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Earthmother
Member
07-14-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:02 pm
That wasn't what I meant Kauuna..Someone said that the 7 sins were not in the Bible at all, and I knew they were. I went to a Christian church as a child and I remember sermons on them many times. My contention was someone who is as religious as Kail would certainly know this.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:10 pm
EM, I guess that depends on how you interpret "the seven sins are in the Bible" which is in itself a vague statement. Yes, Biblical passages can be found talking about those particular seven behaviors. But there are a lot of other behaviors in the Bible too. It's the grouping of them as seven, and as deadly, which is not Biblical. So I think it's also appropriate to say that the Seven Mortal Sins are not Biblical per se. At any rate, there is no guarantee that any practitioner of any particular moral teaching will be a perfect follower of that teaching. We are all human, after all, and that very fact, that we screw up lots, is also Biblical. And so is forgiveness. And prodding someone when they've got it wrong without being unkind or equally judgmental. 
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Earthmother
Member
07-14-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:13 pm
Nothing to forgive, thanks so much.
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:18 pm
I'm sensing a Kumbaya moment in here. Could someone hand me a tissue please? I kind of feel sorry for Kail with what she's going to have to deal with when she gets out. But then again, maybe it will wake her up to the rest of the world out there, especially the opinions of the peons and her servants and whatnot.
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Klaw73
Member
08-21-2006
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:25 pm
GAL and Sanfran: all I have to say about your posts is AMEN . Glad you said it, b/c I sure couldn't come up with the words...lol.
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Klaw73
Member
08-21-2006
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 4:30 pm
I kind of feel sorry for Kail with what she's going to have to deal with when she gets out. I do too. IMO, she's going to be forced to look at things she didn't otherwise realize about herself and how she is perceived. I really believe the quote, "what doesn't kill us, makes us stronger." She'll be alright.
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Fiat
Member
10-07-2004
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:06 pm
Four Square is an evangelistic form of Pentacostal. It is the religion most followed by the neo-con Republicans. Earthmother, I'd love to see the statistics on this. I agree that many neo-con republicans are some type of Christian, and many are even evangelical. But this is quite a generalization you are making. None of the neo-cons I know personally belong to Four Square. For the record I am neither a republican or a neo-con. But I am conservative, and Christian. This isn't meant to be nit-picky or to incite argument, it just bothers me because if I posted something like "Wicca is the religion most followed by liberal democrats" I had better have proof. Maybe you meant "Most members of Four Square churches are republican neo-cons"?
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Calimom3
Member
07-12-2007
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:10 pm
I see Kail as someone who would NEVER admit to being wrong--- esp about something sooo serious & probably based on her religious beliefs... All this talk just reinstates my preference to "be kind/tolerant of ALL (law-abiding) people in SPITE of any version of any religious beliefs, not BECAUSE of them..." I find in strange that the 7 "deadly" sins are based on feelings not actions... If you don't act on it, how can a feeling be a SIN?! A bellini for anyone who's never felt lust---- (or most/all of the others for that matter!) Heck, this board alone is FILLED with examples of lust,envy,sloth,gluttony,greed,pride & wrath/anger!! If those feelings are denied/held in, I tell my kids to do what's right, even if nobody is looking: be a good person for your own sake, and not because you think you'll be rewarded/punished... (now step aside so I may hop off my soapbox...)
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Cricket
Member
08-05-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:15 pm
What does neo-con Republican mean? I'm not understanding how religion/politics got into a Kail thread.
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Fiat
Member
10-07-2004
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:20 pm
"The seven deadly sins, also known as the capital vices or cardinal sins, are a classification of vices that were originally used in early Christian teachings to educate and instruct followers concerning (immoral) fallen man's tendency to sin." This quote is from Wikipedia. They way I read it, the Seven deadly sins are an educational device. Hey people, watch out!! These are areas in which many people have stumbled/sinned before! Be vigilant that you too don't submit to temptation. Having the feeling is not a sin. Having the feeling is experiencing temptation. It's whether or not you follow through with the immoral action that matters.
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Nick
Member
07-31-2004
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:23 pm
Kail will just go back to her lovely little life where she brags they employ half their town and will go back to her lovely little church that provides and supports her current beliefs. Nothing's going to happen to her and I doubt sincerely she'll learn anything from this experience because she is self centered and very unopen to learning from those around her. She's really lost an amazing experience of exposure where she might have learned something. That is what I find sad. And yes, I'm gay. And yes, I'm a christian. My faith is very strong and I completely differentiate my faith beliefs from societal constructed "religions". Intolerance doesn't a christian make - judgment is God's alone.
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Karuuna
Board Administrator
08-31-2000
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 5:29 pm
Fiat, I believe in most of Christendom, the idea is that we are all subjected to those feelings, and whether or not we act on them is not the issue. The point being, it is a guard against the "sin" of pride to think you are better merely because you have not acted on the temptation. That's why the Lord's prayer says "lead me not into temptation", and why Jimmy Carter said he "lusted in his heart", when he was making a statement about his own humanity. It referred to the Biblical teaching of Christ that if you have lusted in your heart, you are equal to the adulterer. Whether or not you buy that is up to you. But I do believe that's the point in understanding that the temptation is as bad as the action in Christian theology. It's to prevent followers from being haughty about their own righteousness. 
