TVCH FORUMS HOME . JOIN . FAN CLUBS . DONATE . CONTACT . CHAT  
                  Quick Links   TOPICS . TREE-VIEW . SEARCH . HELP! . NEWS . PROFILE
Archive through September 06, 2010

Reality TVClubHouse Discussions: Big Brother USA ARCHIVES: Big Brother 12 - Part 5: Was Brit's and Ragan's Hatred of Rachel and Brenden Fueled By Envy?: Archive through September 06, 2010 users admin

Author Message
What555456
Member

06-14-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 8:21 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send What555456 a private message Print Post    
Now that the season has played out and we know there were three showmances going on -- Rachel/Brenden, Matt/Ragan, and Brit/Lane -- I have wondered if Brit's and Ragan's hatred for Rachel and Brenden really came because they were envious.

Is it possible that Brit and Ragan wanted the intensity and physicality of the Rachel/Brenden showmance but could not have it? Brit because Lane really had no feelings for her and was just using her plus she is supposedly engaged and Ragan because Matt is straight?

It is rare to see such intense hatred unless there is something else behind it. The more I think about it, the more I think envy was what Brit and Ragan were really feeling and they lashed out because Brenden and Rachel had what they so desperately wanted.

Bonbonlover
Member

07-13-2000

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 8:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Bonbonlover a private message Print Post    
What I love all of your topics and the discussions they bring. But I so disagree with your thought that Ragan, Matt, Brit or Lane were envious or jealous of Rachel and Brendon. I think that Rachel is just one of those personalities that brings out a visceral reaction in people. People on many message boards have intense feelings about Brendon and Rachel and we didn't have to live with them.

Karuuna
Board Administrator

08-30-2000

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 8:40 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Karuuna a private message Print Post    
I thought Lane was the one in the diary room saying Brit should choose him over Nick; and Brit was the one not interested. FWIW.

Missyb
Member

07-28-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 8:41 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Missyb a private message Print Post    
I don't think they were envious of Brendon and Rachel's relationship at all. It is a given for every BB season there will be a shomance. Mostly for this bunch it meant more camera time. For Ragan I think it meant too much camera time.

Britney is snarky because I think she feels everyone is just so classless compared to her. She was brought up to be a lady and everyone else , regardless of income bracket, acts like low class trash. This her mother taught her.

Ragan I believe loves to use his intellect to bully. He found a victim in Rachel. I never really understood his accusing Rachel and Brendon of bullying. Because Brendon had superior height and he and Matt were slighter ? Kathy told Rachel she didn't have to vote the way Rachel wanted her too. She stood up fr herself. Just how did Ragan feel bullied ?

I think Ragan just plain hated her over the topness, her look. Everything about her. He wanted quietness and that was not Rachel Reilly. I think he was embarrassed that he picked the wrong girl and had to vilify her to extricate himself from her.

Well, I think I am off on a tangent and don't know what I am saying !!!

Good topic What !

Spunky
Member

10-07-2001

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 8:57 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Spunky a private message Print Post    
I just finished reading that article posted under that Brit's thread. Wow! Didn't know articles could be that long!! Then I saw the writer was a woman (so funny while reading I thought it was a man) and then I understood a bit more (I'm not sexist), but I can see sometime women are more passionate in their beliefs and would go to that length in explaining just how horrible someone is. I found myself agreeing with most of what she was talking about, I understood her frustration with CBS for not being a 'reality' show but actually hiding some very nasty personality sides of some houseguests, in this case Ragan and Britney.

Not having the live feeds I didn't even know Ragan was talking about dead mutilated babies and giving aids to African babies, those are indeed horrible things to say. I knew about his hatred for Rachel but the writer explains it as if Ragan is a maniac, an obsessed man. Then I wonder, but this man is a College Professor, how could this man be so horrible?

That he felt such hatred for Rachel and Brendon makes me wonder if he was just acting, that can't be real. When I saw Rachel and Brendon I thought them as an interesting couple who only wanted to be fun and love, what's to hate about that?? That someone could hate them just for that is really strange.

So what if she's loud and 'territorial', just humour her, play along, but don't go nuts on her just because she is what she is, fun and love and "impertinent", so what? You don't have to wish on her the horrible things Ragan and Brit wished on them.

I don't think it's jealousy but 'innate cruelty', these two people did enjoy their horrible bashing and I noticed how Ragan seemed lost without the subject of his hatred in the house, even without Rachel or Brendon he kept finding moments to spew more hatred towards them.

The writer of the article must have meant that even the BB boards must be by now "desensitized" to the bashing because they didn't even show outrage or they simply reported it as "the usual past hg bashing".

I just hope Ragan and Brit find time to read that article, but then again, I'm sure they'll be shocked after the show to see just how unpleasant they've been to the live feed viewers.

