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Archive through December 21, 2005

The TVClubHouse: General Discussion ARCHIVES: 2006 Mar. ~ 2006 May: Baby Boomers, Living Alone, Changing Habits (ARCHIVES): Archive through December 21, 2005 users admin

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Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
Karuuna...what do you mean by "spiritual"

How do you define it? How did the study define it?

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:28 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
But aren't you two using the word "soul" interchangeably with the word "personality?"

Brenda, isn't your personality the essence of who you are? Again...words...

I see a friend of mine at work. She has an upbeat personality, always happy and cheerful and fun. I see another guy and he's a dark cloud, always grumpy, complaining. They have two different personality types.

Terri Schiavo. Couldn't you say her soul was still inside her body, until she died? Does a soul express itself like a personality does? You hear the phrase "he's an old soul", usually referring to a young person who is wise beyond his years.

Maybe you have to believe in God before you believe you have a soul.

Abby, thanks for the quick drive by post. That was a good topic. It's similar to the phrase "water finds it's own level." However, sometimes you have Katrina, or a tsunami, and the container can't hold all the water and there's a disaster.

I would agree with you. Sometimes God gives you more than you can handle...if there is a God that is...


Abby7
Member

07-17-2002

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:32 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Abby7 a private message Print Post    
sorry for the "quick drive by post". i thought i would post more tonight on the subject. i'm just too tired and have a few other things going on, while i'm posting here.

so...not in the mood to post about "that".

(well, "someone"/"something" gave some people too much to handle imo)

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:35 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
Well, how I define it may be different than the study's view.

Any study has to use concrete measurables. In most of these studies, they used church attendance and prayer. Most studies are scholarly, but Time Magazine did a cover article summarizing the research not long ago. The article is online but you have to have a subscription.

Spirituality to me is a more amorphous, hard to define thing. Much like my view of God. It is a general belief in *something* greater than we humans, and time spent daily in some activity related to connecting to, or knowing that energy/being/thing/whatever.

I"m sure that didn't help much. :-)

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:37 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
"too tired, right now, to comment about "God never gives you more than you can handle" (not sure if that is an exact quote, sorry if it is not)."

My understanding was that God will never give you anything more than you can handle if your focus is on God and the next life.

This concept became clearer to me when I read the book Jesus Freaks by DC Talk. I found it to be a powerful book that really dind't preach.
It was simply several accounts of people past and present who willingly endured torture and death before they would renounce their faith in Christ.

Many rejoiced and sang praises as they burned. To me...that's amazing. That is enduring...

To think they didn't feel the pain because they were rejoicing. Wow! What's that about?

That's God helping you handle anything if you focus on Him.


Yadda yadda ya!!!

Abby7
Member

07-17-2002

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:41 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Abby7 a private message Print Post    
thanks Kearie for this:

My understanding was that God will never give you anything more than you can handle if your focus is on God and the next life

----------------------

this is the first time i've read this part of your sentence: "if your focus is on God and the next life".

i've NEVER read that part before. that part changes the meaning IMO.

Abby7
Member

07-17-2002

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:45 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Abby7 a private message Print Post    
i wonder how people define soul and spirit. do you think we have a soul. do we have a spirit? or are we a soul? are we a spirit? or none of the above?

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
I don't think God "gives" us stuff to handle at all. But faith can help us deal with what the mess that life throws at us.

I used to find Mother Teresa's comment about this whole issue amusing. It goes something like: "if God only gives us what we can handle, then sometimes i find myself wishing God didn't think so well of me."

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:54 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Why would your focus be on the next life? What if there is no next life? And doesn't THIS life offer enough challenges as is?

Karuuna, what I was asking you, now that I have some sense of your concept of God and spirituality, was do you pray? If so, how and for what?

I know this is a personal question but you seem open to sharing your personal thoughts on God and spirituality.


Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:57 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Good quote from Mother Teresa. Didn't know she had a sense of humor.

Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:59 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
LOL! I love that quote!

The other day my 10 yr old was so upset that his best friend didn't believe in God, he believes in Budha. He was crying that he wouldn't be in Heaven with him because he didn't believe in God. I didn't really know what to say, I just told him that his friend has love in his heart and God knows that, so don't worry.

