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Archive through December 22, 2005

The TVClubHouse: General Discussion ARCHIVES: 2006 Mar. ~ 2006 May: Baby Boomers, Living Alone, Changing Habits (ARCHIVES): Archive through December 22, 2005 users admin

Author Message
Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:20 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Well said, Slinkydog. I agree.

That's why the Evangelicals are so obnoxious. They think it's their duty to save the whole world and it has to be THEIR way, the way they see it. I don't want their religion shoved down my throat.

Right now I don't believe in God. I'm like Thomas Jefferson. I believe that Jesus was a good person, had a good philoosophy. I just don't believe that he rose from the dead and not sure about the miracles either.

According to the Evangelicals, if, after I post this, I drop dead of a heart attack, well, I won't get into heaven.

What kind of God is that? My foolish mean spirited cousin gets into heaven just because he has Blind Faith? (Isn't that a rock band?) Why should blind faith be the most important thing in the world, your key to heaven, the only thing that matters? It's not logical. Doesn't make sense. What kind of God would set up a rule like that?

What kind of heaven would it be then?


Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:25 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Slinky, I don't know why I would believe in reincarnation, either. I don't remember any of my past lives, do you? (Of course I can't remember what I had for dinner last night either).

The Buddhist emphasis on karma, being good, doing good things and not bad, makes more sense to me than blind faith.

If we all tried to be better people this world would be a better place. As for heaven, an afterlife, ...

Resortgirl
Member

09-23-2000

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:38 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Resortgirl a private message Print Post    
When I was young I questioned EVERYTHING! Why is the sky blue? The grass green? As I got older I questioned "deeper" things. Why would God take a baby away from his parents? Why do only Catholics go to heaven? (That's what the church taught and it was very hard for me to swallow even at 10 years of age) Why would you have to tell your sins to a man(priest) when you have a direct line to God? (that one got me out in the hall facing a wall for 3 hours) But as I get even older (practically ancient) I find myself just trying to live a good life, love my friends and family, be kind to strangers..... and not questioning why God does what he does. HE has a plan that may not fit MY plans, but I try to do what my "inner voice" tells me to do... and I think that voice is God. He's inside us all... some of us listen and some of us don't. I don't think its wrong to question things at all!! I am just choosing to live a life with faith and hope. I don't belong to any organized religion anymore... I take the things I've learned inside those religions, throw out what doesn't make sense to me and keep the things that do make sense. Right? Wrong? I don't know... I'm just doin' my best like everyone else...

Slinkydog
Member

11-30-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:43 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Slinkydog a private message Print Post    
No, Newman, I don't remember any past lives, either. But if we are reincarnated and if my current life is any indication of my past life, I must have been pretty good most of the time, but certainly not real good all of the time. LOL

I'm curious about whether you were raised in a church or otherwise with any type of religious beliefs. If so, what kind and to what do you attribute the change in your beliefs?

Slinkydog
Member

11-30-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:52 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Slinkydog a private message Print Post    
Excellent post, Resortgirl! I had to laugh when I read, "Why do only Catholics go to heaven?" You see, my church taught that Catholics were definitely going to hell. It is really a shame that any churches would teach their young such things, but it does sort of explain the mindset behind what we are seeing now.

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 7:55 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mocha a private message Print Post    
I can't even go there today.

Schoolmarm
Member

02-18-2001

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 8:14 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Schoolmarm a private message Print Post    
Hell, Mocha? Is that where you can't go?

LOL

Or heaven? Or into this discussion?

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 8:29 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Mocha a private message Print Post    
Into this discussion lol.

Schoolmarm
Member

02-18-2001

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 9:21 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Schoolmarm a private message Print Post    


Yesitsme
Member

08-24-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 9:22 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Yesitsme a private message Print Post    
I consider myself evangelical, but in my mind that means that on one level I don't believe my faith is a private matter. But let me explain because I think I probably see it differently than a lot of people who call themselves evangelical. Personally I hate people who pry into my life and bypass my boundaries and I will never be that sort of person. However, since I consider my faith the essence of who I am, I believe it naturally comes out. I have friends all across the spectrum....from stand-on-the-street-corner evangelicals to atheists. I think all would say I am first respectful of them and their beliefs, whether I agree with them or not. But most who spend much time with me could also probably tell you what I believe. That's because we talk about how we feel about things, not because we obnoxiously try to make the other believe the way we do (I tend to avoid that type of person.) I trust God to speak to people as he (I'm using the generic "he" Newman!) sees fit. If a conversation with me ever helps someone, great, but I am not responsible for bringing anyone to God even in that event. I think sometimes Christians start to think that it is their job to save the world and that is when their faith offends.