Rosem4243
Member

06-27-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:07 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Rosem4243 a private message Print Post    
With all the vitriol spewed from Ragan toward Rachel, I keep remembering when Matt won his first HOH comp. Before Ragan jumped off, he told Matt he didn't want Rachel put on the block because he 'loves her'.

Anyone know when the turning point came for Ragan as to why this so-called 'love' turned to 'hate'? I can't remember for the life of me when and how that relationship changed for the worst.

Chippy
Member

08-16-2007

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:24 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Chippy a private message Print Post    
Seems to me that Ragan opined something along the lines of him falling out of "love" with Rachel when she "attacked" Kristen. Apparently it unleased bitter and unhappy childhood memories of him being bullied. Or I dreamt that. lol

Regardless, the level of hate is inexplicable to me and I'm sure there's some deep-seated psychological issue going on that I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole.

But, I can't help but react to what I saw and it just made me loathe Ragan and Britney. Heck, Britney was still at it last night- foaming at the mouth over RB and K.

I didn't mind Rachel or Brendon aside from their bad game moves and in fact was rooting for them. Call it underdog syndrome.

To me, Rachel and Brendon were the 2 most genuine people in the house. They seemed to be the most honest and the most loyal in a game like this. Perhaps their over-the-topness was perpetuated by their unreasonable expectations of their "friends".

I remember Kathy and Rachel, Britney and Rachel, and even Kristen and Rachel seeming pretty close and having a good time together and then BAM...

I think the fact that so many hg made it obvious that RB were outcast just made it worse.

At the end of the day, I can look at RB and Brit/Ragan and find a whole lot more redeeming qualities in the former... not so much if any for Britney and Ragan (Ragan moreso).

Dlkuhn4
Member

07-14-2002

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:33 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Dlkuhn4 a private message Print Post    
I think one thing is if one person didn't like someone everyone follows because it's keeps the target off them. Sounds like High School!

Rosem4243
Member

06-27-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:34 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Rosem4243 a private message Print Post    
I wanted to like and root for Brendon and Rachel, but when Rachel was in power, I saw the two of them bullying the other houseguests, tag teaming, 2 against 1 kind of crap.

That, coupled with Rachel's sense of entitlement about 'no one coming between her and her man' and her absolute outrage that anyone in the house would even THINK of putting one of them up, just sent me over the edge and prevented me from being a fan of either of them.

I would have liked Ragan and Britney, but they ruined it by their trash talk taken to a whole new level.

Overall, this season ranged from 'awful' to 'boring' - and if I see that next season is more of the same kind of casting, then I'm out. I don't think I'll get the live feed next year unless I see some drastic changes in how they do things on BB.

Leroy17
Member

08-01-2010

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 10:59 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Leroy17 a private message Print Post    
Based on Nick's interview, it would seem that Britney decided she couldn't stand Rachel during the audition process, perhaps from jealousy over all the attention Rachel draws to herself. As best I recall, the real instigator of the Rachel/Brendon hate was also Britney. Brit jumped right in to labeling them this year's Jeff and Jordan and pushed everyone to be deathly afraid that these two people in love could totally dominate 11 others throughout the game even though they had none of the qualities that helped Jeff and Jordan succeed.

Once the snowball started rolling, there was no stopping it and everyone became so obsessed with Brendon and Rachel that they couldn't see the alliance that was right in front of their faces. So, all in all, I trace the blame for how dull the game became to Britney's insecurity during auditions.

What555456
Member

06-14-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 11:26 am   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send What555456 a private message Print Post    
Interesting theory, Leroy. Never considered the failure of this season went all the way back to the interactions during the auditions.

Chippy
Member

08-16-2007

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 12:24 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Chippy a private message Print Post    
Oh yes. I've heard the pre show Rachel encounter from Britney more than once. She hated her before she even knew her name and yes, saw her vagina or vulva long before the show started. Ugh.

This came as a bit of a surprise when I heard about it because for a while there, they seemed to be pretty friendly- of course to hear Brit tell it, it was never even close to real. Her pageant upbringing must have honed her tongue biting gymnastics cause she sure can pretend she cares... till she's out of earshot of her victim.

Now that Leroy mentions it, I agree... Brit lit the hate flame early on and she unknowingly made a piece of heaven for the brigade. A little help from Ragan and voila... our final 3. lol

Wavewatcher
Member

09-09-2006

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 1:07 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Wavewatcher a private message Print Post    
Well, I just never have been able to get the 'hate' thing...being a 'hater' turns you into a toxic individual and it is just plain bad for your mental and physical health. Hard to do in the BBHouse, but avoiding and keeping toxic people out of your life will make you a happier person.

The House guests that were the least toxic that I can think of at the moment would be Dan, Jeff, and Jordan.

Were Ragan & Brit envious...? I dunno. But the question is why do they go on and on
about things they don't like about someone? What do they get out of it? It has no
purpose. Or does it?