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 9:59 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
That's just my understanding of that phrase Abby7...I'm not sure most people hear the second part. It's just what I grew up hearing.

The spirit and soul thing. Grrr...Like I said, the more I think about it, the more questions I have.

I think the part of Terri S. that was her soul and her spirit...left her body long before her body died. I think Terri left her body when her self awareness left. She may have still had the same giggle, the same smile, maybe she still makes the goofy face when she sneezes...but she isn't there.

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 10:12 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
Newman...you're making me think too much. LOL

I think if you look at it from a psychological aspect...it makes sense.

If you're going through really hard times...it often makes a person feel better to do something for others. Quit focusing on yourself and your troubles and focus on something else.

I think focusing on others or God helps us get through our troubles. There is no time in this life to waste feeling sorry for yourself. (I waste too much time doing this) Focus on something else and you will be happier.

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 7:28 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Well, Kearie, I used to focus on baseball, my first true passion. But I live in Colorado and we have bad owners and a loser franchise. There's no hope. A fan without hope is is is bitter? Despondent? Hopeless? Sad?

Then I focused on politics. Current events. This invasion and occupation of Iraq is so wrong on so many levels. It can't work. We are the enemy there. 80% of Iraqis want us to leave. What are we doing there? Nation building? No WMD. If armed Chinese were marching up and down our streets, Democrats and Republicans would drop their petty differences, and join forces to drive the Chinese out of America.

Then they'd go back to fighting amongst themselves again. That's what's going on with the Sunnis and Shia in Iraq. They both want us out, but they hate each other and have no foundation in democracy and...

Focus on others you say? I can't even say "Happy Holidays" on my mail route without fear that a Fundamentalist Christian dittohead won't correct me with, "NO, it's Merry Christmas."

Late for work..."Seasons Greetings!"


Brenda1966
Member

07-03-2002

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 10:49 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Brenda1966 a private message Print Post    
Yes, Newman, since i'm not religious or spiritual, soul does = personality.

Pamy, your son's response to finding out his friend embraces a different religion demonstrates my distaste for organized religion. Someone taught him to believe this (this his religion is the only way to heaven) and that makes me sad. I think your response to him was good -- planting the seed that being a good person is more valued.

Ghandi had a great quote that I can't find, but it's about how the different religions are just branches of the same tree.

Max
Moderator

08-12-2000

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 11:05 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Max a private message Print Post    
All the religions of the world, while they may differ in other respects, unitedly proclaim that nothing lives in this world but Truth.
Mohandas Gandhi

A religion that takes no account of practical affairs and does not help to solve them is no religion.
Mohandas Gandhi

Gentleness, self-sacrifice and generosity are the exclusive possession of no one race or religion.
Mohandas Gandhi

I believe in the fundamental truth of all great religions of the world.
Mohandas Gandhi

In nature there is fundamental unity running through all the diversity we see about us. Religions are given to mankind so as to accelerate the process of realisation of fundamental unity.
Mohandas Gandhi

No religion which is narrow and which cannot satisfy the test of reason, will survive the coming reconstruction of society in which the values will have changed and character, not possession of wealth, title or birth will be the test of merit.
Mohandas Gandhi


One's own religion is after all a matter between oneself and one's Maker and no one else's.
Mohandas Gandhi

Religion is a matter of the heart. No physical inconvenience can warrant abandonment of one's own religion.
Mohandas Gandhi

Religion is more than life. Remember that his own religion is the truest to every man even if it stands low in the scales of philosophical comparison.
Mohandas Gandhi

The essence of all religions is one. Only their approaches are different.
Mohandas Gandhi

Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is.
Mohandas Gandhi

Pamy
Member

01-02-2002

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 11:10 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Pamy a private message Print Post    
Thx Brenda and Max, I am going to read that quote to him.

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 11:11 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
Newman, I meditate/pray twice daily for extended periods; and periodicially all through the day. I don't do intercessionary prayer or petitionary prayer much, except in the Buddhist understanding. In other words, I don't ask for 'stuff" so much, as I prayer so that I can be healed, a better person - more compassionate, more loving, more patient. And I pray so that I am reminded that whatever situation I am in, I know that life is bigger than that particular moment, helping me keep things in perspective.