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 9:29 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
Slinky:
I find it hard to believe that for the past 2000 years no jews, catholics, etc. have gone to heavan. But, when I asked my gramma that she said, that she thought that none have gone. I don't buy it. Something isn't right there.

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 9:44 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
You know, I always felt bad for kids who were Jehova's witnesses.......

Slinkydog
Member

11-30-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 9:56 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Slinkydog a private message Print Post    
Yesitsme, thank you for sharing. I've often thought that the people who make the most compelling case for Christianity or the existence of God are those in whom you can see the goodness, happiness, compassion, genuiness and love. Sounds like you might be one of those people.

Escapee, I don't buy it either.

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:00 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
Part of the difference for me is prayer. Do you know someone who prays for you or at you? I try to remember that. Do people use religion as a weapon, as a tool, as a scare tactic? That's not religion, no matter what.

Jeep
Member

10-17-2001

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:21 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jeep a private message Print Post    
I was brought up Catholic, went to a Catholic school with the nuns and all that. I don't ever remember anyone telling me that only Catholics can go to heaven. I must have been asleep the day they taught that. I even married a non-Catholic in a Catholic church. The priest never brought up anything about my hubby must convert to go to heaven. The only requirement the priest had was that future hubby had been baptized.....in any church anywhere. That was it. I am very suprised (and appalled) to read here that people were taught otherwise. I'm like most of you, I don't buy it.

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 10:46 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
Yesitsme....I agree with you on what you said. I too have several friends of various religious and spiritual beliefs. I was never taught that specific religions are going to hell. I was taught that it doesn't matter what religion you are...everyone can go to heaven.

I've never attended a "fire and brimstone" church and don't understand religions that teach fear and hell.

As far as children...I was taught there is an age of accountability...a person must be able to understand before they are accountable for their sins. (So to speak)

I also came to the understanding...(I wasn't taught) that the Jews have a special place in God's eyes. Had the Jews not rejected Jesus as the Messiah, the rest of the world...(the pagans of the time) would not have learned about Christ.
I believe God has a special purpose for Jews who will be in heaven.

None of my fellow Born-again Christians, that I know, are the type to shove our beliefs down someone's throat.
Jesus never taught with fear or force. Jesus never shoved God down people's throats. He was gentle, loving, compassionate, and forgiving. I'd like to think that is how others view me....loving, compassionate and forgiving.

Politically, I'm certainly not a right wing conservative. I'm more liberal than anything.

I too dislike man-made organized religion. I believe Christianity is an individual, personal relationship with God/Jesus that anybody of ANY religion can have. It's not my job to tell people if they are going to heaven or hell. I don't know...only God does.

I also grew up with the American Missionary Fellowship being a big part of my life. The individual I knew that was a missionary affiliated with them was a family friend of over 40 years.
This man, Frank King...his missionary work has always involved teaching children, holding sunday school classes for kids in small towns in Montana.
He now works in nursing homes in the area. He plays music(the piano or accordian), makes balloon animals and sings worship songs. He doesn't preach or shove religion down peoples throats. Frank spreads charity and love and joy. If people ask...he talks about his beliefs.

Perhaps I was a little offended by the "obnoxious" comment.

SOME Evangelicals are obnoxious. Heck, some people are obnoxious....religion and faith don't matter.

Sorry for babbling.

Slinkydog
Member

11-30-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 11:47 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Slinkydog a private message Print Post    
You're not one of the obnoxious ones, Kearie, so don't be offended. I don't think Newman really meant to stereotype all evangelicals, but he is out delivering the mail and will have to tell us later.

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:21 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
Kearie
Great post. The bible says that the jews are the "apple of jesus' eye". My family is quite religious. My aunt is 7th day Adventist and my Gramma and Grampa used to go to the Methodist church, but now go to a Nazarene church, pretty much the same thing, though.

They argue constantly regarding the differences in belief.