Merrysea
Moderator

08-13-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 1:27 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Merrysea a private message Print Post    
But the question is why do they go on and on about things they don't like about someone? What do they get out of it? It has no purpose. Or does it?

My guess is that it makes them feel superior.

Wavewatcher
Member

09-09-2006

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 1:48 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Wavewatcher a private message Print Post    
Seems to be a bonding thing too...

Ark
Member

07-10-2001

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 2:02 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Ark a private message Print Post    
I really get rubbed the wrong way when someone suggests that the only reason you would dislike a woman is because you're jealous. I liked Rachel at first even though her laugh & voice were irritating. She became unlikable when she got power the first time plus all of them me & my man crap had to get old fast. There are a lot of viewers that couldn't stand her, can you imagine if you were stuck in a house with her and what we watched was magnified.

Lexie_girl
Member

07-30-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 2:12 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Lexie_girl a private message Print Post    
I agree with Bonbon, Rosem and Ark. Rachel and Brenden brought it on themselves. Unfortunately, Brenden and Rachel weren't antagonizing poodles - they messed with the pit bulls.

Also, I think that Lane is totally crushing on Britney. Sadly, Britney thinks of Lane as nothing more than an older brother.

Jag2000
Member

07-01-2009

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 2:15 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Jag2000 a private message Print Post    
Britney started really bashing Rachael while
Monet was still in the house. They laid out in the hammock and Brit. said such awful things and
Monet egged her on. When Monet left she started
the same nonsense with Ragan and she just never
let up.

Bbpeach
Member

07-07-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 3:23 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Bbpeach a private message Print Post    
Amy & Marcellas talking about Chiara, Alison & Jun talking about Robert (remember how outraged everyone was that they dared talk about his daughter), Diane & Karen talking about the twins, Maggie & gang talking about Janelle, etc., etc. It happens every year. Every year I read how despicable they are. Ragan & Britney are no worse than any of the others. While I haven't watched the feeds a whole lot, for the most part they've made me laugh. Just like Amy & Marcellas continue to be one of my all-time favorite pairs. Some years I like the trash talkers, when it's done w/humor and usually when I think the same things they do. Some years they're bashing on the ones I do like, so I tend to not like the bashers. It's just BB....

Foolscap
Member

09-04-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 4:55 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Foolscap a private message Print Post    
Bbpeach, you sound like the voice of reason to me. I agree with pretty much all you said.

And I don't think envy enters into it at all. Why on earth would anyone be envious of Brendan and Rachel?

The experience of being in the Big Brother house for close to 3 months with no outside contact has got to make one's world very small. It's got to make anyone get more than a little disoriented and strange. Most everyone gets either very catty or very deluded or both. Some handle it better than others, usually the one's who have a good sense of humor and are able to maintain. I imagine many former house guests are quite embarrassed if they look at the footage of themselves.

Don't get me wrong. Over the years I've watched the live feeds, BBAD along with the broadcast show and there's been house guests I really liked and others I despised, but the whole situation is so unreal, I try to give them all a bit of a break. It's one of those games largely based largely on lying and deceit. Like Bbpeach said "It's just BB....

I do have to admit I'm most amazed by the ones who think they're becoming so famous and will have endless opportunities waiting for them when the show's over. Again the ones with a sense of humor and some perspective as to what the show is will most likely come out of it the best.

Guess it goes without saying, this is just my opinion, yours is just as valid.

Nerovh
Member

06-12-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 5:06 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Nerovh a private message Print Post    
I don't think envy had anything to do with it at all. It's funny that people say that Ragan and Britney are the worst bashers ever. I don't remember hearing either one of them telling somebody that they were going to rape him until he bled like ED did. Much rather deal with the bashing than that kind of crap.

Saguaro
Member

06-21-2005

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 5:07 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Saguaro a private message Print Post    
Bbpeach, I've said the same thing so many times. Why everyone seems to act like Britney and Ragan created trash talking or are any worse than previous BB HGs, I have no idea. This goes on every year by a few HGs, it is just BB.

Merrysea
Moderator

08-13-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 5:10 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Merrysea a private message Print Post    
I don't know, I think talking about going to Africa and jabbing babies with AIDS-infected needles is pretty bad.

Ark
Member

07-10-2001

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 5:17 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Ark a private message Print Post    
Bbpeach hit the nail on the head.

Merrysea, I've said that I'd rather chew my own arm off than spend time with someone I don't really care for. I was not serious.

Merrysea
Moderator

08-13-2004

Monday, September 06, 2010 - 5:25 pm   Edit Post Move Post Delete Post View Post Send Merrysea a private message Print Post    
Yes, but chewing your own arm off is an expression of what you would do to yourself; harming babies in another country takes it to a whole 'nother level.