienced resident cost his dad his life. "He was inexperienced, and inexperience is deadly," Dr. Rosenberg says. "He was new, it was July, it was the first time he'd ever been on the floors, and he was new, nor did he ask for help, he just wrote, 'We will wait and see.'"

In fact, the average teaching hospital typically sees a 4-percent jump in its mortality rate in the summer when new doctors start making their first rounds.

The rule of thumb most doctors agree on is:

* If the procedure is elective, elect to wait until after summer.

* If the procedure is routine, choose your community hospital.

* If it's more complicated, get to a teaching facility.

To check your local hospital’s accreditation status, log on to the Joint Commission on Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations' Web site and click on the section that says "Information for General Public."

Sheldon's choice of an academic hospital worked for his prostate cancer. "I was out of there with a radical surgery in three days, and four weeks to the day of my operation, I was back out on the tennis court," he says, and he's been playing ever since.


If you would like more information, please contact:

Donald Berwick, MD
CEO for the Institute for Healthcare Improvement
(617) 301-4800

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 4:04 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported February 13, 2006


Beating the Odds:
Second Opinions

Ivanhoe.com Web Extra


10 Instances When You Should Get a Second Opinion:

1. A medical condition or problem is considered serious

2. Surgery is one of the treatment options suggested

3. Numerous possible treatment options are available

4. After consulting with your doctor, you still have a number of unanswered questions

5. You're told by the doctor a specific type of treatment cannot be used to treat your condition

6. You're told by the doctor nothing, or nothing more, can be done to treat your condition

7. Following treatment, your condition recurs

8. A cause for your symptoms is not found, but the symptoms continue

9. You feel that there is something "wrong" with the diagnosis or suggested treatment for your condition

10. You want to feel 100-percent confident that your doctor is recommending the correct treatment option


If you would like more information, please contact:

Judy Martin
Washington University School of Medicine
Office of Medical Public Affairs
Campus Box 8508
4444 Forest Park Ave.
St. Louis, MO 63108
martinju@msnotes.wustle.edu
http://medicine.wustl.edu

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 4:16 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported February 13, 2006


Beating the Odds:
Second Opinions

(Part 2 of 3)



Ralph Damiano, M.D., explains the importance of second opinions and how to go about obtaining one.

Ivanhoe Broadcast News Interview with
Ralph Damiano, M.D., Cardiac Surgeon,
Washington University School of Medicine, Barnes-Jewish Hospital, St. Louis, Mo.



What kind of medical instances would merit a second opinion?

Dr. Damiano: I think any time that you're about to undergo a major surgical procedure, I think it can be valuable to both you and your family to make sure that the advice you've been given is correct. I would look at it similar to, you know, if you were having your house painted or making some large decision, which is going to cost quite a bit of money. You would often get more than one opinion on it, and I think your own health is probably just as important as your house or having major plumbing work done inside your house. I think it can be very valuable to have a second opinion any time you've been given certainly such a major-type decision that you have to make -- particularly what we're interested in is open heart surgery. Another area that I think can be very important is if your physician says you have a very life-threatening or critical health problem and says there's really nothing that can be done.

In my case, being a cardiac surgeon, that often involves being told that your problem is not operable, and that is a very, very, I think, excellent opportunity to go obtain another advice, often because that could be a very, very major type of decision. If that's the final word, it could have a tremendous impact on your length of life and quality of life, so I think that's another really good time where it may be very important to both the patient and their families to seek a second opinion.

Another incidence where it could be very valuable is if you're feeling great, have virtually no symptoms, and all of a sudden your physician is telling you you need major surgery and it just doesn't seem right to you. That would be a great example of where getting another opinion can give you tremendous piece of mind -- if you have another independent group telling you yes, that's exactly the right thing to do.


Is there ever a time where you shouldn't get a second opinion, or maybe it's not necessary? Do people ever go overboard with that?

Dr. Damiano: I think you could go overboard with second opinions, and I think that's really up to the individual patient. I think, clearly, if you've got a very good relationship with your physicians, you understand exactly what they've recommended, and it makes tremendous sense to both you and your family, I don't think there's a need, every time you're given a recommendation regarding your health care, to seek a second opinion. But there are certainly instances where either you're about to undergo major heart surgery, perhaps the recommendation seems either too extreme, or the recommendation is that there's nothing to be done, that it's a great time to take advantage of another group's opinion on what might be the best thing to do.


