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Archive through March 19, 2006

The TVClubHouse: General Discussion ARCHIVES: 2006 Mar. ~ 2006 May: What does "New Without Tags" mean to you?: Archive through March 19, 2006 users admin

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Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
Hi All!

So here's the situation - I won a dress for my bro's wedding on eBay. It was advertised as "New Without Tags" in the header and then down in the description, the seller said she'd only wore it once. I laugh when people say that because in the car world - as soon as you drive it off the parking lot - it's used. The dress arrived last week. Boy was I excited - I open up the box and lo and behold - armpit stains! Now in my books "New Without Tags" means I should be able to take it out of the box and put it on. (I refuse to try it on until it's been dry cleaned) What is your opinion?

To top it off - the girl emailed me as soon as it got here to remind me to leave her feedback and then again a few day later. . .I'm debating if I should write her and tell her what my opinion of "New Without Tags" means.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:13 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
New without tags means NOT WORN!! If it is worn even once, it is no longer new! (Just like the car you drive off the lot!)

Write her and tell her. Be nice about it. But tell her you thought "new without tags" really did mean new, even if she wore it only once. And if she did wear it only once, it needed to be cleaned afterwards.

Then ask for a full refund, or ask for a refund for the cleaning costs. Unless she specifically stated "as is" in the description or described the stains, you actually can contact her about it.

How much did you pay? Did you pay by PayPal? There are some other options if she gets "rude" on you.

Finally, don't leave feedback until you are satisfied. And if she kinda sorta resolves the issue, leave neutral feedback (although I tend to not leave feedback cause I don't trust these people sometimes).

I do a lot of buying on eBay and I buy a lot of clothes (mostly long boho skirts and vintage sweaters). I've only been burned badly once (the skirts were so not even remotely close to the description). I ended up sending the skirts back but they never refunded my money. This was before the PayPal guarantee.

Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:19 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
stolen

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:29 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
lol Pamy :-)

Yeah I guess I'm what they call an eBayaholic. My husband would probably make me go to meetings if they had them. . . but I mostly buy technology/music/books and lots of selling of junk. I've had a couple of incidents - most recently where they sold me a "brand new" router with a warranty and then when it came it had scratches and dust on it so I told him I wanted a refund and he refused saying it said as is on the auction - I told him I'd like the receipt so I could have the proof of purchase for warranty since it was listed in the descrip and he refused and everytime he emailed it got ruder and ruder and he kept saying things that made it obvious he lied in both the auction and email correspondance. . .so it's in dispute right now.

I did email the girl today and explain what I felt "NWOT" meant and how though I know she wrote it was worn once, I still expected to be able to try it on without having to send it to the cleaners. I think the option of her refunding me cleaning costs is a GREAT idea. Does anyone know - if I go through Square Trade or dispute resolution to do this or can I simply agree with her through email? I did pay for it using paypal but not my bank account.

Eeyoreslament
Member

07-20-2003

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:40 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Eeyoreslament a private message Print Post    
Man I would have returned the dress. NWOT in NO WAY means worn. I wouldn't even compromise on cleaning bills. Chances are you would not have bid, or even bid as high as you did, had you known it was already worn. I doubt the 10 dollar cleaning is the only difference in price you would have paid. Chances are you would have kept looking.

I'd return it.

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:43 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
actually it did say in the auction that it had been worn - I just assumed that meant she'd had it cleaned or that you wouldn't be able to tell it had been worn - basically I figured it would be as if she'd tried it on in the fitting room...

Eeyoreslament
Member

07-20-2003

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 12:23 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Eeyoreslament a private message Print Post    
It must have been a fitting room in a SAUNA!!

Seamonkey
Moderator

09-07-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 12:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Seamonkey a private message Print Post    
Gracie, I'm guessing that other than the stains, if the dress can be cleaned well, you like it and want to wear it and don't really WANT to send it back, even to prove a point?

Hope you can get the cost of cleaning out of her.

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 7:20 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mocha a private message Print Post    
I'd have returned it.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 7:46 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Gracie, SquareTrade will only work with you up to a point. And I think there's a dollar limit. I ended up filing all sorts of complaints against the bimbo who never returned my money.

