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Earthmother
Member
07-14-2002
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:14 am
I think if I were on the jury I would look at all that was done. Did Dick do their bidding for them? yes...Did Dick take the heat off of them? yes... Did they say things about Dick and or Dani behind their backs that were reprehensible? yes...Did they stand by and let Dustin (and cheered) when he broke his (handshake) word to Dick? yes...Was Jessica not the first one who wanted to break the agreement with the Donatos, but Eric (on our vote) talked her out of it? yes...Every one of them betrayed the Donatos at one time or another, so why would they use the Donatos betrayal against them at the end? IMO, only sour grapes and not game.
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Smrtass
Member
09-11-2000
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:16 am
Why would the jury consider "Did they say things about Dick and or Dani behind their backs that were reprehensible?" as part of their decision making?
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Earthmother
Member
07-14-2002
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:22 am
Why wouldn't they? If you did the same things then why would you hold what they did against them?
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Dke1212
Member
07-13-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:25 am
I agree it takes more than just winning competitions. I think they did more (like his/her strategy or not) to get to the end. I agree with Earthmothers post above.
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Smrtass
Member
09-11-2000
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:32 am
I guess I wouldn't be evaluating talking behind backs either way when deciding on a winner. Stabbing in the back, yes. Talking, probably not. But that's just me.
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Earthmother
Member
07-14-2002
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:35 am
What else has Dick done that would make them mad enough to not vote for him, but talk? This was his stategy and they know that. If I was one of the people (Dustin & Eric) who made the comments about incest, and the others who also heard it could justify the TALK, why not justify Dick's talk? Back stabbing...they all did it, heck Jameka even made up lies about Eric to Jessica. Backstabbing is also GAME..
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Gabby01
Member
07-27-2007
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:38 am
from what i heard on the live feeds dick told dani for them both to go all out to win the comp but apparently they were separated and didnt know how each other had done. it was an underwater comp and dani said she couldnt hold her breath very long so dick won. i watched the 3 part comps from the past 2 years yesterday and the part 3 one had like 8 questions. julie would ask did a jury member say this or that and give 2 answers then it would show the jury member answer. should be fun tonight!
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Gabby01
Member
07-27-2007
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:40 am
btw...interesting that the smoker won! lol
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Bubba
Member
07-29-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:44 am
I think it all depends on how personally the people in the jury took Dicks verbal attacks against them. Since they could have gotten rid of him when he was up against Dustin and didn't, I think they were putting game over personal attacks, so maybe they will do the same in the jury house. However when they voted out Dustin they all still had a chance of going to the end. Now that they have no chance at the prize money they may take it personally.
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Lucymac
Member
07-06-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:44 am
I wonder when Eric will be given the information as to who the AP vote goes for? I thought the rules in the past were they couldn't campaign for anyone even though I suspect some of that was done. Do they change it now and say he is to campaign, or does he just cast the vote for "America?" And because there is no advantage for him to change the outcome and because we see very little of what goes on in the jury house, will we even know if he does campaign? And I disagree that everyone betrayed the Donatos. Just the example of Jessica alone. While she wanted to do it, ultimately she didn't betray them. Thinking about it doesn't make it a betrayal. Voting Jessica out like Dick and Daniele did, breaking their promise, is a betrayal.
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Tera
Member
08-10-2000
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:46 am
That is what is so great about Big Brother. There are no rules. You can vote for what ever reason you want to. If it were me, personally, I would vote that way my heart told me to. If I had been verbally attacked by someone and then that someone told me it was his/her "strategy" to be verbally abusive. It would make no difference to me. Strategy or not this person still acted like an a-hole and would not get my vote.
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Dke1212
Member
07-13-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:52 am
I can see Dustin, Jessica, Zach (if he's there)voting based on game play. Jameka, Amber, more on the personal. Jen could go either way and may surprise some people. Eric votes however America says. So I would not count Dick out if he makes it. And, I'm hoping Dick is there on Tuesday and wins.
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Gina8642
Member
06-01-2001
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 7:53 am
ITA Tera. The jury can use whatever criteria they want to decide who wins. They can decide by the color of the outfit if they want. I too would not forgive someone who verbally abused me the way Dick has abused most (all?) members of the jury. Sure, all of them have said hurtful things at times. But overall, I believe that it is Dick's words they will remember.