How important are these opinions, in your experience, and what kind of implications can a really good second opinion have?

Dr. Damiano: We've had this service here, going for well over a year now, and we've seen it have a tremendous impact on some patients and often in different ways. We have definitely a sizable portion of the patients who come to us for a second opinion. Initially we had the second opinion program just for patients who were recommended to have heart surgery. Now, there was a significant portion of those patients who, when we evaluated, we at least, in our opinion, felt that surgery was not the right opinion, or there was much less-invasive options available with some of the new technology, so for a number of patients, we saved them, you know, what could've been a big operation and either continuing on medical therapy or perhaps having an interventional approach that doesn't involve an incision. There are other patients where the decision for what type of surgery was very much altered by coming for a second opinion, and I think that was valuable for those patients where, you know, a different operation was recommended. Or sometimes we've recommended waiting a little longer before going ahead and proceeding with it. So it can certainly have a tremendous influence on what might be your final destination in terms of the treatment for that problem. You know, I think it's also important to discuss that there's also a large number of cases where we tell you it's exactly right, because I think most people are being given very good recommendations, and there, I think, it's very helpful for you just to have a piece of mind that, "Yes, OK, this is the right thing to do. I've gotten another opinion now. I'm really sure and inside feel very comfortable with going ahead with the operation."


What percentage of doctors' advice do you typically agree with, and what percentage do you typically disagree with?

Dr. Damiano: You know, it's really hard to say. I would have to look at the exact data, but what I would say is a rough estimate is we probably agree with over half the recommendations. Occasionally we'll feel that potentially it can be done with a less-invasive surgical approach, for instance, or perhaps there is another operation that we would recommend at the same time. But generally, we agree with the majority. I would say there is a sizable group, perhaps a third, where we do feel and often will make a different recommendation. One has to realize that medicine doesn't always have a totally black-and-white type of answer to every question, and there's not always a very clear-cut, right choice for therapy, for every disease. But I think in a way that's just another reason, by getting a second opinion, it can be helpful to patients and then they can choose. "We like what Dr. Damiano said," or, "I think I'm going to stay with my original recommendation." I think that makes sense for you. For us, this is just a service that I think, in its best form, would just educate the patient and the family and hopefully give them a little piece of mind that they're actually doing exactly the right thing.


If a patient wants to get a second opinion, what would be the first thing he/she should do?

Dr. Damiano: First, it's very simple. We have a number where people can call. They do not have to come see us. They will talk to a very skilled, advanced practice nurse who works very closely with our group. Also we have a nurse who works with the cardiologist. If the problem is more related to, say, angioplasty, that nurse will then tell you exactly what records to send. Then once we receive those records, within 24 to 48 hours we will give you a second opinion. That second opinion will be given back to you by the nurse and also in writing, that way you don't feel at all pressured or nervous that you have to talk to the doctor. Of course, if you'd like to talk to the surgeon or cardiologist giving that opinion, you can clearly do that and come into the office, but it really is just a rapid way to know is this, in our opinion, the right thing to do. That's what we try to give. Now if you live in another part of the country, probably the easiest way to do this, and this will depend on how comfortable you feel, is to approach the cardiologist or the cardiac surgeon that you're seeing, tell them you'd like to have a second opinion, and ask who they would recommend.


And should you ask your doctor?

Dr. Damiano: Yeah, exactly. And I will tell you, I never have a problem. I think people feel very timid to ask that of their physicians, because they feel like they're implying they don't trust your opinion or that there is some feeling, you know, that they have that you don't really know what you're talking about. But I would tell people that most doctors don't feel like that at all, and, in fact, if you had a doctor who felt like that, I would be very worried that perhaps he might not be that competent. Because to me, when patients ask, I have no problem with that, and I feel like an educated patient is the best patient. I want my patients to feel like they are totally informed and they're completely comfortable with going ahead with that decision. If that means seeing someone else for a fresh opinion, I think that's fantastic.

I would think anyone who didn't feel that way, would, you know, you wonder -- are they uneasy about what they told you, or are they not confident that what they told you would turn out to be what the second opinion would also say? If you don't feel comfortable like that, and some people do not, I would think you would try to do some research on the Internet of either where the closest university hospital or where the highest volume cardiac program was, and just call that hospital and see if they have a second opinion service. Often they're able to have a service where you could come in and see one of their staff or a way they could put you in touch with a person who may be able to give you a quick second opinion


Is insurance ever an issue for the doctors who don't recommend second opinions?