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Stacey718995
Member
07-06-2007
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 6:13 pm
I have no doubts that I will have many that disagree. But, in watching the show tonight it brought up some thoughts for me. I know people have made mean, evil moves in the past 8 seasons of BB. I missed a few seasons working at a summer camp. But of the seasons I saw, I personally think that Kail made the lowest/nastiest of the moves. They recapped tonight Kail running to Dani to try to get Dani to vote out ED. Dani saw through her but here you have a mom that made a decision to use someones emotions to further herself in a game and in doing so trashed another person's father. It wasn't just a straight forward, would you vote out your dad? It was a, direct, let me play on your emotions and make sure you remember how terrible your dad is statement. You know, I am not going to defend him as a dad, or defend Daniele's angst toward him. Family issues always break my heart and I hope that they can get away from this show and that this show can find them some peace if that is what is needed to mend or if it is mendable. What Dani and Dick have is personal and though she may need a shoulder to cry as he may as well, neither of them need someone to trash or to try to gain personal interest off of what they are going through. I don't know if it is snobbery, but, I personally think that that direct action there says more about her personality than the dozens of houseguests before her. We all have competitive sides at some point, and I know they are there playing a game, but, I personally think that is one of the worst cross the line moments in BB history. Not trying to be dramatic as I know it sounds that way. Maybe it is the counselor in me and working with so many teens in family crisis situation that makes it more passionate. I just think that says a ton about a woman that is not only a mother but self proclaimed religious that she could go for that type of attack.
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Fiat
Member
10-07-2004
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 6:14 pm
I agree that it is the sin of pride to think you are better than another, in any situation. I guess I don't quite understand. Are you saying that the temptation to eat an entire cheesecake is as bad as eating one? I know that's a silly example, but do you get what I mean? I completely understand how thoughts can be sinful without accompanying actions. For example, thinking you are better than others, lusting after another persons spouse or belongings, doubting God's love for you. But I don't understand how a temptation (to eat the whole cheesecake, to ignore your child who is asking you to read, to run the read light) that just briefly pops in your mind, but is not followed is as bad as the action. Are we defining temptation differently? I ask this in a peaceful way, searching for understanding.
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Goddessatlaw
Member
07-19-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 6:16 pm
Nice post, Stacey. I agree 100%.
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Teachmichigan
Member
07-22-2001
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 6:48 pm
If you believe in grace and the New Testament, the "new" commandment is "love thy neighbor" and "saved by grace." If only Kail would remember THESE two, a lot of her issues would not be the current topic of discussion! I read up on the site, THANKS for whoever posted it (can't see it in archives). I've been raised very conservatively (no longer consider myself con. though ), and thought I knew about almost all major world religions. Foursquare was a new one -- here I thought it was a kid's game!
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Bastable
Member
07-09-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 8:45 pm
Boy oh boy, was Kail's judgmentalism on display tonight! * She tried to manipulate Daniele's vote by reminding her what a bad father Dick has been ("you have had to overcame [sic] so much") * Her remark about gay people wearing makeup was simply beyond offensive to me * She rated Mike by different standards than Zach or Nick And let's not forget this woman's incredible lack of knowledge about basic grammar. It seems that every show, she gives us another subject/verb train wreck, like the one above. Or malapropisms like "vendenna" instead of "vendettta." Did she even complete elementary school? How can a woman who says such ignorant things also, at the same time, judge other people as if she knows the way the world is? I'm looking for a zipper down her back, and for Maggie to step out.
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 8:51 pm
I hope she doesn't get off "scotch free"!
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Bastable
Member
07-09-2002
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 8:53 pm
But she might get used as a "pond"!
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 9:00 pm
There are so many reasons to not like her. I'm glad BB edited the show to show her as she really is....although she will surely (and wrongly) blame the editing.
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Stacey718995
Member
07-06-2007
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 9:23 pm
I am glad about that too SF. When the show first started, I felt sorry for Dani. No longer the case. I feel sorry for Kail's kids in more than just being embarrassed by mom's actions on the show.
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Watching2
Member
07-07-2001
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 10:22 pm
Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy!!!!!!!! Her remark tonight about gay men in full makeup just about sent me over the edge. Is she really that ill-informed? I wouldn't call that snobby, but I would call it exteremly ignorant and hurtful to gay men.
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Spunky
Member
10-08-2001
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 10:49 pm
Don't forget that Kail is in the majority among Americans who think like her. You should be shocked at the majority of Americans, not just at Kail.. It takes some more progressive thinking, but that's not easy feat. So try to understand where she comes from, she is in the majority. Personally, I think that we've seen things in nature that happen for a reason, and from a scientific, not social, point of view there could be a perfectly acceptable reason for this increasing change in sexual preferences. But it takes time to get society to understand and accept this phenomenon.
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Lucas
Member
07-01-2005
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 11:05 pm
I do not see her as snobby at all. A product of where she lives, how she was raised for sure. I do not mind her as she is not mean about it, she feels a certain way, but yet tries to be open as much as she can be given her upbringing. She is not mean, or angry about her bias, just firm. There are millions of Americans who think like she does, but at least she is trying somewhat
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Sanfranjoshfan
Member
09-17-2000
| Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 11:18 pm
"Don't forget that Kail is in the majority among Americans who think like her. You should be shocked at the majority of Americans, not just at Kail.." I'm not shocked, I'm disappointed. I'm not shocked that Kail has these ignorant beliefs either. Just the fact that people who think like she does are currently in the majority doen't mean they have a clue what they're talking about....it just means that the majority needs to be educated about sexual orientation. "So try to understand where she comes from, she is in the majority. " I understand perfectly well where she comes from - IGNORANCE. Gay people don't choose to be gay and gay people can't be spotted because they wear wear make-up! Yep - ignorance, pure and simple. There is no "increasing change in sexual preferences". HOWEVER, there has been quite a bit of progress on the "curing homophobia front" so now more and more gay people are choosing to stop hiding who they are and they are coming out of the closet and making themselves visible. Gay people are not increasing in number, but the number of gay people that refuse to continue hiding are.
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