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Glenn
Member
07-05-2003
| Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 12:56 pm
Here is a question for you Newman. Do you find you gather more information by listening to radio or reading the exchanges made through posts on this message board? I have been listening to talk radio periodically over the last few weeks to see what was being discussed and to get a better idea of what it is like. I found much more intelligent replies on this message board than the things I heard over the radio. I am now content to go back to the conversations in my head and leave the radio off.
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Marysafan
Member
08-07-2000
| Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 1:16 pm
Dealing with adult children is very different from dealing with children who haven't yet reached adulthood. Prior to leaving home, it is your job to try to raise them, give them guidance, teach them values, etc. After they reach adulthood, it is no longer your responsibility. It's theirs. Every person has the right to live their own life, make their own mistakes, and in the making of those mistakes... grow. If you continue to treat adult children as if they still need your help, you not only cheat them, you alienate them. You are sending them a message that says, "I really don't think you are smart enough to figure this our for yourself." No one likes being told what choices to make. Reaching adulthood means you have earned the right to make your own choices. It's a hard, hard lesson in parenting...knowing when to let go. My daughters had a very serious falling out last year that is still not repaired. The underlying cause is that the older cannot accept her younger sister as an equal. She keeps trying to be the older, know-it-all, "smarter than you" one. As a result, she makes her younger sister feel inferior. And the younger sister doesn't want to play the younger, therefore dumber role anymore. Who does? At some point, you have to learn to allow adults to be adults. And for parents, that means keeping hands off, and a lot of biting of one's tongue...and never, ever ever uttering the words..."I told you so." Just because your children do things differently than you would, doesn't make them wrong. It just means that they are living their own lives. Whenever, my daughters ask for advice, I always end it with "of course...it's your decision. I can't make your decisions for you. You have to live your own life." Just like this falling out. It's their problem, they are going to have to figure out how to resolve it on their own. I'm Switzerland. If you want an adult relationship with your adult children, then you will have to learn to treat them like the adults they have become. I don't expect anyone to take my advice...just sharing what worked for us.
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Yesitsme
Member
08-24-2004
| Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 2:50 pm
Oldtex, your relationship sounds a lot like my parents....they've been married 48 years now and my mom claims that while there are times when they drove each other crazy enough to divorce, usually those were the times when things like lack of money made it an unviable option. Now they get along well, and not only love each other but like each other. They were walking towards me at an event one night and one of my friends said to me "Do your parents always do that?" To which I said "What?" She said "Hold hands. You don't see that much these days, especially with older couples." Astounded me because I hadn't realized that it was rare! OK....I am going to a singles event at a church tonight. I hate going to them, but feel that I need to occasionally so that I appreciate staying home. But I won't be as brave as you, Newman...I am going with a friend and know at least one more friend who will be there. And there are supposed to be around 150-200 people there, so maybe there will be someone I will relate to. I don't generally go to these things with hopes of meeting men, since that seems to make me more nervous and adds a pressure I think is unnecessary. But I would like more single friends, male and female, who would like to do things. Why is that so hard to find the older you get? I give advice all of the time, asked for or not. Have even been known to advise strangers. My friends know I will always have an opinion (lol....I guess that proves some of you guys are my friends.) Hopefully I am not obnoxious about it (and if I am, I would appreciate being told so!), and I really am fine with people not taking it. I figure that's why we are here....to help each other out. I know I have taken advice from people often....though sometimes not right when they give it, but when it works best for me.
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Dogdoc
Member
09-29-2001
| Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 4:18 pm
Yesitsme, thank you for writinng "I figure that's why we are here .... to help each other out." It is so true. We are here on earth to help each other out . We are here on this board to help each other out. Every person we come in contact with is someone we can encourage or discourage. I think that the advice given here is meant as encouragement. Giving advice is a form of showing you care. Otherwise why would you bother.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 1:40 am
I agree, mostly we give advice because we care, and usually because we care about the good of the person we advise (not always, sometimes people advise someone for the comfort of the advisor because positive changes in the advisee might threaten the advisor).. But no matter how well-meant the advise and altruistic the intent.. advice is one of those things that, if freely given, must be freely taken as well. Of course there can be a limit IF the person keeps asking FOR advise, ignoring it and failing to succeed and then asking again.. that's about the time when the Dr Phil mantra is appropriate "How's THAT workin' for you?" And still, often, we may love the person even while hating their actions.
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Wargod
Moderator
07-16-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 3:15 am
I think that's one of the biggest things we teach our kids, Sea. We will always love you but we may not always like your actions. It's a difficult one too with younger kids.
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 5:00 am
But so important for them to know, the young ones, because so often they just think they are bad.
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Wargod
Moderator
07-16-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 10:11 am
Exactly Sea, they often can't distinguish between someones bad behaviour and the person. Someone did something bad so he's bad and we have to say, no, he's not bad, his action was. Caleb was the hardest kid to teach that to and it took constant reminding that just because he'd gotten in trouble didn't mean he was a bad kid it meant he did something that wasn't acceptable, that his action was wrong.