Dr. Damiano: You know, I think that would be hard for me to speculate. I don't think from a doctor standpoint if one of my patients is going to get a second opinion, the insurance issue is not a major one, because that's really the patient's responsibility. I would tell any patients that they should check with their insurer and make sure they pay for second opinions. I will say that most insurance companies do pay for a second opinion. They do not pay for a second opinion if it's not in person, but they will pay to go and have you see another physician or surgeon to have a second opinion.


Is it sometimes confusing if they get the original diagnosis and then another opinion? Then where do they go? Who do they trust?

Dr. Damiano: I think that's up to the individual patient. I think they have to make the decision based on the expertise of the individuals, of the hospitals, and just what seems to make sense to them. It's easy in the present day with the availability of information on the Internet, certainly to do a lot of your own research to help you make an informed decision, to perhaps determine which one of the opinions makes the most sense.


And your service costs $50, correct?

Dr. Damiano: Yes.


What kinds of things do patients have to do to prepare to get a second opinion? What do they have to bring? Is there anything that will make it easier once they see that second doctor?

Dr. Damiano: Yes. I think if you're going for a second opinion, most often the person or physician you call will tell you exactly which tests you need to send. Now you have to remember, our service was designed so you wouldn't have to drive all the way to St. Louis. Just send us some tests and we would tell you exactly what to send. One of the fantastic things is that almost all your tests are available now in digital format, so by just asking them to give you a CD, for instance, your cardiac catheterization or your echocardiogram, you can bring those tests. We then have beautiful images of exactly what your own physicians were seeing and can often make a very informed opinion regarding what we think is right or wrong, just as if you had the test right here at Barnes-Jewish Hospital.


What about if you were going to visit a physician in person?

Dr. Damiano: If you were going to visit a physician, I think it's very important that you ask your own physician to give you a Xerox copy of all your medical records and bring them. You almost can really never bring too much information, so if you could get most of your medical records, it really helps, and it would help potentially from having to duplicate a bunch of tests again a second time.


One last question ... How should you approach your doctor about getting a second opinion?

Dr. Damiano: I think the best way, which may be the most tactful way, if you're a little uncomfortable bringing this up to your physician, would be to say that you really value their opinion and you think that is exactly what you're probably going to do, but because it's such a major decision -- to have heart surgery or an interventional cardiac procedure -- for peace of mind you'd really like to have a second opinion. Ask them if there would there be anybody they would recommend that you could get someone else's opinion on their medical condition. I think if you bring it up that way, I think most people would take it very well. I think, to be honest with you, if I was a patient, if they didn't take it well, I'd think it was a red flag for you, probably very much so, you'd probably need a second opinion.

END OF INTERVIEW



If you would like more information, please contact:

Judy Martin
Washington University School of Medicine
Office of Medical Public Affairs
Campus Box 8508
4444 Forest Park Ave.
St. Louis, MO 63108
martinju@msnotes.wustle.edu
http://medicine.wustl.edu

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 4:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported February 10, 2006


Beating the Odds: Prayer

(Part 3 of 3)



ORLANDO, Fla. (Ivanhoe Broadcast News) -- Research shows more than half of Americans pray for their health. But the age-old debate over religion and science rages on in the medical world. Should we be spending money on clinical trials that involve prayer?

Prayer can liven up a room or quiet an entire congregation. But can it save lives?

Duke cardiologist Mitchell W. Krucoff, M.D., says it's worth studying to find out. In one of the first clinical trials of its kind, he and colleagues are looking at whether distant prayer -- prayer from people you don't even know -- can help patients recover quicker after a heart procedure.

"Prayer, healing touch, compassion, love. These are things that we do all the time in millions of human being and literally have for thousands of years," Dr. Krucoff, of Duke Clinical Research Institute in Durham, N.C., tells Ivanhoe.

In the pilot study, which is still ongoing, patients who were prayed for had up to a 30-percent reduction in adverse outcomes. But more recent results show prayer did not affect patient outcomes. Despite these conflicting results, Dr. Krucoff says distant prayer should still be studied. "We consider this a potentially very unique area of therapeutic advance," he says.

But some -- like Psychiatrist Stephen Barrett, M.D., of Allentown, Pennsylvania -- disagree. "There's no point in studying prayer," he says. "It doesn't work. End of story." He and others say distant prayer studies are a waste of time and money because the effect of prayer can't easily be measured.