Smartly, I stay out of it because some people are entirely toooooo overbearing when it comes to their religion.
Everyone thinks that they are right and their way is the right way and there is no other way.

IMO, you should follow no one other than God and the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Not Joseph Smith, not Ellen Gould White, Not Pat Robertson, Not anyone. To me, these are false prophets. They make you believe what they believe for their own agendas.

I think that a lot of religions overlook that. Cut out the middle man, yall. Don't put anyone between you and Jesus/God.

Brenda1966
Member

07-03-2002

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:28 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Brenda1966 a private message Print Post    
Some of my "church" stories...

My mom went to Catholic school. She had to walk by a Jewish school on the way. The nuns told them that Jews had little horns under their yamaka's (which I have NO idea how to spell) so my mom was afraid to walk by there and certainly never spoke to them. Very sad.

I had to go to CCD classes (relgious training for Catholics) once a week. I was the kid that sat in class asking "If adam and eve where white, where did black people and asian people come from?" "If adam and eve had 2 sons, how can we all be descendants of them?" They were telling us the stories were literal, but couldn't back it up in my mind. Only later, when I was about 13, did a CCD teacher say "they are only STORIES, not to be taken literally". By then it was too late -- I had already checked out.

One thing that did it for me as a kid was to be told by a CCD teacher that animals did not go to heaven. Bull! Not buying into any religion like that. No thanks.

Looking back, I never really believed. I was always skeptical, asking questions, and never got answers that satisfied me. I found it all a complete and utter bore.

Newman
Member

09-25-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:44 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Newman a private message Print Post    
Actually I have the day off but I have so many chores to do today.

I now realize that my tendency to generalize seems to offend people. Huh...go figure. Who knew?

Resortgirl, interesting post. That's my problem with organized religion. Some of it (most of it) makes no sense to me. If part of it makes no sense then, I'm thinking, maybe the whole thing is flawed.

Loved your comment about facing a wall for three hours for asking a perfectly good question.

Remember when our parents told us, "You'll understand when you get older." Maybe they didn't want to explain something, or couldn't, so they used that coverall sentence. Well, I'm older now. I'm not going to get any smarter than I am right now, in fact, it's probably going to go in the other direction soon, LOL!

Yesitsme, that's the part that confuses me. I thought Evangelicals HAVE TO prosyletize. They have found the lord and naturally they want people they know and meet to find Him also. That's the pushy nature of Evangelists (not meaning to offend) that actually pushes me away. If I want to know about God, and I do, then I will seek Him out. I don't want telemarketers calling me at night or Evangelists pushing their form of religion on me, unasked. (oops, this part was supposed to be last. I started with the next paragraph...)

I sped read thru this section. Kearie, you are hardly obnoxious. I tend to be put off by aggressive people, or relgious people who try to shove their religion down your throat. I'm like you, Kearie. Not really sure what an Evangelist is. Found out that Gary Hart who I like very much politically goes to the same church as James Dobson, the right wing Evangelist, who I dislike very much. How can that happen???


Jimmer
Member

08-30-2000

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jimmer a private message Print Post    
I remember going to church when I was little and the minister saying over and over again how we were all sinners. I remember leaving the church completely depressed – all along I thought that I had been a nice little boy!

On a more serious note, I’m completely confused by some of the Christian comments being made here. I'll be the first to say that I don't know a lot about this but I thought that Christianity clearly stated that the only way to salvation was through the recognition of Christ as the Lord?

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:49 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
That is true, Jimmer. Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the light. No one comes to the father, but by me." (don't ask the verse, I don't know)

Escapee
Member

06-15-2004

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:49 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Escapee a private message Print Post    
But unfortunately, that is lost in some religions who feel they need to follow the teachings of others to get to Jesus, and that isn't true.

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:53 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
Just curious....what do people think of Scientology?

(You guys haven't been to the Animal Farm lately...I'm pretty obnoxious there) LOL

Thanks Newman, Escape and Slinky. I won't be offended. :-)

Jimmer
Member

08-30-2000

Thursday, December 22, 2005 - 12:58 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jimmer a private message Print Post    
Based on comments in other threads regarding Tom Cruise, I would say that either Tom has given Scientology a bad name in the eyes of some people and/or some people really think that it’s pretty weird.

I don’t know a lot about it myself. What I can say is that we know some people who are Scientology members and you couldn’t meet nicer people.