Contact her first and see if you can get it resolved. If you can't, contact SquareTrade and also contact PayPal to find out how much of a guarantee they offer (they didn't have that guarantee when I had problems). eBay tells you to try to resolve problems with the seller/buyer first, so try that route. If you really like the item, try to get reimbursed for cleaning costs. Stop short of saying she actually lied in her description, but be clear that NWOT kinda means "new" and "worn once" with a NWOT handle kinda implies that maybe she had it on for an hour and then decided it didn't fit right and changed. And that armpit stains are bit, well, unsettling (again, stop short of "disgusting" which is what I'd really say). Be clear and to the point, and be nice. If she refuses, then start contacting everyone you can to file a complaint (still, at this point, don't leave feedback).

Also... check her feedback. Did she have any negatives or neutrals? I've learned... I will never EVER buy from anyone with either within the past 6 months. My last bad experience was right before the holidays. I bought a garden gnome for my mom's husband. I assumed shipping was more expensive cause it was from Canada. Nope. It was more expensive because the idiot seller FRICKIN' DROVE ACROSS THE BORDER TO MAIL THE ITEM FROM THE STATES. So, they charged me for their gas. And they did NOT ship the item for 10 days. (The next trip over the border.) I contacted the woman and she said no one else ever complained. But I went and looked at her feedback, and she had several neutrals and they all related to shipping. That was the last time I bought anything from anyone with a neutral rating. Neutral is a cop out... this woman would not leave feedback for you until you left feedback for her.

Eeyoreslament
Member

07-20-2003

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 10:11 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Eeyoreslament a private message Print Post    
Personally, I have asked sellers to leave me my feedback the moment I have paid, as that it the only thing I am supposed to be doing as a buyer. There is no need to wait on their part.

Teachmichigan
Member

07-22-2001

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 12:11 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Teachmichigan a private message Print Post    
Agree w/Eeyore -- as soon as the buyer pays (and check clears), the seller should leave feedback. I also agree w/Costacat; if a buyer or seller has negative or neutral feedback from another respected ebayer (I check their feedback then, too), I try to steer clear.

I had not one but two people purchase videos from me, but then back out because I didn't accept paypal (which was clearly stated in the auction). One of them then left neutral feedback for ME -- I contacted her, indicated that it was her issue, not mine, and that I wanted the feedback withdrawn. I also replied to her IN my feedback so others could see (I have 100% rating). I had to go through ebay to get the feedback withdrawn (and it still appears but says we've both agreed to withdraw feedback). Probably 99% of the time, I love ebay, but this past selling experience about drove me nuts!

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 1:14 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Eeyore, I agree, the seller should have left feedback as soon as I paid (as do most sellers). But this seller apparently held her feedback waiting to see what the buyer would say. Sort of like holding it for ransom. I never posted feedback, so she never did. Can you think of the five letter word I called her, that rhymes with witch? <wink>

Teachmichigan
Member

07-22-2001

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 2:09 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Teachmichigan a private message Print Post    
Ditch?????

Pitch?????

Hitch???? (d&r)

Cassie
Member

07-15-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 3:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Cassie a private message Print Post    
Out of ALL the ebay transactions I've had (probably close to 100) only ONE seller has ever left feedback before I did. I think it's definitely something ebay needs to change--make the seller leave the buyer's feedback once they are paid and that way, the buyer can tell the truth in their feedback without fear of recrimination from the seller. Most sellers now say they will only leave feedback after the buyer leaves theirs. Which is just holding the buyer over a barrel in my opinion. I'm beginning to hate ebay any more.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 3:18 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Keep working your way through the alphabet, Teach. You'll get to it eventually! <snicker>

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 5:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
I have NEVER left feedback as a seller (which I am primarily) as soon as the item is paid - I know where you guys are coming from - but as a seller, I leave it open because a lot of times buyers will just go leave negative feedback without even trying to tell me that there is a problem. When I first moved out here, I discovered a serious problem with my mail carrier - I think the person may have even been fired once it got sorted out. But in the meantime, I had a LOT of unhappy customers. To me the transaction isn't finised until I hear they are happy in some form or fashion (it doesn't have to be feedback). If someone's unhappy, I want to know and I want to do what I can to make them happy. If they are unwilling to negotiate or to make the effort to communicate with me, I have no problem leaving bad feedback for bad communication. This usually happens with people with REALLY low ratings. . .

