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Archive through August 14, 2007

The TVClubHouse: Big Brother 8 ARCHIVES: Big Brother 8 - Part 10: Use of Church/Organ Music Offensive or Fair?: ARCHIVES: Archive through August 14, 2007 users admin

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Sharinia
Member

09-07-2002

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 4:55 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Sharinia a private message Print Post    
<<I was always taught that prayer was a solemn occasion. P.S. When I pray, I pray to myself. I don't throw myself on the floor in such a dramatic way so that every camera in the room can take a good shot of me praying my little heart out.>>

that is because you are Catholic (so am i)

honestly, i think some Christian denominations (and non denominational) can be a lot more flamboyant in their manner of worship.... we Catholics tend to be more subdued (even if more formal)....i'm not sure that it is fair to judge.

(admittedly i am assuming that Jameka isn't Catholic - someone pls correct me if i am wrong)

Rehtse
Member

08-17-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 5:01 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Rehtse a private message Print Post    
i'm not sure that it is fair to judge

You are right. Not judge, but LMAO at the church music that plays while Jameka is praying after she has yet another outburst and when Amber prays so that she can win more challenges.

Lilfair
Member

07-09-2003

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 5:43 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Lilfair a private message Print Post    
One of the few funny BB moments this season was the organ music. I like Jam, but it's too funny that her and Amber bring god into every aspect of the game that is offensive....the organ music is a big eye roll in response.

Izzysmydog
Member

08-13-2007

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 6:16 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Izzysmydog a private message Print Post    
What I don't understand, and yes, I'm Catholic, is why do they pray outloud when they know that they have a microphone on and it will be broadcast on the internet, unless they are using it as a way for them to be on camera on the TV show? If they were serious about the prayer, they would do it without speaking as everyone knows God can read your thoughts. It just doesn't ring true to me...

Jimmer
Moderator

08-30-2000

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:22 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jimmer a private message Print Post    
People worship in different ways. Some people are more formal about it than others. People do what they were taught and what is right for them. If the person doing it gets comfort from it, then is that a bad thing?

I have no way of knowing if Amber and Jameka normally pray out loud or not. I've certainly known many people who talk out loud to themselves in stressful situations. IMO it has nothing to do with how serious a person is about what they are saying. In fact, I think some people feel it is more sincere if they vocalize something. It is totally a matter of how they choose to worship.

As far as praying out loud when it can be heard over the Internet, these people (including the non-praying players) say a whole lot of horrible things that can be heard over the Internet. The fact they may pray out loud is not at all remotely offensive or disturbing to me.

Scotchbright
Member

10-05-2006

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:39 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Scotchbright a private message Print Post    
I think the organ music was meant as 'setting the mood' of the players praying, but I think they may have gone too far. The first few times the organ music was played was funny, now it's becoming condescending (IMHO).

I became uncomfortable watching Amber cry/pray in the HOH room on the show - but that may be from my own upbringing and 'keep things private/to yourself', especially when praying.
I felt embarassed by what felt - to me- like a 'show' put on by her.
Again, that's just MY upbringing and opinion...

Frogichik
Member

06-11-2002

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:49 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Frogichik a private message Print Post    
IMHO I crack up every time I hear the organ music. I am sorry but praying to do better in competitions and Amber saying God told her witch guitars to pick is just too much for me to take. Just seems like God should have bigger things to worry about.

Here is a Youtube that expresses my feelings on the situation. I think it is titled Saint Jameka.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJjmg96ZIDo

Rehtse
Member

08-17-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:41 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Rehtse a private message Print Post    
Last year we had the Woogie phone calls (which I hated) and this year we have the organ music (which I love).

Poppy
Member

07-21-2006

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:45 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Poppy a private message Print Post    
Jimmer - well said!

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
I'd like to see the response to a different, but similar question.

Is BB offensive or fair?

Cablejockey
Member

12-27-2001

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:49 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Cablejockey a private message Print Post    
The organ music was a bit amusing the first time or two. After that they are just hitting us over the head with it! Dont they think we got where they were going with it, right away?

Rehtse
Member

08-17-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:51 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Rehtse a private message Print Post    
Of course we get it--hence the 10 pages of comments on this thread--but does America get it?

Jimmer
Moderator

08-30-2000

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:53 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jimmer a private message Print Post    
My understanding in general is that Catholics tend to express their Christian beliefs in a formal and ritualistic way. That includes going to church for formal services and praying in a formal manner using specific prayers that are taught and sanctioned by the church as well as some personal prayers that are done in private.

Other Christians take a much more conversational direct approach when praying to God and tend to be more demonstrative with their prayers and beliefs.

Yet others are somewhere in-between the two.

Jimmer
Moderator

08-30-2000

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 12:54 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jimmer a private message Print Post    
I don't understand your question Kearie?

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:16 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
I'm a born again Christian. Most of the time I pray out loud. It helps me focus and keeps my mind for wondering off on various bunny trails.

I'm also alone most of the time, so no one hears me except God and my dogs. I pray while I drive. I pray while the tv is on.

I pray short prayers. I say long prayers.

In public, I pray silently. If I'm with a friend and they want to pray, I will pray with them.

Grace is still said at every family gathering at home. (At home...My step dad turned 80 on the 5th and mom had a surprise birthday BBQ for him. Family and friends. Before we ate...grace was said.)

ANYWAY---The organ music wasn't offensive to me because I saw it as poking fun at Jameka...not Christianity.

As a Christian, I don't like how Jameka is portraying OUR God.

Her idea of God's Will for her and this game is WONKY, HINKY...and not a good example for non-christians.