"What these studies are actually designed to do is not so much test prayer as test God, and that's why they're double-blinded, so that patients have no knowledge of whether they're being prayed for or not," Michael Cerullo, M.D., Assistant Professor of Psychiatry at University of Cincinnati, tells Ivanhoe.

But Dr. Cerullo says not all prayer studies should be dismissed. "There are studies about positive effects of spirituality and prayer and a person's religious background and their health," he says.

In fact, studies from Duke, Dartmouth and Yale reveal just going to church can help. Patients who don't attend church stay in the hospital three-times longer, heart patients are 14-times more likely to die following surgery, and elderly people have double the rate of stroke.

Doris Redfern believes her faith and others' prayers helped her recover from stage 4 pancreatic cancer. Doctors gave her three months to live. That was three years ago! After her diagnosis, Redfern's church sent out prayer requests to others around the country.

"I started getting these cards, you know, just coming in by the dozens, and the mailman's bringing them, and he said, 'I want you to know my family is praying for you every day,' and you know it just works," Redfern says. She believes prayer made her medical treatment work even when her doctor said nothing would. "I never thought that I would be around to see my first great-grandchild!"


If you would like more information, please contact:

Tracey Koepke
Duke University Medical Center News Office
3000 Erwin Road
Durham, NC 27710
(919) 684-4148
koepk002@mc.duke.edu

Stephen Barrett, M.D.
http://www.quackwatch.org

Neko
Member

08-03-2001

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 5:14 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Neko a private message Print Post    
I'm not 100% sure I can write in this thread, so if I can't, just delete this :P

The article that spoke of a woman who was in the hospital, and got the drugs of another patient with the same last name made me think of my boyfriend's father.

He suffered a heart "issue" and was taken to the hospital, but it wasn't life threatening. Another patient with the same last name was on the same floor. A nurse came up to my boyfriend's mother and told her that her husband had only days of live and was going to die.
She was of course completely confused and shocked and tried to tell the nurse her husband was fine. Finally her husband's nurse came and corrected the problem.

This was all because they didn't put patient's first name on their hospital charts and labels.

Funny thing was, the other patient with the same name, was probably about the same age as her father and they still didn't think it was odd that she was "his wife." :D

After that, every time she was in the hospital to visit, she'd erase his name on their white board and put his first name in as well!

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:02 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Neko, of course you can! That's why I post this stuff--for people to chime in--and really, just help each other by sharing what they know or have experienced.

The issue almost sounds exaggerated. But, as your story scarily demonstrates, it really does happen. That hospital is lucky she didn't have a heart attack upon hearing that news!

Thanks for sharing, Neko!

Herckleperckle
Member

11-20-2003

Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:43 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Herckleperckle a private message Print Post    
Source: Ivanhoe.com
Reported February 6, 2006


Beating the Odds:
Miraculous Recoveries

(Part 1 of 3)


A doctor's interview with Caryle Hirshberg, M.S., of the Institute of Noetic Sciences in Petaluma, who discusses her 25-year research.


ORLANDO, Fla. (Ivanhoe Broadcast News) -- Now, you see it ... Now, you don't. For centuries, so-called "medical miracles" have fascinated the greatest minds in medicine. Magicians can make objects disappear, but can our bodies make tumors go away?


alice 1

Alice Epstein says hers did. Epstein's doctor said she had only a couple of months to live after her kidney cancer spread to both lungs. "By the time the tests came back, there was really no hope," she says.

Epstein had surgery to remove the tumor in her kidney but didn't have any treatment for the other lesions. She says they just disappeared! Her doctor gave back her X-rays and admitted he didn't know why or how it happened ... That was 20 years ago.

"Now, there will be people who won't believe the sort of thing I'm saying, but we believed in the psychological approach. But it was more than psychology. I meditated twice a day. I calmed myself down. I really became a different person," Epstein says.


alice 2

But can cancer just go away without treatment? Researcher Caryle Hirshberg, M.S., of the Institute of Noetic Sciences in Petaluma, Calif., says yes. And it even has a clinical name -- spontaneous remission.

Hirshberg has studied the phenomenon for 25 years and compiled the world's largest database of reported cases from 800 journals. "Cancer can bypass the body's surveillance system," she tells Ivanhoe. "It tricks the system."

Some patients develop a fever and an infection right before spontaneous remission. Doctors believe this triggers a powerful immune response that also destroys tumors.


alice 3

More research on the subject could help doctors find cures to different diseases. "We look at people when they're sick, and we try to make them better, but we don't look at the group of people that get better and figure out why," Hirshberg says. Researchers used to believe these remissions occurred in about one in every 100,000 cases, but her research shows they may be much more common, about 10-fold.