As far as the dress goes - I think after weighing it all - the dress is $165 brand new at David's Bridal where I could get alterations done professionally for like $20 (I'm too scared to do it myself). I paid about $110 plus another $20 in shipping - so it's not really a bargain to me - I could go either way - it's not a style they currently have, so it would be nice to have it - but on the other hand there was a similar one on display when I went in a few weeks ago that I liked for the same price. It's only a $35 difference between brand new and pit stained used. . .

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 8:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
Gracie, don't forget pit stains are sometimes difficult to remove. If it's one of those "eh" things, then see if the seller will give you your money back (less shipping). "NWOT, worn once", does NOT mean "NWOT, worn once long enough so that my smelly pits could leave a stain on it and I'm too stoopid to look at the dress to see if it really does look like it's NWOT", right? <grin>

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Thursday, March 16, 2006 - 6:11 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
yeah I know, the more I think and talk, the more I realize I need to return it to her regardless of if she refunds shipping because it's just not what I want. I think I'll stick to buying dresses at the store :-)

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-21-2004

Saturday, March 18, 2006 - 6:26 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Graceunderfyre a private message Print Post    
Ok so I told her I wanted her to refund it all and the girl gave me a lecture on how "proper" ebay transactions should go. She then proceeded to compare her 5+ year stint on eBay to my measley 4+ years. Interesting how she very proudly said she had a 140 feedback rating and failed to mention mine (280 unique out of 333). . . I was so annoyed that I told her I would not return the dress and I'd just resell it. I know I know it doesn't really do anything to her - BUT - she's really looking for that feedback rating - I'm just not going to give her any feedback. OR maybe I'll do a neutral one if she hounds me about it. I remember getting a neutral when I was around 150 and being SOOO upset about it.

Eeyoreslament
Member

07-20-2003

Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 2:03 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Eeyoreslament a private message Print Post    
I can't believe you are taking this lying down Grace. I would have written her back, told her that her feedback was HALF of mine, and that she can look forward to a negative rating. IN the negative rating, I would say "new without tags DOES NOT MEAN PIT STAINS!!" and let the rest of her customers figure it out.

Buyer beware. You're not helping ANY future customers of hers by not saying anything, and not warning others about her. The whole point of negative feedback is to promote good sales for good people, and discourage people buying from bad sellers. Help others out by letting them know this is NOT a good seller, and they may not be getting what they expect, and to ask a lot of questions first.

Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 9:01 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
I'm with Eeyore, Grace. I would definitely send her a formal email and then file a complaint with SquareTrade and PayPal. Take pictures and include the pictures in your email.

DO NOT TAKE THIS LYING DOWN!

This woman is not being an ethical seller. And what is up with the lecture? You can tell her you talked with someone who's been an eBayer since 1999 (that would be 7 years), and who has 380 positives (uniques) with a total of 468. And I've never heard of anything with "pit stains" being NWOT. In fact, the woman should have mentioned there were stains.

Hukdonreality
Member

09-29-2003

Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 9:11 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Hukdonreality a private message Print Post    
Grace, if that seller lectured you in an e-mail, you might want to forward that along with your complaint to PayPal (or wherever). Just a thought...

Holly
Member

06-19-2005

Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 9:45 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Holly a private message Print Post    
Sellers like this one have ruined eBay IMHO. I ordered something around Christmastime described as NWOT. When it arrived, it had a hole in it and singe marks!! I wrote to the seller and got a rude response and a "read the ad--no refunds or exchanges." Well...I saw red and filed a complaint (I had paid with MO) and she eventually sent my money back after numerous emails promising it was "in the mail." I just kept hounding her and told her I would contact the Health Dept (she is in the same state as I). But here's the thing. The woman had several negatives from people saying they had received dirty, worn, and damaged clothes, some of it even lingerie! Yet she continues to list and sell, and strangely, some of the negative feedbacks disappear altogether after 4-5 days. I don't understand why eBay doesn't take stronger measures against people like this and ban them from selling altogether. eBay has become WAY too seller sympathetic IMO.

BTW, can anyone tell me what the Buyer Protection warranty is if you buy with PayPal. They sent me an email but good lord, it's like reading a missive.

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 9:49 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mocha a private message Print Post    
She's got some nerve...