Her use of "good" vs "bad" people. That is wrong.
Her idea that God will help her with her greedy goal...is wrong.

Yes, she may be a new Christian. Yes, she's not perfect. Yes she is forgiven. Yes, she is working on her anger. That's all fine.

I just believe her portrayal of her view of God is all wrong. God isn't about greed. God isn't FOR good people and against bad people.

We're ALL bad.

ETA: I just don't think much is fair about BB anymore. The way they edit things, the way BB plays favorites and manipulates. None of it's fair. Just as the organ music is meant to manipulate. None of it's fair.

Ginger
Member

08-13-2007

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:23 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Ginger a private message Print Post    
Not me!

Denecee
Member

09-05-2002

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:25 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Denecee a private message Print Post    
Some of us are just more bad! I think you make a very good point Keari and you shed some light on some things for me, so thank you for the post and your one from yesterday in here.
You are the type of Christian I can respect. I grew up in a town where it was common for the church members to go out Sat night and commit adultry and then show up at church the next day. Then the very next weekend, there they are again acting like they don't have a commitment in the world to live up to.

Bombaycat
Member

07-21-2007

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:28 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Bombaycat a private message Print Post    
Well said Kearie!

Justalittlebean
Member

08-15-2003

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:30 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Justalittlebean a private message Print Post    
Well said Karie. Your family sounds like mine. I've always taught my children that NOBODY can stop you from praying. You don't have to make a loud spectacle of yourself as I see Jam doing. I can be in the middle of a large crowd and still talk to God.



Costacat
Member

07-15-2000

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:34 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Costacat a private message Print Post    
To answer the question, I find the constant vocal praying offensive. I find the bible reading offensive.

So do I think the organ music is fair? Sure! If you are gonna put it out there, then you've got to be able to take it.

Kearie
Member

07-21-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:37 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Kearie a private message Print Post    
" I grew up in a town where it was common for the church members to go out Sat night and commit adultry and then show up at church the next day. Then the very next weekend, there they are again acting like they don't have a commitment in the world to live up to."

This is exactly why in the Bible, Paul says it's okay to confront fellow Christians on bad behavior. It's why it's okay to ask them to leave the church until they change their behavior.

Non-christians see the hypocrisy and are repelled by Christianity.

Lainee
Member

07-19-2005

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:45 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Lainee a private message Print Post    
Kearie, I spoke to our Head Elder in the church and he said that basically someone on the board (most likely himself or the Pastor) would talk to the individual doing the offending behavior but usually it has to be something really, really bad like molesting a child, beating your wife, committing adultery, before anything is said. If the person doesn't want to change the behavior or doesn't even attempt to then he is disfellowshipped out of the church.

Also, you can't hold a position (Pastor, Elder, Deacon, Deaconess, Treasurer, Secretary, etc) if you smoke, drink, etc. but doing those things will not get you kicked out of church.

Asking (or kicking out) Jameka or Amber because of the manner they choose to worship is not something we would do in our church. The manner they choose to worship is their choice and we can't see their heart to know if they are being sincere or not, so therefore, that behavior of theirs is not ours to judge.

Justalittlebean
Member

08-15-2003

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:46 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Justalittlebean a private message Print Post    
I live in a small town also, and is full of used car dealers. I see these owners of car dealers in church on Sunday as I say in the amen pew and Monday - Saturday, they screw people selling pieces of junk. When the Walmart in this town decided to sell liquor, people in the churches threw a fit. They did everything they could to stop it, but it failed. On one Sunday the minister ask peoples opinions and I stood up and reminded them there was a grocery store in town that sold beer, and all the church members of the town refused to shop there, so the store went out of business. The store had a going out of business sale, and guess who was lined up at the door for the bargains? Yep, the towns church members. The same people who refused to shop there and ran the store out of town. LOL I told them that the liquor won't jump in the shopping carts. I guess some prefer the drive thru liquor stores they have here. LOL There are many christians who don't walk the talk.



Allietex
Member

08-16-2002

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:51 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Allietex a private message Print Post    
You can tell that from the phrasing of Jameka's prayers that she has been raised in an organized religion. Each religion has it's own phraslogy. Certain pharses and expressions are frequently used. I can spot a Southern Baptist a mile away if I can hear him pray. I am sure it is that way in all religions. If you belong to an organized religion, I bet you can spot one of your own also. Nothing wrong with it.

Amber on the other hand does not exhibit these speech patterns. It makes me believe that she is a new Christian, on the whole unexposed to organized religion.

She probably has not received the memo, ie the long list of what a Christian is or is not supposed to do or say in the eyes of the world and other Christians. Perhaps she should be cut a little slack as she finds her way.

She has not been taught the "proper" way you are supposed to pray. She just does it. Does some of the things she says during her prayers sound a little strange to me? Yeah, but I find it kind of refreshing.

Allietex
Member

08-16-2002

Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 2:02 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Allietex a private message Print Post    
And while those Christians were out sinning, there were probably many many more who were not. But as always, we notice the bad apples in the barrel and do not appreciate the good ones. There are always failures in any thing we do, even in religions.

If course we do not support the actions of "failed" Christians, neither should we assume that all Christians are like that. I also grew up in a small town and saw those kinds of Christians. I also so those who lived what they preached every day of their lives to the best of their ability.

My father was one of these and I do not believe I ever heard anyone ever say a bad word about him. and he was the most humble and unjudgemental men I ever knew. He always said hate the sin and not the sinner. I have to keep reminding myself of that every time I turn on BB. LOL