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Archive through September 16, 2004

The TVClubHouse: General Discussions ARCHIVES: 2004 Nov. - 2005 Jan.: Parenting Place {ARCHIVES}: Feeding/snacking advice: Archive through September 16, 2004 users admin

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Graceunderfyre
Member

01-22-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 11:52 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Ok, so this is partly about my kid and partly about other people's kids. I run before and after care programs for the YMCA and I have always had the philosophy that if you give kids too many choices it just causes too much headache. So generally at snack time I will give kids 2 or 3 items to choose from and that's it.

This year, my site only has 8 kids so it's hard to give choices on everything since the YMCA buys everything in bulk and if we don't finish something, I have to figure out how to store it with my very limited space and funds for storage containers.

Yesterday was National Peanut Day so there was a choice of chips or fluffernutters (a spoonful of peanut butter dipped in marshmallow fluff). Most of the kids asked for pure fluff so I said if they were going to have the fluffernutter, they had to have the whole kit and kaboodle because the peanut butter is what makes the snack somewhat healthy. So one 2nd grader thought she'd outsmart me and ate all the fluff and threw out the peanutbutter. Then to top it, she came back to the table to show off that she'd done it. After telling her that I wouldn't do special snacks if she didn't eat it the way it is served, I decided to speak to her mom about it at pickup time.

When mom came in, I got half way through the story and mom basically said "well she doesn't have to eat the snack you serve, that's fine with me." "if she doesn't want to eat it, you don't have to force her to eat it." then she turned around and repeated the same thing to her daughter in front of me. My staff and I were completely annoyed that the woman didn't listen to us and missed out that she threw out food in an attempt to one up the adults in the room AND that she just gave her daughter permission to complain that she doesn't like what we serve.

So here's question 1. Am I being too strict with these kids? Should I just let them sit there and not eat anything if they don't like what I serve? I can't be serving 12 different things to 8 kids, it's just not cost effective nor do I have a desire to be a personal chef to them all.

Here's question #2. At what age do you start telling children they need to eat what's on their plate? My son is 13 months and if he doesn't feel like eating a hamburger, he won't eat it. Am I setting myself up for a picky eater?

Texannie
Member

07-16-2001

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 12:09 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Well, we don't make our kids clean their plates and they are 15(almost) and 10! LOL We have always had the rule that they must taste everything and if they look at something and say "yuck" before they eat it, their time at the family table is now over.
BUT, that being said. This wasn't about WHAT the child was eating, but more about testing your authority. The mother did miss the point, and I would have told her that.

As to snack..choice of 2 or none at all is perfectly reasonable.

Danas15146
Member

03-31-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 12:14 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
We have a "taste three bits" rule -- if you don't like it you don't have to finish. We don't make our kids clean their plates (and I will confess to becoming a short order cook when I get concerned they are not eating enough)

I agree to two or three choices for snack. The only excuse for that girl would have been her saying to you that she was alergic to peanuts - but it sounds like she was just testing everyone's limits and her mom just let her get away with it.

Secretsmile
Member

08-19-2002

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 12:26 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I was extremely lucky with my kids, they were not picky eaters, even though one tried to be. My rule was simple, if you don't eat what I fix, then you go without until the next meal is served.

I did home day care and simply couldn't afford to spend that much time away from the little ones to fix more than one meal or snack. (We all know how much mischief kids can get into while you are busy in the kitchen.)

As far as for family suppers, I did two things. One was each child got to pick one meal a week, this helped me with menu planning, and it made the kids aware their tastes did count. The other thing I made sure of was that there was something on the plate they liked, even if it was someone else's favorite meal.

Sillycalimomma
Member

11-13-2003

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 1:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I got really lucky with my dd as well. She will eat or at least try just about anything (in fact one of her favorite snacks is edamame!)I feel it may have helped that when she was a baby the first baby foods I started her on were homemade purees of green beans and such-she didn't get her first taste of anything sweet until about two months later-I wanted to get her taste buds into veggies first.
Anyway-on the other hand mu nephew is the pickiest eater ever and he is pretty small for his age. His parents gave up early on on trying to get him to eat healthy and just settled on getting him to eat.
Proper nutrition is not only important for their growing bones and minds but for their future health as well. Perhaps you can make some sort of flyer to send home to the parents explaining this and that your facility would like to insure that the children are exposed to healthy eating habits. Oh and maybe you can mention the fact that snacks will be a group thing and it is important not to waste products in order to keep the facility running and able to provide all the wonderful services you do. A general flyer will let all the parents know the situation without tarketing anyone specifically.