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Bygdatty
Member
08-25-2007
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 8:01 am
Any way the jury decides to vote is legitimate. That's part of the game. otherwise they would be instructed to only pay attention to the way the final 2 played the game. But this isn't just a game. It's a social experiment. And the way those people interacted in the house with the jury definitely comes into play. Dick may win favor by the fact that he cooked so much and did a lot of cleaning. By the same token, some people may resent him calling them the C word and vote against him on that basis if he's in the final 2. There's no right or wrong way to vote. The Final 2 should know that they will be evaluated in many different ways by the jury. They can say they want the jury to only judge them by A, B and C, but the jury is going to look at X, Y, and Z, too. That's the way the game works.
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Calimom3
Member
07-12-2007
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 8:53 am
Zach did great here at the end, and how did he GET to the end with NO help?! Everyone else had an ally, Zach had been begging to be in somebody's alliance... they all made fun of him, and went after each OTHER... not his fault in my book. I don't consider him a 'floater'. He got used by whoever needed his vote that week, he knew some comps weren't that important for him to win. I say ZACH is the best player--- no 'showmance,' and no family member helping him!
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Allietex
Member
08-16-2002
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 8:55 am
The interesting thing about the jury as it has always been, is that THEY do not have to justify their actions because they are not getting the money. The F2 are the only ones who have to do that. It may not be fair but that is how it always works. And people tend to forget or put a better light on the stuff they, themselves, said. And Dick and Dani can't bring it up because it was said behind their backs. They do not know about most of it. But let's take the possible criteria that may be used. 1. Talking behind the back. They all did it so that is kind of a wash. 2. Betrayals. Most of them have done that. Who did it first or who did it more times is also kind of irrevalent at this point, because they do not have a score card. They do not know as much as we do. What most of them is going to be concerned about is who did it to them. And since Zach was not in an alliance with them, the only one who should hold it aginst him is whichever Danato is there. Dick basically betrayed Jess and Eric, and possibly Jen, since she had allied with them to vote out Dustin. 3. Physical competitions. If Zach wins the final HOH, his comp wins will be comparable to Dick and Dani. And he will have won perhaps the most brutal competition ever held on BB. And he won them in a periof of the game where NO ONE was throwing competitions anymore. Dani won more POVs but Zach did not need to win them to stay in the game. 4. Mental game. Dick's consisted primarily of screaming at people, bullying them, and calling them the most vile names he could think of. Although the jury does not know it, much of his "mental game" was not his but the AP. Dani had little mental game. It consisted mostly of depending on her and her dad winning compps. And so much of what they based their stragegies on was incorrect. And think about it. How many times did they fail to get their original target out? Four or five at least. Zach has an argument here. He tried to have an alliance but it crumbled early and he had to adjust. He chose to have a loose alliance with D/D. He literally used them for protection and getting out the other HGs until he had to start winning comps to protect himself. Did he do it flawlessly. No, he should have voted out Dani instead of Eric. But other than that, he had done a great job. If he wins the final comp, his next big decision will be who to take to F2. Mental game - even Behavior. Dick. Need I say more. I just do not see this jury forgetting or forgiving the stuff he said. It was just too raw and burtal. Dani whining and crying and her isolating herself and her changing personality when she was HOH or in danger has to be a turn off. Zach isolating himself and his sometimes weird statemenst will definitely play against him, But on the other hand, he did not treat everyone horribly and he did not make serious enenmies. 6. So it comes down to intangibles. From the jury's point of view, realizing that they may not know all the information. I think one of the big problems is that the jury like many on this board while claiming they look on the two as different people really do not. They will judge the good and the bad as one unit unless they are against each other. The good. As Zach said, "they" dominated the game. But if one of them goes up aginst Zach, it is not "they" it is just one of them. Even with her wins, Dani would probably not have won without her Dad's wins. Dick certainly would have been gone without Dani's help. So together they dominated by indivually they did not. The bad. What can I say about Dick and his mouth that has not already been said thousands of times. We all know. And Dani is going to be tarred with it as well. No, she was not the one who said it, but as we have all seen, she supported it and even encouraged it. Now whether the jury knows this is a different story. But they did hold her responsible to some degree because she did not try to stop it and they felt she could have done more. Possibly not fair, but fact. And Zach will suffer from the fact that while they will have seen his competitions, they will be largely unaware of the subtle game he has played. It will just be waved aside as floating. So who will win? Who knows about juries? My gut tells me that none of them will vote for Dick aganist anyone. (except AP perhaps)But as we have seen in the past, juries sometimes are able to put aside personal feelings and judge on merit. But this is not an all star jury. And they are pretty emotional. And Dick's behavior to nearly every one of them was way over the top. If it is Dani and Zach, I think it could go either way, with a slight edge to Dani. If it is Dick and Dani, edge again to Dani, but who knows? So the final pick? I just don't know. I am pulling for Zach, but frankly, I don't expect him to win the final. I think Dick will win it.