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Newman
Member
09-25-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 1:27 pm
Glenn, that's the beauty of this site. It helps with my balance issues. I get a lot more info from Air America radio but that's current events info. This Gen. Disc. site talks about feelings. You don't get that so much on the radio. There was a time in my 20s and 30s when I would listen to radio shrinks on radio. This is better in the sense of the give and take, the feedback. Plus here you can be specific about your own problem rather than listen to Dr. Phil and hope he talks about an issue similar to yours. Glenn, I'd say stick to what's working for you. I have a similar problem at work. I used to want to listen to a book on tape, when I had a bookclub there, in the morning, when I sort mail. Now the bookclub is gone. Maybe I should use that morning time to just listen to my self, process things, sort my own crap out? Again, it's my search for balance. I could listen to books on tape at the health club or when I go for a walk after work. God knows I listen to enough talk radio while driving the postal vehicle.
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Newman
Member
09-25-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 1:36 pm
Marysafan, just read your first sentence and am wagging my head up and down. That's why this is the Baby Boomer site. Our kids are grown by now (usually). But they're still our kids but they have their own set of problems. Values. Hopefully we all taught them good values. I wish I had done a better job with that but I always was too busy fighting with the Ex. Values. ... So relate to your post, Mary. My adult kids don't talk to each other or even email. And the younger ones HATE being big brothered by the oldest. But now the oldest is headed for Iraq. Both younger ones have shown an interest in either calling him (so they write me) or emailing him. I want them to. I hope they do. But it is up to them...
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Newman
Member
09-25-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 1:48 pm
Yesitsme, maybe you wouldn't be so nervous if you had a drink or two before you went to the singles thing <chuckling, couldn't resist the nudge>. I think it's harder because we are older and more set in our ways. Those cliches exist for a reason. They're true. My church has a singles thing, every week, also. A brunch deal. Maybe I'll get up the nerve to go to it one day. For men it's harder because we have that Playboy Playmate vision in our head. What woman in their 50s looks like that?! And if she did, why would she want me? So compromise is in order. From a male perspective I think we are less willing to compromise. It's hard to get turned on by someone who is 40 pounds overweight say <just being honest>. On the other hand sex isn't as important now (speaking for myself in my 50s). But it still IS important! Personally I'm comfortable living alone. I'm used to it. It seems stupid and selfish, but I'm used to it. It would take quite a lot to get me to want to live with a woman again. Just thinking aloud here... Yesitsme, I think you should tone down giving unsolicited advice. That's my advice <said with tongue in cheek, but I'm serious>. I'm trying to learn that lesson myself, so I think you should learn it with me. It's for the best...I think...
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Yesitsme
Member
08-24-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 5:06 pm
I don't think advice is as threatening to people if they know that you aren't going to keep an account as to whether they take it. I don't seem to annoy people much with my advice giving. I think they know that I give my opinion if a topic is brought up, but I don't usually look for things to advise them about. There are days when I would prefer not to give advice at all....and today was one of them. I spent most of the afternoon talking to a male relative with marital problems (yes, he came to me!) Of course, it is the kind of problem with no perfect solution....and finally after we had gone around in circles for hours, I had to tell him that. I told him that one of the things about life is that sometimes there are negatives with every solution. Few are black or white. You have to decide what is most important to you and go for the path that best heads you that way. I may go into more later to get some input from you guys, but for now I am tired of it all! I don't know how many times I said to him "You can't change another person....you can only change you." What's interesting is that one of the things that I know about myself is that there are certain things in marriage that would drive me absolutely nuts and financial irresponsibility is one of them...and that is part of her problem. It was so tempting to just agree with him, but I also don't think that would help anyone. So I constantly tried to bring it all back to what he could do to deal with it all.... and I'm exhausted! Yep, I do occasionally get lonely being single, but a bad marriage is far, far worse. The singles thing last night wasn't bad at all. No Newman, no drink before I went. One thing I liked about it was that as soon as you hit the door, they had people stationed every few feet to welcome you (it was a long hallway to where we were going.) And it didn't seem forced... they did seem glad to see you. LOL...at one time I was talking to one of my two friends that were there and she was complaining how at these things people don't speak to you (she had done early with a friend of hers that was helping out with the food and I think she got there before these people were in place.) At that very moment one of the greeter guys that I had been talking to on my way in came up to us and started talking. LOL...she was shocked. As he walked away she looked at me and said "OK, I spoke too soon." People were nice and I think we may have even found a group of people to go hiking with. One of the things I have really wanted to find in this area, so I am excited about that. I am going to miss next month (they meet the first Saturday of the month) because I am going to Louisville to my friend's Derby party, but they are going to have a progressive dinner where you get a number at every course and have to sit at that table. I think that would be a fun way to meet people, so I am disappointed I can't be there. I'd way prefer that to a three minute date!