As a side note-the snacks I have found to always work with my picky eater of a nephew are always finger foods-like grapes, string cheese,artichokes(yep!) and anything that requires dipping or that can change color (like some of the new applesauces out there now)

ok...done babbling....

Whoami
Member

08-03-2001

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 1:21 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
When this kind of topic comes up, I'm always reminded of two instances where I watched interesting interactions between child/parent concerning food.

One was an old bf of my older sis. He had his son over with him, and invited sis, me, mom and other sis to spend the night at his cabin in the mountains. He was all excited to make an impression on us I think, and got up early and made a lovely extravagant breakfast with just about everything on the table to chose from.

His son (about 8 at the time) sat at the table with arms folded and slouched in perfect pout position as he refused to eat anything set before him. He demanded blueberry pancakes (to this day I think he had to survey the table to see what wasn't on there so he could demand that item). BF got up, abandoned his own meal (and his guests) to fix his son a special serving of blueberry pancakes. Whatever impression he thought he had been making to us with his lovely home and extravagant breakfast was soon sullied by his catering to his son's tantrum.

Another friend had me over for lunch about a year ago. She fixed her two year old son a plate of fish sticks and fries, and he said he wanted fruit (grapes I believe). She refused to give him the healthy fruit, and said he must eat at least one of his deep-fried in fat fish parts formed into the shape of a stick before he was allowed to have any of that healthy stuff. OK, that's not how she said it. I just had to LOL though that the kid wanted a healthy snack, and she was insisting he eat junk!

Teachmichigan
Member

07-22-2001

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 2:37 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Yikes....the flyer idea sounds like the most polite way to deal w/ the mom. Bet she'll be paying the price for her indulgences when her little prima donna hits the teenage years!! (And wouldn't you like to be a fly on the wall at that point!)

We have the "three bites" rule too...and since DS for the past 1 1/2 yrs. (since DS turned 8), I've refused to be the short order cook. If he wants to fix something else, he's welcome too...and I always make sure we have at least one item w/ the meal that he likes, but I got tired REALLY quickly of the cook two meals for three people routine. However, I also believe in "picking your battles" and didn't want to turn meal time into a battlefield.

One thing that works very well for us, is the "parts" option. Often, DH and I will have a pasta dish that DS doesn't like because of the combo...but he'll eat the pasta AND he'll eat the veggies...as long as I don't mix them! LOL

Karuuna
Member

08-31-2000

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 4:10 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Something to remember in these issues is that kids' tastebuds are much much more sensitive than those of adults. I suppose ours get so much abuse over time, they die out on us. :-)

I never force my child to eat what's on his plate. I do ask him to try ONE bite of new things. I use one bite because once i asked him to try sweet potatoes and they were so awful to him, it made him gag and throw up right on his plate.

If he doesn't like what I fixed, he *always* has the choice to make his own dinner (he's ten now). I have a few things he can easily make himself, and he's fine with doing it. When he was younger, he had one alternative - a peanut butter and jelly sandwich (on 100% whole wheat bread).

I personally think that in this country, the whole idea of forcing kids to eat what's in front of them (especially the clean your plate rule) is a leading cause of obesity. We don't listen to our bodies, and instead eat when we are not hungry, and we eat what doesn't even taste good.

We're also artificially regulated into a kind of three meals a day routine. Again, eat because it's *time* to eat, not because your body is hungry at that moment.

I"m not saying you have to serve a dozen choices at snack time. But I would consider having a supply of fresh fruit, and saying if you don't want the snack we're offering, you can pick from the fruit bowl.

Kids sometimes get the best of you. That happens. Better to find alternative ways of dealing with it. I would have chastised the child for her lack of manners & dishonesty, rather than her lack of eating.



Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 4:22 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I do make my kids eat their veggies but only 2 spoonfulls.

Landi
Member

07-29-2002

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 4:57 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
i'm the pickiest eater of all of my family. my husband will eat just about anything. and since holly goes shopping with me, we plan the menus together. i will never push the "eat what is on your plate" to her.i had that happen to me, and i have the worst gag reflex. i used to spend hours sometimes at the dinner table. i just wasn't hungry, and sitting down with the family at the dinner table made me a jumble of nerves.

in the case of the ymca snacks, i'd offer 2 to 3 snacks. if they don't want those, well, sorry, but that is what is being offered. if they only want to eat the fluff and throw away their peanut butter, that was THEIR choice. that was THEIR snack. once you gave it to that child, it was no longer the YMCA's but it was that child's snack. they could have thrown the dang thing completely away.