I use Buddhist chanting (prayer) quite a bit; and frequently also use Christian Centering prayer (which are really very similar). I also use mindfulness meditations to teach me to be more aware of the present moment, what is actually happening right now - instead of worrying about what happened before, or what might happen later.

Does that help?

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 11:58 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
Newman...You mean Colorado's baseball team is kind of like The Seattle Seahawks...a losing team?
I quickly found another team to cheer on. LOL

I understand passion, but to say you might feel bitter, despondent, hopeless and sad...isn't that putting a little too much emphasis on a sports team? How does them losing really effect you or your life? (Unless you bet big money on them)

The war in Iraq...ugh!!! That's plenty to make the world seem like a depressing place...along with the way America is being run. I feel fear because I think our great nation is being irrevocable damaged. But whatever happens...I know I will be "okay"...because I trust God.

When I say I will be okay...I also mean that maybe I will die. Maybe this difficult, hard life will end...and that could be a blessing. As I see it anyway.

I think it sucks that people are so sensitive about what to say during this season. The season is about peace and goodwill. Sharing and caring.
Not semantics.

Yes, focus on others. Random acts of kindness, do something to make someone else feel better.
Listen to someone who needs a shoulder. When you go on your route, bring candy canes and if you see kids playing...hand them out. Little things will make a difference...TO YOU!

MAX---I loved those quotes.

I also pray...not daily like I feel I should.
I don't attend church services because I don't like the hypocrits and judging I find. I struggle with holding other Christians to a higher standard than other people. Funny thing is, that's me judging them.

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 9:16 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Karuuna, that helps. Intercessionary prayer or petitonary prayer. Descriptive. Those are the kinds of prayer I was probably taught as a kid but which don't make sense for me now.

I don't believe in a God in the sky with a huge computer that has a plan and knows every hair on every head and who will intercede in some prayers but not others.

I've never chanted.

I just found my copy of Philip Kapleau's "The Three Pillars of Zen" which I read way back in l973. I underlined a bunch of it. Maybe I'll review what I thought was important back then and see if it still holds meaning to me now 32 years later.

Karuuna, do you have a Buddhist book you'd recommend?

Max, thanks for all those Gandhi quotes.

Kearie, I am a baseball fanatic still, so being depressed about the Rockies does not put too much emphasis on a sports team (I write as MY Broncos are beating the Bills 14-10...)

Maybe you should find a different church, Kearie, where there isn't so much judging going on. My Unitarian Church seems quite nice and friendly and accepting and tolerant and also has a strong Buddhist contingent.


Jeep
Member

10-17-2001

Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 7:53 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jeep a private message Print Post    
Tonight on ABC at 9:00pm EST, there is a Barbara Walters special and it's titled "Where is Heaven and how do we get there". I thought it might add some different ideas to the conversation here. I'll have to tape it and watch it later.

And on the dating issue, I've been reading Dr. Phil's "Love Smart". It's not bad, but I think it's mostly geared for younger women. Anyone else read it?

I've enjoyed reading all the thoughts here, although I only posted once. It's nice to see so many different opinions expressed in a calm and intellegent manner.

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-31-2000

Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 8:48 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
Newman, try The Lost Art of Compassion by Lorne Ladner. It's a book of basic Buddhism, well grounded in solid contemporary psychology with suggestions for meditations in cultivating not only compassion for others, but inner contentment and happiness. It's on my top ten this year!

Abby7
Member

07-17-2002

Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 4:30 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Abby7 a private message Print Post    
Jeep. I'm hoping the ABC show is interesting. I'll be taping it too.

here is a link about it:

http://tinyurl.com/8e9ty

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 7:24 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
I taped it too. Should we put a thread on it over on TV Shows or just talk about it here?

I'm also thinking I should start a separate thread called: "Traditional Religions vs. Spiritual".

I can't embrace the traditional religions. A lot of it has to do with language. Whenever you try to explain Christianity, say, you have to use the word Him. As if God is a big old man up in Heaven, up in the sky, where there are dogs and cats and all the relatives you liked and all your friends (if they made it)...


Jeep
Member

10-17-2001

Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 10:25 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jeep a private message Print Post    
ARRRRRRGH! I got up this morning to find my tape did not work! I am so disappointed. But I'm still looking forward to you guys discussing it. I did read about it on abc.com so maybe I can still chime in a bit. Geesh!