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Jimmer
Moderator
08-30-2000
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 6:28 pm
I like that comment about giving advice, but not keeping an account on whether people take it or not. Some people are bothered by any advice, but I think most people are only bothered when people continue to pressure them to take their advice. So offer advice, but don’t force it on people. And that is great advice Yesitsme!!! 
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Kearie
Member
07-21-2005
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:20 pm
Newman wrote, "For men it's harder because we have that Playboy Playmate vision in our head. What woman in their 50s looks like that?! And if she did, why would she want me?" "So compromise is in order. From a male perspective I think we are less willing to compromise. It's hard to get turned on by someone who is 40 pounds overweight say <just being honest>." I read that and my jaw hit the floor. It made me want to scream. "We Men"....I pray not all men like are like that. Yet I struggle with believing men are just that way. 40 Lbs isn't that much in today's society. I keep praying that I will meet a man that isn't like that, because most I have met, are that way. Now Newman flat out says is. Where is the hope for women who are single and not "perfect tens" if all men really want that and expect that? Do single guys really look for trophy wives as they age and their bellies grow? Their hair thins? It's just not right and I'm a wee bit angry about it.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:30 pm
I was too Kearie but I wasn't going to say anything, glad you did. And being an overweight person, that kinda hurt.
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Ddr
Member
08-19-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:34 pm
Yeah but Kearie and Mocha, would you really fall in love with a man who may think that? I think not. And keep in mind a trophy wife may be looking more at the wallet than the belly, lol.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:34 pm
I don't think Newman speaks for all men, in fact, I know he doesn't. We all certainly have our own personal preferences, and are entitled to. But it would be a mistake to think everyone has the same criteria. Newman does have a point tho. Our society certainly emphasizes the thin, sleek, perfect bodies of centerfolds. That's the problem. Not what one guy thinks, but what society is trying to tell them to think.
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Cndeariso
Member
06-28-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:42 pm
there are so many things that are running through my head after reading that, kearie & mocha, that it may be hard to put them all down into words here on this board. but, i will try. i found a lot of what newman stated to be very true on the internet dating boards, the newspaper dating services and other match making venues. a lot of men are looking for that perfect Barbie. and, a lot of them say so in their ads. a lesser number (from what i saw) of women are looking for the perfect Ken. it seems to me that the fashion industry, magazines, TV, & the movies perpetuate love only with six-pack abs and cellulite free thighs. anything less than perfect (or airbrushed to be so) doesn't make it in those worlds from what i have observed. sex sells. and, some equate that perfect body with sex and nothing less will trip their trigger. is that fair? hell, no! i for one have never been that superficial even when i was the perfect size with the perfect body. i look at the whole package. being overweight or out of shape doesn't make a person undesireable in my opinion. actions override looks any day of the week in my book.
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Dogdoc
Member
09-29-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:48 pm
Taking Kearie's and Mocha's hands. Yes. I read that 40 pound comment that Newman said and was afraid to respond until they did. I am not overweight but good grief does it really matter if somebody is overweight. Does that make them someone you would be embarassed to be seen with and hence not a "trophy." Good luck in your search for the perfect woman.I hope YOU are handsome enough to turn that women on.
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Kearie
Member
07-21-2005
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 7:54 pm
I couldn't fall in love with someone like that. But knowing that society, media and men put so much emphasis on "perfect female bodies" that puts pressure on me. My daughter is trying to get perfect boobies. She's afraid of being fat...but she got that from me. Trying not to be fat has been a conscious thought all my life. How do I overcome this when so many men seem to think that way and society is based on that view. Hollywood glorifies it. If I'm fat, no one will want me because I'm ugly. If I have a decent body, someone might want me. Crazy thoughts I have that are perpetuated by stereotypes and what I think men will accept. I become obsessive about staying thin...not healthy. I have to be this way... or I have to be that way... My brain doesn't count. My values don't count. Only the body counts. Just a thin persons opinion on this subject. (I struggle with anorexia also)
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Whoami
Member
08-03-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 8:00 pm
I wish I was only 40 pounds overweight. 
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Cndeariso
Member
06-28-2004
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 8:04 pm
i know that i am sexy therefore i do not worry about my weight. i ooze sex appeal. i am confident about who i am and don't need anyone to validate me. if someone has a problem with my looks or my weight/shape then it is their problem and i really don't need them in my life.
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Mocha
Member
08-12-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 8:05 pm
True dat D and thankfully it wasn't an issue for the men I've dealt with.
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Dogdoc
Member
09-29-2001
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 8:07 pm
After posting I decided that I shouldn't have gotten mad at Newman for being honest. No man like he is will want me. I am a Republican (there, I said it). I am way past my prime ( 62). I have never been good looking. I am short 5'2" I don't go out of my way to look feminine. But I did have a boyfriend who enjoyed being with me. He liked my sense of humor. He always treated me with respect. I am not looking for a dates any more but I just had a man flirt with me in a bookstore today. I am doing fine by myself.
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Kearie
Member
07-21-2005
| Sunday, April 02, 2006 - 8:13 pm
<Throwing tomatoes at the Biped for the political party> Other than that, ditto on the short thing. 
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