Julieboo
Member

02-05-2002

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 5:08 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I agree with Kar. I think it is a bad idea to force kids to eat. I even think 3 spoonfuls forced is too much.

But then again I have the picky-est eater in the world. So you might not want to count what I have to say in the kids eating arena

He basically eats one of the following things for dinner:
1. pizza (but he takes the cheese off so it's just tomato sauce and crust),
2. the carrots and potatoes from Dinty Moore's beef stew (not from anywhere else except maybe a KFC chicken pot pie-and only the carrots and potatoes-all bits of meat must be removed),
3. chicken nuggets and/or
4. a pbj.

Uggh!

Julieboo
Member

02-05-2002

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 5:12 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I also agree with Landi about the kid being able to eat just a part of the snack... Maybe if they didn't eat it all then they don't get a second...but that's about it.

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-22-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 6:34 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Thanks for all the advice guys, this is great.

Karuuna I used to agree with you about not eating 3 meals a day until I gained about 50 pounds over the pas 5 years because I don't eat regularly enough. I have spent the past year trying to get back onto a schedule of sorts, but it's very difficult since I've never lived by one. Your body does need food every 3 hours or so (lots of medical reports on this) and if you don't eat, it will store up fat. I am a very active person and I can go for a day or two without eating and this happens without me paying attention to it (because I am always running around at full speed). So as a result of not eating on a schedule of sorts, I am wicked overweight :-( I had myself on a schedule for about 3 months at the beginning of the year before I moved and lost about 20 pounds by the summer, but after moving I haven't been able to get back into the schedule and it's mostly all back.

I really like the flyer idea, I will cross it by my boss to make sure she's ok with it.

Oh and to be totally honest, none of the counselors would have even noticed (nor cared) that this girl threw out the pb spoon if she hadn't come over to brag about it. I think that's what really got us.

Danas15146
Member

03-31-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 7:08 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Julie - I take the cheese off my pizza too. LOL! Usually DH or Samantha take the cheese and toppings from mine to add to their own.

Reader234
Member

08-13-2000

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 7:36 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Grace, I'm going to come at this at a totally different place...

I worked in afterschool care (many more than 12!) and my dd goes to after care...

Do you put up your menus? You sound very organized, and loving and caring of course!! We were required by our state to post the snacks for the month - yep one whole month... so if we offerec themetic (which we did!) snacks we also gave 2 choices... the parents, and the kids knew in advance... so again, this is in line with your thoughts in it eliminates those choices... however every now and again we had a parent that wanted to bring thier own snack, fine, but it had to be "healthy" and it had to come from our list of "healthy snacks" (or you bet you would have cookies, pop tarts etc!)

As for me and my family, due to food "issues" (or abuse - have you ever had to sit at a table for 3 hours? Have you ever had your hair pulled and food shoved down your throat - I swear I will never make food an issue, and you bet I get frustrated, and you bet I doubt I did the right thing, but I did the only thing i could)

That having been said, it sounds like the incident you cited was a classic power struggle, she was daring you to get angry, she saw your "line in the sand" (that is, eat the peanut butter) and she crossed it, now what? It sounds like she will continue to keep you on your toes!! (no there are no "perfect" solutions, or answers, just more and more questions!)

Juju2bigdog
Member

10-27-2000

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 7:47 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Good point on the juvenile taste buds, Kar. Children do have a lot more taste buds than adults. On top of that, there are people, science now acknowledges, who are super tasters. They have more taste buds than normal, and they can taste certain chemical compounds that the vast majority of people cannot taste. I have never been tested, but I know I must be one of them. Have you ever been sick and thrown up so much that you had nothing left to throw up and then you threw up some blackish green stuff? Remember how horrible that was? That is just what broccoli, asparagus, cooked cauliflower, and brussels sprouts taste like to me. Now, obviously, if they tasted like that to other people, nobody would eat them, but lots of people do eat those things, even love them. I was forced to eat as a child. It was pure agony with a lot of things. I am STILL pissed off about it.

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-22-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 8:02 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
yeah I am one of those people with sensitive taste buds. . . or maybe I'm just picky cuz I don't like reheated food. I can taste the difference. I also can taste too much junk in certain tap waters (and some mineral waters) which make me throw up and get REALLY sick.