Stephen Barrett, M.D., a psychiatrist with QuackWatch.org, admits spontaneous remissions do happen, but says they are still rare. "Most people who recover from cancer do so as a result of standard medical treatment," he tells Ivanhoe.

Epstein says her recovery was the real deal, and she's written a book about her experience. And she says that "miracle" is why she's here today.


If you would like more information, please contact:

Caryle Hirshberg, M.S.
Institute of Noetic Sciences
Petaluma, CA
caryle1946@sbcglobal.net

Stephen Barrett, M.D.
http://www.quackwatch.org

Mack
Member

07-23-2002

Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 11:53 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mack a private message Print Post    
Not too many months ago my wife's doctor do an ultrasound on her and decided she needed surgery. OK, we'd kind of been expecting that so it really wasn't a surprise. What was surprising was the type, actually method, that the doctor planned to use. It seemed to us in this age of modern medicine that there were more state-of-the-art surgeries available. We also thought that since my wife's doctor was relatively young, in her early to mid 40's, she'd be up on the latest. Long story short, she wasn't and didn't address the other alternatives. We did our own research and found two other doctors in the area who were more familiar with the latest procedures. Interestingly they both supported the need for the surgery but not for the same reason the first doctor stated. In fact, they both firmly felt the first doctor totally misread the ultrasound. One of the other doctors did indeed perform the surgery on my wife using the latest procedures. The original problem? Totally wrong. What's scary about this was we could have easily just gone with the first doctor and my wife would have had an operation that was state-of-the-art but in the 1940's not 2006 and for the wrong reason. It really went from being almost an emergency situation, per the first doctor, to a semi-elective procedure with no sense of urgency. Our advice? Ask questions, then research, then ask more questions and keep asking until you're totally satisfied with every answer.

Chiliwilli
Member

09-04-2006

Thursday, November 23, 2006 - 12:06 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Chiliwilli a private message Print Post    
That is so true, Mack. Please, remember though just because it is the newest, latest thing doesn't make it better than the time proven old standbys. I'm too tired to tell the story now but if I had followed the doctor's instructions using the latest up-to-date technology, I would not have my 14 year old son today.

Mack
Member

07-23-2002

Thursday, November 23, 2006 - 10:49 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mack a private message Print Post    
Chiliwilli - Absolutely and I don't mean to dismiss all older approaches or procedures as out of date or old fashion and therefore dangerous or unnecessary. There are all sorts of circumstances in my wife's case where the old procedure was unnecessarily dangerous where the newer (that's a relative term because laparoscopic surgeries have been done for the past 15 to 20 years) procedure put her at substantially lower risk. I actually was more "upset" that the first doctor totally missed the boat on her reading of the ultrasound and in the process scared the you-know-what out of us. The other two doctors were polite about it but it was clear they thought she was really mistaken and it turned out she was.

Chiliwilli
Member

09-04-2006

Friday, November 24, 2006 - 2:04 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Chiliwilli a private message Print Post    
How odd. My problem started with an ultrasound also. What I forgot to add to my previous post was that no matter what the docs tell you ~ question, question and then more question until you're are dead sure they know what they are doing/talking about. I always trusted the docs and would have done what they told me if a friend of mine hadn't already been down that same road and talked to me about it. I thank God for that every day.

Mack
Member

07-23-2002

Friday, November 24, 2006 - 6:37 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mack a private message Print Post    
Chiliwilli - I've been a clinical psychologist for 30 years. 16 of those years were in a hospital environment as a staff and supervisory psychologist. While I've moved away from direct patient care I haven't forgot the lessons I learned while in the hospital. I drive my MD's and MD friends a bit "nuts" but I run them through the wringer, so to speak, about meds, tests, procedures, etc. I'm no MD, never pretend to be, but I've got enough experience to question and question some more until, as you said, I'm as sure as I can be about the situation. We all think of medicine and the practice thereof as an exact science and while partially true it's not absolutely true.

A bit more about our go around with my wife's first doctor. Let's just say her mistake was so basic that she has been reported to her medical director and she's being watched and her cases reviewed right now. It wasn't and isn't my goal to get her in trouble as much as it is to get her attention so she pays more attention to her cases. Hopefully she'll be a bit less in a hurry and more supportive of seeking second opinions even within her own group.