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Allietex
Member
08-16-2002
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 9:08 am
Wow, did not really realize how long my post was until I saw it on the board. Sorry about the length. But I still forgot to put my analysis of Dick and Zach's chances. Dick and Zach, just don't know. Zach quiet, unassuming, seeming to float. Basically nice to people, good comps at the end. Dick, flamboyant, charming when he wants to be, did a lot of the housework, disgusting personal habits, unbelievable verbal attacks on nearly everyone. This one to me is a tossup.
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Onlymytulips
Member
07-17-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 11:02 am
Great post Allie, love it so much, I am using part of it as a guide...I want to give my point of view. 1. Talking behind the back. As Amber calls them "the good ones" did not do this as maliousily or as openly as Dick did. 2. Betrayals. This is one that is in the eye of the beholder. Amber thinks Eric is the reason she is out, but it was AC. Other HG have Dick/Dani as the reason for them being on the jury. 3. Physical competitions. If Zach wins the final HOH, his comp wins will be comparable to Dick and Dani. I totally agree that if Zach wins this he will be close to winnings as Dick. Dani is very strong as well. However, Zach did not have a family member in the house cheering him on or doing his dirty work for him by chanting at others during comps. 4. Mental game. Dick was in the face playing on the emotions of HG. Obvious someone that played hard from the start. Maybe some may view it as too hard and over the top? Zach, was in the background, due to Dicks strong personality, and finally when he had the opp to stand up to D&D he did and very well. Dick and Dani used him near the end to eliminate Eric and Jess, hopefully he will realize this. Behavior. If the jury view Dick's behavior as game play then he may be excused for it. However, the spitting and other body actions may be chalked up as not appreciated. Dani used emotional displays as game play. We may have seen more then the jury and they have a different spin on it. Zach laying low during the first part of the game may be viewed as surviving being chosen as a targe of D&D. He did align himself with Dani mid way and this may be seen as riding on coattails, which in the past games, was a vote against them.
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Beekindpleez
Member
07-18-2006
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 11:29 am
interesting that the smoker won! ...after spending eight hours standing on a carrot holding a key above his head the night before. Of course Dick will try to win. What kind of a silly question is that? Besides, I heard him tell Daniele: Don't worry, honey, we'll have our fairy tale ending...I promise you. I hope they get it.
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Jeanne
Member
07-15-2005
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 11:35 am
Me too, Bee, me too!!!
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Seamonkey
Moderator
09-07-2000
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 11:37 am
Me too, Bee, but I wonder. I was clear that Dani knows much more about the other HG when she was Jedi training Dick. She also has good advice for him to listen carefully to the question and listen for key words in the question. They also feel that they know this information better than Zach does, which may well have been true, but from the feeds WE know that Jameka did Jedi training about the jury with Zach and gave him much info. She even pulled some stuff she didn't know from Dani. So.. who knows? Plus sometimes the questions in these comps seem to come out of left field. I also think if it comes to a tiebreaker that typically is something to do with # minutes or hours or days that Zach is likely to have been thinking of that and will win it.
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Beekindpleez
Member
07-18-2006
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 11:47 am
Sea....much of the info that Jameka gave Zach was wrong anyway. She learned from Dani that one of them wasn't an only child, like she had told Zach. When Jameka and Zach were drilling together before POV the only purpose it served was to jumble their brains. The both performed poorly. These final questions are always the kind of silly ones. How did the house guest finish this question.. Like say, When asked, Jen said she would rather Dick A)Spit B)Fart. Dick spent much more time with those people than anybody else did. I think he stands a good chance.
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Urgrace
Member
08-19-2000
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 12:24 pm
Dick and Dani thought there was going to be a car for the winner of part 2, so I'm guessing since Dani wants the big prize she might have been okay with losing part 2 to her dad for the car. That may be the reason she was okay with them both 'going for it'. Then after the competiton they were not happy since there was no car. As for the final competition, I'm hoping the questions are like Bee said, those you have to guess at, like "Who said...?" Dustin or Jen or "How many times did Eric wear girl's clothes during the show?" Nine or Ten.
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Tracy
Member
07-16-2007
| Thursday, September 13, 2007 - 12:29 pm
The car thing isn't always such an advantage, after all Dani still has to pay the taxes for it.
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