Karuuna
Member

08-31-2000

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 9:33 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Grace, just to clarify, when I said we are forced to eat 3 meals a day on schedule, which goes against trying to identify our body needs, I meant something a little different.

The natural course is for us to eat smaller meals more frequently. Forcing ourselves to eat on a schedule that's out of sync with the natural rhythms of our body is what screws us up. And especially eating that big meal at the end of the day when we are least active.

I wasn't advocating skipping meals, sorry for being unclear.

And thanks for saying that about reheated foods. Drives me crazy that my son won't do that, even with his favorite foods. It's helpful to realize that it really must taste different to him.

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-22-2004

Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 9:48 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
oh yeah there's a real difference Karuuna. . . dh used to think I was crazy, but now he just enjoys the food he gets to himself.

Maris
Member

03-28-2002

Wednesday, September 15, 2004 - 3:35 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I think your YMCA should reexamine their snacks. As a parent I would not be happy that my kid was being given potato chips or fluff, regardless of whether it is tempered with peanut butter. Some kids just dont like peanut butter.

I think the mother was wrong to tell the child in front of you that she didnt have to eat something if she didnt want to because it sounds to me like she was trying to make some sort of point with you. Is this the first time that you have had to discuss issues about this child with the parent?

As far as what the child did, I probably wouldnt have made such a big issue out of it. It is afterschool. The kids have been in school all day and need to relax a bit and I think that there should certainly be discipline when it is warranted but I just dont see the food thing as something to make a case out of.

I probably wouldn't have spoken to the parent about it. I just looked at the situation in terms of myself coming to pick my kid up at the end of a workday, I am on a schedule and I have someone telling me my kid didnt eat all the snack. I am not hearing the part about showing off, I am probably already tuning it out and thinking alright so the kid didnt want the snack. The mother was wrong but I would drop it.

If you send a flyer home, that mother as well as others may very well come back with complaints about the junk being served to their kids in afterschool.

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Wednesday, September 15, 2004 - 9:08 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    

quote:

that she just gave her daughter permission to complain that she doesn't like what we serve.





quote:

mom basically said "well she doesn't have to eat the snack you serve, that's fine with me." "if she doesn't want to eat it, you don't have to force her to eat it."




This isn't giving her daughter permission to complain it's saying she doesn't have to eat it if she doesn't like it or want it but she's not telling her daughter to complain. Sorry if this was already mentioned.

I agree with Maris that you very well might get complaints about the kinds of snacks being served. But then again you may not but it's something to consider.

Graceunderfyre
Member

01-22-2004

Wednesday, September 15, 2004 - 9:27 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Well personally I hope they do complain about the snacks because I think they are horrible. But I don't really get enough money to cover the arts n crafts I do with the kids. At my old Y, we were responsible for our own snacks and this was all so much less of a headache. Every site has different taste buds and my kids are def. into healthier stuff. But my hands are tied - though I did talk to my boss about it and she gave me money to buy fruit this week. It's a small step, but it's something.

As far as the fluff goes, it was a one time deal, I don't do that all the time, so I don't see the problem with it.

As far as the confrontation goes, I should say that there is a history with this girl always trying to test and with her stealing and lying to all of us. A few weeks ago, she told her mom that we don't serve snack anymore and mom came and yelled at us in front of the kids without asking if it was true. So that's why I made a point to tell her what was up. Every day there is at least one kid that chooses not to eat snack and I never tell their parents unless it's happening a lot or I feel there is a reason to be concerned about it.

Well after talking to my boss, I came up with a better solution than a flier. . .I'm just going to make a mention of how snack works in the next newsletter. If they are concerned, parents will ask me about it. . . and except for this one parent, all of the others communicate well.

Thanks again for the advice guys!

Maris
Member

03-28-2002

Wednesday, September 15, 2004 - 9:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
I figured there must have been a history with the mother and child there. You sure have your hands full.

Mocha
Member

08-12-2001

Wednesday, September 15, 2004 - 10:09 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
Good luck Grace, I feel for you. I've always felt it takes a special kind of person to go into childcare and I recognize that I'm not that kind of person and admire people who are.

Reader234
Member

08-13-2000

Thursday, September 16, 2004 - 8:55 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post    
YEah Grace!!

It is hard, and it does sound like it adds up, glad you can come here, lay things out, take them out and find the solution that works for you!!